Words-worth, or not?

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merseymouth
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Joined: 23 Jan 2011, 11:16am

Words-worth, or not?

Post by merseymouth »

Morning all, Seems that it is getting harder to write descriptive prose now, at least according to the latest diktat from OFCOM!
One will be pulled up pronto should one pen a line such as -"Karen loved the cold weather, the sheer delight at seeing the snowflakes lying on the ground al around her", " her anticipation regarding that scrumptious bacon & egg sandwich to break her fast was welcoming!"!
"Karen" is a no-no, "snowflake" is a taboo word, then the fat really hits the fire with the word "bacon"!
Less detail to read on the CD cover of the Carpenters, the 3 little pigs will be much safer if bacon is eliminated, very variable future?
My vocabulary would appear to be "Time Expired"? TTFN (If that is still allowed?) MM
Jdsk
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Re: Words-worth, or not?

Post by Jdsk »

Was that gammon rather than bacon?

Thanks

Jonathan
merseymouth
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Re: Words-worth, or not?

Post by merseymouth »

Yes JDSK, Mia Culpa! I often fail to differentiate between different forms of "Pig Meat", but I'd never call a member of H.M. Constabularies a "Pig"! As I stated my vocabulary may well be time-expired?
But the use and mis-use of our language must be a test for us all with its ever changing form, I still think of a "Bambi" as a sweet little deer from the Disney film, certainly not its current usage!
But the current trend to hijack existing words to apply a different meaning is quite trying, even though I try to understand it all.
I've just picked up a small book by Gyles Brandreth,"Have you eaten grandma?", which sums up the situation we find ourselves in, definitely tongue tied!
So "You're Gammon/Bacon", may be an insult, or may simply mean "Your portion of Pig meat"? If people keep rendering our vocabulary down to a very movable feast who will know what is actually sad or indeed mean, verbal in exactitude in operation for certain.
Say what one means and mean what one says! IGICB MM
Jdsk
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Re: Words-worth, or not?

Post by Jdsk »

Thanks

I've only read the Ofcom documents once, but I thought that they might be helpful for anyone who wanted to check.
"Public attitudes towards offensive language on TV and radio":
https://www.ofcom.org.uk/research-and-d ... e-language

Jonathan

PS: That's "mea culpa".
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Mick F
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Re: Words-worth, or not?

Post by Mick F »

What's wrong with the name Karen?
Why not say "snowflake"?
Bacon? I had three rashers of bacon and an egg for breakfast.

Seems utterly daft.
Context is everything.
Mick F. Cornwall
Jdsk
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Re: Words-worth, or not?

Post by Jdsk »

Mick F wrote: 22 Sep 2021, 2:56pm What's wrong with the name Karen?
Why not say "snowflake"?
Bacon? I had three rashers of bacon and an egg for breakfast.

Seems utterly daft.
Context is everything.
As above the term of interest is gammon rather than bacon.

On the other questions I recommend reading the report.

Jonathan
Oldjohnw
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Re: Words-worth, or not?

Post by Oldjohnw »

The report absolutely does not say that the use of the words ‘Karen’ and ‘Snowflake’ in the context illustrated in the opening post is criticised or that you will be pulled up about by diktat. Nor does it suggest that you should not use the word gammon in context.

I have been called a snowflake on these pages.
John
pete75
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Re: Words-worth, or not?

Post by pete75 »

Oldjohnw wrote: 22 Sep 2021, 6:07pm The report absolutely does not say that the use of the words ‘Karen’ and ‘Snowflake’ in the context illustrated in the opening post is criticised or that you will be pulled up about by diktat. Nor does it suggest that you should not use the word gammon in context.

I have been called a snowflake on these pages.
Standard tory description of anyone left of Ken Clarke. They say woke now though.
'Give me my bike, a bit of sunshine - and a stop-off for a lunchtime pint - and I'm a happy man.' - Reg Baker
Stevek76
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Re: Words-worth, or not?

Post by Stevek76 »

merseymouth wrote: 22 Sep 2021, 11:54am Morning all, Seems that it is getting harder to write descriptive prose now, at least according to the latest diktat from OFCOM!

...

My vocabulary would appear to be "Time Expired"? TTFN (If that is still allowed?) MM
I think your choice of news sources is the larger issue here as very little of what you posted bears any accuracy as to the purpose of what ofcom published, what it actually said and how it arrived at the conclusions.
The contents of this post, unless otherwise stated, are opinions of the author and may actually be complete codswallop
Tangled Metal
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Re: Words-worth, or not?

Post by Tangled Metal »

Reminds me of a lecturer at a local, minor University a few decades ago who sent out regular memos to the academics and student facing admin staff about acceptable words and phrases to replace contentious words. She was the PC police and completely self appointed.

One memo decreed that nobody is allowed to call people black, they must be called person of colour. Within a day there had been complaints from black colleagues that they found PoC more problematic than being called black, they all said they preferred black. Some complaints were more forceful saying PoC option was used by racists more than black people. One was a black expert in racial matters.

Anyway the end result was the PC memo writer never wrote another memo about PC phrasing. By all accounts she had a warning and got confronted by a black academic.

Put simply be careful with making diktat about what is acceptable or not. It's quite possible that snowflakes prefer that term than the others they could have been given instead. I once heard of a prominent gammon who was very pleased to be called that.
Oldjohnw
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Re: Words-worth, or not?

Post by Oldjohnw »

I’m afraid that this post reminds me of the annual “news” item we get telling us that saying “Happy Christmas” has been banned. It is simply a complete distortion of the reality.
John
Tangled Metal
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Re: Words-worth, or not?

Post by Tangled Metal »

That's the point really. Imposing language from authority doesn't really work so I think organisations don't really do that. It's often the misguided who try.

Language changes, groups take insults as a badge of honour, others turn good things into bad. Language, especially modern language changes quickly.if OFCOM put out a diktat it wouldn't surprise me that it was kind of a summary of current, modern meaning as a guide. Afterall an insult used or thought of differently can be positive. Woke politics, good or bad?
Oldjohnw
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Re: Words-worth, or not?

Post by Oldjohnw »

But the OP was not using language as insult or changed meaning. He was being mischievous in pretending the use he was making might be challenged. There is not an alternative word for snowflake in this context, or Karen or bacon. He was completely distorting what the report said for goodness knows what motive.
John
Tangled Metal
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Re: Words-worth, or not?

Post by Tangled Metal »

Aaah! Must admit I skim read MM at times. Very understandable some times and at other times a bit too random for me. That thread was very much one of the latter. What's wrong with straight forward language and unambiguous meaning? Or am I just a grumpy northerner?
Oldjohnw
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Re: Words-worth, or not?

Post by Oldjohnw »

Tangled Metal wrote: 23 Sep 2021, 7:11am Aaah! Must admit I skim read MM at times. Very understandable some times and at other times a bit too random for me. That thread was very much one of the latter. What's wrong with straight forward language and unambiguous meaning? Or am I just a grumpy northerner?
:D

There is no way that what he wrote would have been picked up.
Last edited by Oldjohnw on 23 Sep 2021, 8:02am, edited 1 time in total.
John
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