I haven't seen any that do that, have you got an example?
Import duties/VAT Europe to UK.
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Re: Import duties/VAT Europe to UK.
It should be pointed out that in the past when you bought something from Europe the tax was paid into the EU and when we sold something to the EU the sales tax was paid to the EU minus a 10% handling fee and this was a huge part of our contribution to the EU. It was extremely damaging to the UK economy and in addition to our large trade deficit with the EU anyway. If the products had EU tariffs then it worked the same except I believe the handling fee increased to 20% that we could keep. So now both sales taxes and tariffs go to our own exchequer which is massively beneficial to our economy but a bit of a pain to the end consumer and smaller retailers.
I must admit I voted to remain in the EU but later regretted the decision when I had a conversation with a liberal democrat representative online (the party I used to vote for) and he was utterly clueless about our debts and trade deficit and had absolutely no idea how such debts could be paid back while remaining in the EU. I then realised both the Conservatives and Labour at least had some debate about EU membership where as my own party were in some sort of fantasy land.
Anyway more money going to the exchequer means less money borrowed and less debt on our heads except of course the pandemic has skyrocketed public sector debts over the world but when that settles then we should see an improvement but we have left the EU with debts of £1.7 trillion and a huge amount of assets sold and reduced manufacturing etc. The country is in a very damaged state and will take decades to repair outside the EU.
I must admit I voted to remain in the EU but later regretted the decision when I had a conversation with a liberal democrat representative online (the party I used to vote for) and he was utterly clueless about our debts and trade deficit and had absolutely no idea how such debts could be paid back while remaining in the EU. I then realised both the Conservatives and Labour at least had some debate about EU membership where as my own party were in some sort of fantasy land.
Anyway more money going to the exchequer means less money borrowed and less debt on our heads except of course the pandemic has skyrocketed public sector debts over the world but when that settles then we should see an improvement but we have left the EU with debts of £1.7 trillion and a huge amount of assets sold and reduced manufacturing etc. The country is in a very damaged state and will take decades to repair outside the EU.
Re: Import duties/VAT Europe to UK.
Don't like the implication that I'm lying but I can do better than a website - my outboard invoice.
Pos Item Description Unit Price € Order Amount € excl. VAT
1 21208 ME-F3.5MH Outboard Motor, Type: Short 630,21 1,0 630,21
shaft, Weight: 18 kg
2 12 shipping cost for bulky goods 33,95 1,0 33,95
The goods will be shipped after reception of the payment.
Payment of lower amounts will not be validated
Bank transfer to the Postbank Hamburg
IBAN: DE06 2001 0020 0581 9032 07 / BIC: PBNKDEFFXXX
Please precise the invoice number.
VAT-exempt delivery
Subtotal 664,16 VAT 0% 0,00 VAT 0% 0,00 Total EUR excl. VAT 664,16
'Give me my bike, a bit of sunshine - and a stop-off for a lunchtime pint - and I'm a happy man.' - Reg Baker
Re: Import duties/VAT Europe to UK.
Sorry that felt that was the implication, if anything I still think either you or the retailer has made an error, you've said there are German websites not charging VAT on goods over and under the £135 limit, I'm still interested to see them.
I wouldn't have expected that order to have had VAT applied, it's over £135, that's what's supposed to happen.Subtotal 664,16 VAT 0% 0,00 VAT 0% 0,00 Total EUR excl. VAT 664,16
Re: Import duties/VAT Europe to UK.
I bought some binoculars from the same place 67 Euros and the VAT rate was 0%. I bought stuff from SVB, Siebenrock and another I can't remember all with no VAT. Why the hell should a German retailer collect VAT on behalf of a government that hates anything European?PH wrote: ↑3 Oct 2021, 6:04pmSorry that felt that was the implication, if anything I still think either you or the retailer has made an error, you've said there are German websites not charging VAT on goods over and under the £135 limit, I'm still interested to see them.I wouldn't have expected that order to have had VAT applied, it's over £135, that's what's supposed to happen.Subtotal 664,16 VAT 0% 0,00 VAT 0% 0,00 Total EUR excl. VAT 664,16
'Give me my bike, a bit of sunshine - and a stop-off for a lunchtime pint - and I'm a happy man.' - Reg Baker
Re: Import duties/VAT Europe to UK.
Because they're legally obliged to? I can understand why they wouldn't want to, which is the reason many have decided not to supply to the UK.
What I find puzzling is that they'd put themselves in that position, they're liable for the VAT on the items they've sold you whether they've collected it or not.
Re: Import duties/VAT Europe to UK.
You put a great deal of faith in the letter of the law always being followed.
How exactly are HMRC going to enforce such legal obligations on small, niche, overseas sellers? Sue them?
It's easy enough for large marketplaces (eBay, AliExpress etc) as they have UK registrations, hence they've all had to get on board but the small sellers will either refuse to sell here or just send ex VAT and let someone else sort the problem out
So the question remains of what happens with such goods if they actually get picked up at customs, do they just get sent back or does the buyer get the option to pay the vat that should've been collected already.
How exactly are HMRC going to enforce such legal obligations on small, niche, overseas sellers? Sue them?
It's easy enough for large marketplaces (eBay, AliExpress etc) as they have UK registrations, hence they've all had to get on board but the small sellers will either refuse to sell here or just send ex VAT and let someone else sort the problem out
So the question remains of what happens with such goods if they actually get picked up at customs, do they just get sent back or does the buyer get the option to pay the vat that should've been collected already.
The contents of this post, unless otherwise stated, are opinions of the author and may actually be complete codswallop
Re: Import duties/VAT Europe to UK.
I don't, I'm very aware of the errors that can occur.
That's why I asked earlier if Pete thought the errors were intentional or not.
Ask yourself - If you were a retailer and you knew you ought to be collecting VAT, and that if you didn't you might have to pay it, or have your parcel stopped and returned, why you wouldn't?
Maybe in the short term you might be relatively confident that they'd get through unchecked, but that isn't going to last, the appropriate declaration label will be bar coded and carriers won't want the hassle of returns so are unlikely to accept any that aren't.
The intention of the EU regulation is that the responsibility for consignments under 150 Euro remain solely with the retailer, as far as I'm aware the UK hasn't deviated from that. So yes, it should either be sorted by them or returned to them, but if past experience is anything to go on it's more likely to gather dust in some distribution centre till eventually being disposed of. There were some stories in Jan of carriers trying to collect unpaid VAT from the end customer, they shouldn't be doing so, there's no process for that (I think they carried over the old system) and I haven't heard any such stories recently. If that did happen to anyone they'd be entitled to reject it, or pay and reclaim, the retailers would not only be liable for the VAT, but there's also set penalties.So the question remains of what happens with such goods if they actually get picked up at customs, do they just get sent back or does the buyer get the option to pay the vat that should've been collected already.
I'm currently doing some temp work for a logistics company that's acting as an Import Agent for several large EU companies, using a permitted system of Postponed VAT, it's primarily a way of supplying UK customers with consignment over £135 without them having to deal with the VAT and import duty themselves, but it's going to include lower value as well.
Just to confuse matters further, there's also the VAT on Gifts, that's payable by the end customer on anything over £39 and as an import tax it also applies to the shipping charge.
I don't think anyone is disputing how unprepared the UK was on Jan 1, it's getting better, though obviously has a long way to go. IMO understanding how it's supposed to work is important in getting there and too often people let their political views get in the way of that.
Re: Import duties/VAT Europe to UK.
UK law doesn't apply in Germany.PH wrote: ↑3 Oct 2021, 8:14pmBecause they're legally obliged to? I can understand why they wouldn't want to, which is the reason many have decided not to supply to the UK.
What I find puzzling is that they'd put themselves in that position, they're liable for the VAT on the items they've sold you whether they've collected it or not.
'Give me my bike, a bit of sunshine - and a stop-off for a lunchtime pint - and I'm a happy man.' - Reg Baker
Re: Import duties/VAT Europe to UK.
I've decided not to continue this, it has nothing to do with the original question, to which the answer remains no.pete75 wrote: ↑4 Oct 2021, 3:00amUK law doesn't apply in Germany.PH wrote: ↑3 Oct 2021, 8:14pmBecause they're legally obliged to? I can understand why they wouldn't want to, which is the reason many have decided not to supply to the UK.
What I find puzzling is that they'd put themselves in that position, they're liable for the VAT on the items they've sold you whether they've collected it or not.
If anyone wants to understand why an exporter has to comply with the regulations set out by the recipient company, what laws control that and who enforces them, the WTO would be a good starting point, before looking into the reciprocal agreements.
If anyone finds some error in anything I've written on this thread, I'll be happy to correct it.
- NATURAL ANKLING
- Posts: 13780
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Re: Import duties/VAT Europe to UK.
Hi,&
So my goods came to less than £39 (I made offer to make sure of that) but I was still charged VAT?
Can you expand more on why do you have to pay VAT at the retail end On gifts? (39-135 £)
And why did I pay VAT on something less than £39 as it's less than €39 (I'm assuming the euro is still worth less than a pound)?
https://www.gov.uk/goods-sent-from-abroad/tax-and-duty
"You will not have to pay anything to the delivery company to receive goods worth less than £135 unless they’re gifts over £39 or excise goods (for example, alcohol and tobacco).
VAT
VAT is charged on all goods (except for gifts worth £39 or less) sent from:
outside the UK to Great Britain
outside the UK and the EU to Northern Ireland
VAT is not charged on goods that are gifts worth £39 or less.
You pay VAT when you buy the goods or to the delivery company before you receive them. If you have to pay VAT to the delivery company, it’s charged on the total package value, including:
the value of the goods
postage, packaging and insurance
any duty you owe
VAT is charged at the VAT rate that applies to your goods."
P.S. I'm probably thinking that my parcel wasn't classified as a gift that's why VAT was applied At under £39?
Do eBay rate goods or gifts when applying VAT?
TIA
In my bill up post I paid VAT which was collected by eBay I presume?PH wrote: ↑3 Oct 2021, 10:07pm
I'm currently doing some temp work for a logistics company that's acting as an Import Agent for several large EU companies, using a permitted system of Postponed VAT, it's primarily a way of supplying UK customers with consignment over £135 without them having to deal with the VAT and import duty themselves, but it's going to include lower value as well.
Just to confuse matters further, there's also the VAT on Gifts, that's payable by the end customer on anything over £39 and as an import tax it also applies to the shipping charge.
I don't think anyone is disputing how unprepared the UK was on Jan 1, it's getting better, though obviously has a long way to go. IMO understanding how it's supposed to work is important in getting there and too often people let their political views get in the way of that.
So my goods came to less than £39 (I made offer to make sure of that) but I was still charged VAT?
Can you expand more on why do you have to pay VAT at the retail end On gifts? (39-135 £)
And why did I pay VAT on something less than £39 as it's less than €39 (I'm assuming the euro is still worth less than a pound)?
https://www.gov.uk/goods-sent-from-abroad/tax-and-duty
"You will not have to pay anything to the delivery company to receive goods worth less than £135 unless they’re gifts over £39 or excise goods (for example, alcohol and tobacco).
VAT
VAT is charged on all goods (except for gifts worth £39 or less) sent from:
outside the UK to Great Britain
outside the UK and the EU to Northern Ireland
VAT is not charged on goods that are gifts worth £39 or less.
You pay VAT when you buy the goods or to the delivery company before you receive them. If you have to pay VAT to the delivery company, it’s charged on the total package value, including:
the value of the goods
postage, packaging and insurance
any duty you owe
VAT is charged at the VAT rate that applies to your goods."
P.S. I'm probably thinking that my parcel wasn't classified as a gift that's why VAT was applied At under £39?
Do eBay rate goods or gifts when applying VAT?
TIA
NA Thinks Just End 2 End Return + Bivvy - Some day Soon I hope
You'll Still Find Me At The Top Of A Hill
Please forgive the poor Grammar I blame it on my mobile and phat thinkers.
You'll Still Find Me At The Top Of A Hill
Please forgive the poor Grammar I blame it on my mobile and phat thinkers.
Re: Import duties/VAT Europe to UK.
The rules for gifts and purchases are different, they were before Brexit for items outside the EU, I don't know why, maybe to stop fraud.NATURAL ANKLING wrote: ↑4 Oct 2021, 10:57am Can you expand more on why do you have to pay VAT at the retail end On gifts? (39-135 £)
And why did I pay VAT on something less than £39 as it's less than €39 (I'm assuming the euro is still worth less than a pound)?
There's no lower limit for VAT on purchases (It used to be £15) there's no VAT on gifts under £39, the VAT on gifts is the responsibility of the recipient rather than the sender, which can also incur handling fees. In both cases other import duties don't apply to consignments under £135. (Unless it's excise duty)
There's a Which guide which I think is the clearest, it points out, for gifts:
https://www.which.co.uk/consumer-rights ... rom-the-ukIn some instances the rules mean you could end up paying more in delivery charges and customs fees then you might have if you ordered the item yourself online.
Ebay are deemed to be the seller, so it's goods not gifts.Do eBay rate goods or gifts when applying VAT?
viewtopic.php?p=1643277#p1643277
- NATURAL ANKLING
- Posts: 13780
- Joined: 24 Oct 2012, 10:43pm
- Location: English Riviera
Re: Import duties/VAT Europe to UK.
NA Thinks Just End 2 End Return + Bivvy - Some day Soon I hope
You'll Still Find Me At The Top Of A Hill
Please forgive the poor Grammar I blame it on my mobile and phat thinkers.
You'll Still Find Me At The Top Of A Hill
Please forgive the poor Grammar I blame it on my mobile and phat thinkers.
- NATURAL ANKLING
- Posts: 13780
- Joined: 24 Oct 2012, 10:43pm
- Location: English Riviera
Re: Import duties/VAT Europe to UK.
Hi,
Thanks for pointing out that question had been answered already
Just for awhile I thought I'd go on eBay chat basically confirmed, But they are unsure about secondhand stuff?
Not sure but I saw in the help "margin" rated VAT goods? But of course this means nothing because eBay applies VAT to everything normally.
Customer pays VAT in full.
Thanks for pointing out that question had been answered already
Just for awhile I thought I'd go on eBay chat basically confirmed, But they are unsure about secondhand stuff?
Not sure but I saw in the help "margin" rated VAT goods? But of course this means nothing because eBay applies VAT to everything normally.
Customer pays VAT in full.
NA Thinks Just End 2 End Return + Bivvy - Some day Soon I hope
You'll Still Find Me At The Top Of A Hill
Please forgive the poor Grammar I blame it on my mobile and phat thinkers.
You'll Still Find Me At The Top Of A Hill
Please forgive the poor Grammar I blame it on my mobile and phat thinkers.
Re: Import duties/VAT Europe to UK.
You may well be correct in theory. What happens in reality is somewhat different.PH wrote: ↑4 Oct 2021, 9:30amI've decided not to continue this, it has nothing to do with the original question, to which the answer remains no.pete75 wrote: ↑4 Oct 2021, 3:00amUK law doesn't apply in Germany.PH wrote: ↑3 Oct 2021, 8:14pm
Because they're legally obliged to? I can understand why they wouldn't want to, which is the reason many have decided not to supply to the UK.
What I find puzzling is that they'd put themselves in that position, they're liable for the VAT on the items they've sold you whether they've collected it or not.
If anyone wants to understand why an exporter has to comply with the regulations set out by the recipient company, what laws control that and who enforces them, the WTO would be a good starting point, before looking into the reciprocal agreements.
If anyone finds some error in anything I've written on this thread, I'll be happy to correct it.
'Give me my bike, a bit of sunshine - and a stop-off for a lunchtime pint - and I'm a happy man.' - Reg Baker