American spelling unsafe at any speed

[Dan K]

...I find too much emphasis on spelling off putting... As a Union rep' I once had to take a dictated message to type up (With one finger!) and hand out copies in a strike meeting. Having flogged myself to get it ready in short time available, one pedant took it from me and within seconds announced that I'd spelt immediately with one 'M'. The fact that we were meeting to vote on an offer was unimportant to this person compared to one misspelt word. My reply would have been terribly rude if she hadn't been howled down by the rest of the meeting...

You're in good company byegad. Think I've posted the following before, it's lifted from The Black Swan:

Henry Poincare, was a great scientific thinker. Many claim that Poincare figured out relativity before Einstein - and that Einstein got the idea from him - but that he did not make a big deal out of it. Einstein’s biographer Abraham Paris appears to validate this. Poincare was too aristocratic in both background and demeanour to complain about the ownership of a result.

Prolific in his work, Poincare seemed in a hurry, as if sensing he would die prematurely at 58; he was in such a rush that he did not bother correcting typos and grammatical errors in his text, even after spotting them, since he found doing so a gross misuse of his time. They no longer make geniuses like that - or they no longer let them write in their own way.

[thirdcrank]

Recycling in the interests of saving the planet, or something like that, here's one of my old posts about 'immediately.'

When I was small, my dear old dad used to have me chanting the spelling of words he felt were important but difficult to spell. One was 'immediately.' In Bamburgh, Northumberland, there is a small museum, run by the Royal National Lifeboat Institution, dedicated to Grace Darling. One exhibit is her father's short, hand-written report on the famous rescue. He knew that if he launched his boat, they would be unable to return to safety unless there were additional men on the oars. He kept careful watch through his telescope and on seeing signs of life, "Amediately (sic) launched the boat." Spelling is all very important but in the right place. I just thought a rambling anecdote was more interesting than the topic.

When you need help in a hurry, you want somebody who knows the meaning of the word, not how to spell it.

[Mick F]

Also, you need to speak clearly.

I remember a lecture I attended during my apprenticeship about radio communications, and how it was important to be clear and concise.

The message was given:
"Send reinforcements. We are going to advance."

It was received as:
"Send three and fourpence. We are going to a dance."

[gaz]

Anyone else remember "Me ears are alight"?

[Edwards]

Thanks for that Gaz after yesterday a DD works wonders.

One the first page I made a comment. Some might have thought it seemed flippant, some stupid.

Can anyone remember the message.

How observant are you?

[gaz]

Sorry Edwards, I missed your comment first time round so I'll mark myself down as unobservant. Having gone back for another look I'd have to agree.

[thirdcrank]

Anyone else remember "Me ears are alight"?

I remember a similar one "I believe in Milko."

And plenty more besides.

[Edwards]

The original post had 2 deliberate mistakes.
"Why should was change we was ere first"

I am sure a lot of people understood the context even if the words were wrong. It is highly likely that the brain just took out the mistakes and made sense of it.

The second post was the misuse of the word message. This word has started to be used in the context I used it. By shall we say younger persons.

The part about observation was put in knowing that anybody who remembered the first post would then be trying to think of what could have been written.

The final part was how long and who would admit to not knowing the answer.

It was all about communication and how the use of our language has changed. Sometimes the spelling of the word is not important it is the communication.

Interestingly nobody asked just was being asked.

Thanks TC for telling me how to get the Google spell check, my spelling is atrocious.

[Vorpal]

The original post had 2 deliberate mistakes.
"Why should was change we was ere first"

I see three mistakes. Was one of them not deliberate?

[Jonty]

whether no not they have evolved from a French, germanic or latinate origin in the way in which they are spelt.

my understanding is that the only words we use that originated in latin, have been brought over by the french 900 years ago. before that, latin had long fallen out of use in these islands.

Not so. The majority do derive from Norman French but there are others derived from other Romance languages such as Italian, (particularly in the fine Arts and music).
Also there are many modern scientific words which draw upon Latin and Greek.
Also Latin did not fall completely out of use. Learned people spoke and wrote Latin as did ecclesiastics. Many educated people up to the nineteenth century could travel on the Continent and converse easily with other Latin speakers.
jonty

[meic]

You are forgetting all the words that you knicked of us.

However they are (almost) all spelt efficiently and phonetically in the first place.

[kwackers]

You are forgetting all the words that you knicked of us.

However they are (almost) all spelt efficiently and phonetically in the first place.

Behave, nobody in their right mind would steal a Welsh word, we just don't have the space!

[cyclingthelakes]

A different spin here is something I read in a foreword of a book from Canada I can cite. Anyway, I'll keep this short, basically the author of the foreword said some words in Canadian English have a French Canadian influence. I don't quite agree with this however I do think there are some English words and I am not meaning ones directly borrowed like say Rendezvous that could sound French influenced.

Programmes

Colour to an extent. Labour, I believe that is the same word.

So that is a twist to this subject matter.

In Brittany, your average type of bloke is a 'plouc', an interesting turn in words.

This below address this some:

my understanding is that the only words we use that originated in latin, have been brought over by the french 900 years ago. before that, latin had long fallen out of use in these islands.

Not so. The majority do derive from Norman French but there are others derived from other Romance languages such as Italian, (particularly in the fine Arts and music).
Also there are many modern scientific words which draw upon Latin and Greek.
Also Latin did not fall completely out of use. Learned people spoke and wrote Latin as did ecclesiastics. Many educated people up to the nineteenth century could travel on the Continent and converse easily with other Latin speakers.- Jonty

[Dan K]

whether no not they have evolved from a French, germanic or latinate origin in the way in which they are spelt.

...The majority do derive from Norman French but there are others derived from other Romance languages such as Italian, (particularly in the fine Arts and music)...

It's interesting how a few posts have touched on the Norman influence on the English language. Incidentally I read somewhere that the Oxford English dictionary (mines a Collins so can't confirm) states the rather than invent it's own words the English language can be traced back to influences from 80+ languages! I'm old enough to remember 'macho' being lifted from the Latin Americans during the 1970's to become another addition to the English language. Anyway - back to the Normans. The recent Norman documentary series (BBC?) highlighted some interesting influences as a result of the Norman conquests on the English language. As best as I can remember it said the conquering Normans ensured that the English version for a word was the uncouth version whilst their French was the more desirable, hence:

Cattle for the Normans became beef.
Whilst pig or swine was good enough for the English - for the Normans it was always pork.
And flowers on a table became a bloom when in a Norman household.
For the Normans it was odour, aroma or scent where the English had only smell or stench.

I've just briefly tried to Google for a list of the dual Norman 'snobbery' meanings for a lot of English words (which today helps those learning English as there's always another word that means almost the same thing), but at the risk of turning this thread all Stephen Fry-like, couldn't find those elusive lists.

Wonder why we never adopted 'merde' - do we like sh**?

[Nutsey]

Its my understanding that there is no 'proper' English. Its an evolving language whereby whatever is said by the masses, and their spelling, becomes the official word once it has been said often enough by enough people. The dictionary people then whack it in the book. So if we keep saying 'nucular' enough then that is English.

I use whatever the spellchecker wants, so often american. I don't lose any sleep over it, and it often looks better anyway. All my textbooks would have words like 'maximize' in them, and it looks like it sounds, so thats my choice of spelling.

I draw the line at Freedom Fries, unless in the company of a Frenchman.