Illiteracy in the media

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thirdcrank
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Re: Illiteracy in the media

Postby thirdcrank » 31 Dec 2010, 4:19pm

While I was having a very pleasant lunch in a local boozer (The Greyhound at Tong, one of the few places to feature in the thirdcrank Good Pub Guide) I noticed that Manchester Tart was on the menu blackboard. (No sniggering at the back, please.) I'm no expert on these things - Bakewell being the only one I could identify with any confidence - but my wife correctly described it and had a portion to prove it. As usual, I had to help finish it and very nice it was, which leads me to remark that I had not expected they would grow coconuts in Manchester.

http://maps.google.co.uk/maps?f=q&sourc ... 46.65,,0,5

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Mick F
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Re: Illiteracy in the media

Postby Mick F » 31 Dec 2010, 4:28pm

Wiki wrote:The Manchester tart is a traditional English baked tart, which consists of a shortcrust pastry shell, spread with raspberry jam, covered with a custard filling and topped with flakes of coconut and a Maraschino cherry. One variation of the original recipe includes slices of banana underneath the custard with the jam.

A staple on school dinner menus until the mid 1980s, the original Manchester Tart is a variation on an earlier recipe, the Manchester Pudding, which was first recorded by the Victorian cookery writer, Mrs Beeton.
I remember them from school.

Mrs Mick F has just said, "Yes, I remember them, they were horrible!"
(She doesn't like custard)
Mick F. Cornwall

Jonty

Re: Illiteracy in the media

Postby Jonty » 31 Dec 2010, 4:41pm

Why watch 22 men playing with a kiddies' beach toy and pay £40 for the privilege when you could be out in the fresh air on your bike?
Manchester City Hall is most impressive.
Also what about the velodrome?
jonty

thirdcrank
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Re: Illiteracy in the media

Postby thirdcrank » 31 Dec 2010, 5:06pm

Mick F wrote:
Wiki wrote:... One variation of the original recipe includes slices of banana underneath the custard with the jam. ....


I was on the point of querying whether they grew bananas and coconuts in Manchester, then I realised it was just flaunting the city's importance to world trade in Mrs Beaton's days. :wink:

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Mrs Tortoise
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Re: Illiteracy in the media

Postby Mrs Tortoise » 31 Dec 2010, 10:17pm

Goodness, when I started this I had no idea it would go on and on. As a half Scots Welsh woman who resides in England, I think I can say I'm British (unless Wales are playing). I believe the term British related to the Romano-British, who were the ancestors of the Welsh and Cornish. It was reintroduced after the Hanoverians to try and calm things down in Scotland after the Stuarts were forced to leave and the various attempts to reinstate them by the Jacobites. In reality, it's about as authentic as the tartans are to Scotland, though we cling to our cultural prejudices to validate ourselves.

At the end of the day, we're all hybrids as we'd find out if we were able to trace our family histories and we all have our blind spots in literacy and numeracy. My original gripe was the slipshod way that much of the media is thrown together today and wasn't intended to insult any who may feel less than comfortable with written English: however, journalists should surely take more care when writing or do they have no pride in their profession these days? (I do wonder when I read the corrections editor in the Grauniad).

Thanks to all who contributed and expanded this theme, I wish you all a Happy 2011 and safe cycling - Blwyddyn Newydd Dda.

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Mick F
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Re: Illiteracy in the media

Postby Mick F » 1 Jan 2011, 11:10am

Lowen Nowydh Blydhen to you too!
Mick F. Cornwall

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meic
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Re: Illiteracy in the media

Postby meic » 1 Jan 2011, 10:04pm

Your spell checker didnt help much there, did it? :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

Blwdi drwnc, ai recwn.
Yma o Hyd

Jonty

Re: Illiteracy in the media

Postby Jonty » 2 Jan 2011, 12:07am

Does Welsh really have words without vowels? Why are there so many words with dh?
By the way, is it true that Welsh speakers cannot understand Scots and Irish Gaelic?
jonty

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meic
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Re: Illiteracy in the media

Postby meic » 2 Jan 2011, 12:57am

No they all have vowels in them (but not as you know them).
A Welsh word with dh in? My mind fails me I cant think of any right now.

I am sure some Welsh speakers can understand Irish and Scottish Gaellic but they had to learn it separately :wink: .
Yma o Hyd

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Mick F
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Re: Illiteracy in the media

Postby Mick F » 2 Jan 2011, 10:37am

There's much similarity with Welsh and Cornish. Dunno about Gaelic or Irish or Celtic or Scots, but Breton is similar to Cornish.

Big Sis lives in Wrexham, not far from where I was born. She takes Welsh lessons, and Mrs Mick F took Cornish lessons some time back but gave up as it was too difficult. She still has her dictionary and notes.

Spell check in Firefox has a terrible trouble with Cornish! :D

Try this:
http://www.cornish-language.org/English/Dictionary.asp
Mick F. Cornwall

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meic
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Re: Illiteracy in the media

Postby meic » 2 Jan 2011, 11:09am

Apologies Mick F. I thought you were trying to type in Welsh after a few pints. :oops:

Cornish is obviously pretty damn close to Welsh. The Breton seems much less similar but when you are shown which bits of Breton equate to their Welsh equivalent it becomes much more familiar.
Yma o Hyd

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Mick F
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Re: Illiteracy in the media

Postby Mick F » 2 Jan 2011, 11:22am

meic wrote:Apologies Mick F. I thought you were trying to type in Welsh after a few pints. :oops:
:D
I can count to five in Welsh, but that's about it - despite being born in Wales!
Mick F. Cornwall

Jonty

Re: Illiteracy in the media

Postby Jonty » 2 Jan 2011, 2:10pm

Does anyone know if a Gaelic Scots speaker can understand a Gaelic Irish speaker?
I expect that they should be able to understand each other as Gaelic was brought to what is now called Scotland from what is now called Ireland.
jonty

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georgew
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Re: Illiteracy in the media

Postby georgew » 2 Jan 2011, 3:38pm

My father-in-law, who was an Irish Gaelic speaker, found that he was easily able to understand Scottish Gaelic. Even though there were some differences these were minor and not an impediment to communication.

thirdcrank
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Re: Illiteracy in the media

Postby thirdcrank » 10 Jan 2011, 9:26am

bodach wrote:....There cannot be a QE2 in Scotland as we never had a QE1 in the past. ....


For many years, all Cunard liners had a name ending -ia. It used to be one of those things that all schoolboys knew, that the first break with that tradition was the Queen Mary. The story was supposed to be that the big boss at Cunard went to see George V asking for permission to name the new liner Queen Victoria. Instead of coming straight to the point, he waffled on about a much-loved queen and Geo announced "I'll tell her Majesty. I'm sure she'll be very pleased." So the ship was named for his wife, Queen Mary of Teck. (Nothing to do with the thread on grade inflation :wink: )

The next big Cunard liner was launched in 1938 and was named Queen Elizabeth in honour of the then Queen Elizabeth, wife of Gerorge VI. The eventual replacement was called Queen Elizabeth 2, not Queen Elizabeth II. ie the '2' indicates that this ship was the second ship named Queen Elizabeth, rather than being named for Queen Eilizabeth II.

I thought of this rag-bag of useless info when I was reading something about the Queen Mary 2 yesterday. Strangely enough, there was no booing at the launch of this ship, even though the work force's last Queen Mary (or rather Reine Marie) was the reviled Marie Antoinette and in France ships are masculine.