Low-life bulbs

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TonyR
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Re: Low-life bulbs

Postby TonyR » 17 May 2013, 8:18pm

661-Pete wrote:Yep - bring on the LEDs but also educate people about not leaving lights on - pleeeeease!!!
It can't be by accident that car and cycle lights have skipped the CFL technology entirely and gone straight to LEDs.
But I emphasise the word NOW. LEDs are still a bit pricey and not commonly found for household lighting. But the future maybe.


There are smart LEDs now that will trickle down into general use and affordability over time. They sense light levels, the presence of people etc and decide for themselves whether they need to be on or not. LEDs are a bit more pricey but they are now commonly found. You can buy them in Tescos and B&Q for example. But, as with most things these days, you'll get a better choice and pricing if you buy them from one of the on-line specialists.

Car and cycle lights skipped CFLs for the very good reason that you cannot produce a directed beam from them in something of any sensible size. That doesn't matter for room lights where you want it to bounce off the walls to create even illumination but it doesn't work for cars and bikes.

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Audax67
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Re: Low-life bulbs

Postby Audax67 » 17 May 2013, 9:35pm

It is now illegal to import conventional incandescent bulbs to France. You can still get halogen bulbs tailored to ordinary fittings, but the economy is only something like 10%.

MarkF said that he liked the light of incandescents. He's not alone. The light from CFLs and more especially LEDs contains a much higher proportion of blue, bringing it closer to daytime light. Blue light promotes wakefulness, and is much less relaxing of an evening than the yellow light of incandescents. At the same time as they are ham-fistedly trying to save energy, our masters are diminishing the quality of our sleep.
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kwackers
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Re: Low-life bulbs

Postby kwackers » 17 May 2013, 9:48pm

Audax67 wrote:our masters are diminishing the quality of our sleep.

Not sure how that works...
I don't sleep with the lights on nor do I need to spend the evening preparing! Sometimes I go out for a run late evening and hop straight into bed - sleep like a log!
(Perhaps it's the yellow street lights... :lol: )

TonyR
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Re: Low-life bulbs

Postby TonyR » 17 May 2013, 9:48pm

Audax67 wrote:The light from CFLs and more especially LEDs contains a much higher proportion of blue, bringing it closer to daytime light. Blue light promotes wakefulness, and is much less relaxing of an evening than the yellow light of incandescents. At the same time as they are ham-fistedly trying to save energy, our masters are diminishing the quality of our sleep.


Depends which LEDs you buy. They come in a variety varying from daylight to incandescent light equivalents and some are variable to suit your mood of the moment.

TonyR
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Re: Low-life bulbs

Postby TonyR » 17 May 2013, 9:50pm

kwackers wrote:
Audax67 wrote:our masters are diminishing the quality of our sleep.

Not sure how that works...


Kwackers lies awake at night worrying about it :wink:

kwackers
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Re: Low-life bulbs

Postby kwackers » 17 May 2013, 9:58pm

TonyR wrote:
kwackers wrote:
Audax67 wrote:our masters are diminishing the quality of our sleep.

Not sure how that works...


Kwackers lies awake at night worrying about it :wink:

Nope - as mentioned I sleep like a log having never thought about it...
Perhaps from now on I'll spend my time worrying whether my LED lights will keep me awake...

kwackers
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Re: Low-life bulbs

Postby kwackers » 17 May 2013, 9:59pm

TonyR wrote:
Audax67 wrote:The light from CFLs and more especially LEDs contains a much higher proportion of blue, bringing it closer to daytime light. Blue light promotes wakefulness, and is much less relaxing of an evening than the yellow light of incandescents. At the same time as they are ham-fistedly trying to save energy, our masters are diminishing the quality of our sleep.


Depends which LEDs you buy. They come in a variety varying from daylight to incandescent light equivalents and some are variable to suit your mood of the moment.

Not to mention you can buy RGB bulbs with remote controls and dial in and tweak them to be just the right shade for sleepy byes...
(I'm presuming that's what you meant by 'variable'?)

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7_lives_left
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Re: Low-life bulbs

Postby 7_lives_left » 18 May 2013, 12:32am

TonyR wrote:
661-Pete wrote:I have lots of gripes about the CFLs but unfortunately we now have to live with the things.


Actually not. LEDs [snip] don't contain any mercury [snip]


No mercury, but they do have arsenic instead. I'm not sure if they need special disposal or not.

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danfoto
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Re: Low-life bulbs

Postby danfoto » 18 May 2013, 6:40am

7_lives_left wrote:No mercury, but they do have arsenic instead.


Not so. The red ones may contain gallium arsenide phosphide, but that is not arsenic.
A positive attitude may not solve all your problems, but it will annoy enough people to make it worth the effort.

TonyR
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Re: Low-life bulbs

Postby TonyR » 18 May 2013, 6:45am

7_lives_left wrote:
TonyR wrote:
661-Pete wrote:I have lots of gripes about the CFLs but unfortunately we now have to live with the things.


Actually not. LEDs [snip] don't contain any mercury [snip]


No mercury, but they do have arsenic instead. I'm not sure if they need special disposal or not.


Mostly not. Most white LEDs are Gallium Nitride not Gallium Arsenide. Only the lamps which combine red, green and blue LEDs to generate white light have any arsenic but even then its in the form of Gallium Arsenide, not free arsenic. Arsenic is present in small quantities naturally in us and all the food we eat and water we drink. And equating Gallium Arsenide to Arsenic is like equating Sodium Chloride (salt) to Sodium and Chlorine neither of which is a nice element to be exposed to.

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Mick F
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Re: Low-life bulbs

Postby Mick F » 18 May 2013, 9:30am

We have most of our lighting as non-incandescent. Strip lights in the kitchen and workshop, they obviously flicker into life.

The "modern" lights we have vary a little. Some of them are at full light immediately but some need a few minutes. I often wonder what makes the difference between them.
Mick F. Cornwall

TonyR
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Re: Low-life bulbs

Postby TonyR » 18 May 2013, 9:49am

Mick F wrote:We have most of our lighting as non-incandescent. Strip lights in the kitchen and workshop, they obviously flicker into life.


Try replacing the starter coils in them. They are not expensive but as they age they do tend to lead to flicker starts until eventually all they do is flicker and not start.

rand
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Re: Low-life bulbs

Postby rand » 18 May 2013, 10:04am

TonyR wrote:You clearly haven't been paying your dues to the Illuminati...

Seriously though, if they are going that quickly something is wrong. If one of those went on me after two months I would be taking it back to the shop for a replacement. The ones we have not only consume a tenth of the electrickery, they turn on quickly and have lasted quite a few years so far whereas their incandescent predecessors were always needing to be replaced. Gone over to LED bulbs now which are even better and can (some of them) be dimmed.


I'm interested in LEDs for domestic use.
Do you have a preferred brand/supplier?

Rand.

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danfoto
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Re: Low-life bulbs

Postby danfoto » 18 May 2013, 11:03am

Mick F wrote:Strip lights in the kitchen and workshop, they obviously flicker into life.


If they do that, replace your ancient starters with electronic ones to get 3-4 times longer tube life (if it's a tube which is switched on and off a lot) and flicker-free starts. We've been using them for about 15 years and still haven't known one fail.
A positive attitude may not solve all your problems, but it will annoy enough people to make it worth the effort.

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661-Pete
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Re: Low-life bulbs

Postby 661-Pete » 18 May 2013, 11:10am

TonyR wrote:And equating Gallium Arsenide to Arsenic is like equating Sodium Chloride (salt) to Sodium and Chlorine neither of which is a nice element to be exposed to.
The amount of GaAs you might get in a LED is almost negligible: moreover LED lights (unlike CFLs) are unlikely to break and so present this hazard. However, arsenic is a cumulative poison (unlike sodium and chlorine which are both essential dietary inputs). So any arsenic compound - if it is at all soluble in digestive fluids and hence retained in the body - presents a hazard. I believe GaAs is not very soluble, but I wouldn't eat it!

But all our hi-tech stuff: computers etc., as well as a lot of our domestic appliances, are already loaded up with LEDs. Not to mention most cycle lamps nowadays. People don't think of them as a risk. Certainly when cycling, the risk of not being seen because of a failed filament lamp is far greater...

It's just for lighting the house that I don't think they're the right choice, yet.
Suppose that this room is a lift. The support breaks and down we go with ever-increasing velocity.
Let us pass the time by performing physical experiments...
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