TV licensing...

[thirdcrank]

I think it's fair to say that there was a time when the BBC was held in the same sort of esteem as the NHS, perhaps with a vague feeling that it looked after our minds in the same way that the health service looked after our bodies. In those days, not having a licence was a form of freeloading, on a par with fiddling the NHS.

The parallel now with the NHS is that the top dogs pocket megabucks in both organisations, but the foot soldiers in the NHS still have our respect.

[Graham]

If they come round to try and check, this procedure will be repeated bi-annually I have no doubt. Hopefully a personal letter to Jackie Garswood will put a stop to it.

We'll see.

Yes, BBC have got their fingers burnt.

We have a Netflix account, and I think that's the way forward for BBC. We have the cheapest account, and we can watch 24/7 but only on one device at a time. Our daughter has a more expensive account with them, but she has her's so she can watch on four devices at once. We pay £5.99 a month and can cancel any time we want.
https://www.netflix.com/signup/planform

By not playing along with TVL, you MAY focus additional attention upon yourself.

How this manifests itself ( or not ) will be interesting to see.

Also interesting to see that you have found something worth paying for on Netflix . . . which I had previously thought was just some sort of pesticide !

[mercalia]

All good info guys!
Thank you.

I'm minded to ignore the letters until they get threatening, then I'll be writing to Jackie Garswood personally asking her to stop writing.

If they come round to our little bungalow to see our equipment, I don't believe they'll be able to ascertain anything other than our verbal assurance that we don't need a TVL because we don't watch anything that requires a TVL. As I said, we don't have a telly, but we do have modern devices all connected to the internet so we actually could watch live broadcasts if we wanted .......... but we don't.

How can we prove this?
Do WE have to prove anything?
Is the burden of proof on THEM and not us?

If they come round to try and check, this procedure will be repeated bi-annually I have no doubt. Hopefully a personal letter to Jackie Garswood will put a stop to it.

We'll see.

Yes, BBC have got their fingers burnt.

We have a Netflix account, and I think that's the way forward for BBC. We have the cheapest account, and we can watch 24/7 but only on one device at a time. Our daughter has a more expensive account with them, but she has her's so she can watch on four devices at once. We pay £5.99 a month and can cancel any time we want.
https://www.netflix.com/signup/planform

wont work: I sent a cease and desist letter (pending threatening legal action ) and they replied they are obliged by law to do what they are doing.
if you ever do write them a letter tell them in future you will only reply to their queries if they supply an SAE, and keep a copy of the letter sent.
The problem with their agents is whether they have any scruples or will they fabricate evidence - remember it is CAPITA.

[NATURAL ANKLING]

Hi,
You ISP can supply info on what and where you have been / downloaded.
If you watch live TV / Iplayer / anything via ISP.

But if you only watch catch up you don't need a licence?........Unless its Iplayer?

On my TV recorder it runs continuously in several hours of rewind on whatever station you are watching, ideal to replay some detail you missed / did not understand / trips to loo / kettle time.
So in theory it does not display real time but all via the harddisk?

Maybe their is a loop hole that BBC has closed here or I misunderstand?

How live is TV anyway..................live is automatic transmitter signal viewing via a decoder?

[Mick F]

Also interesting to see that you have found something worth paying for on Netflix . . . which I had previously thought was just some sort of pesticide !

Initially, we finished the last two series of Benidorm. We bought a boxed set of the first few series and caught the next one on YouTube.

We're working our way through Red Dwarf now. We had many of them recorded on Betamax!

Next will be a movie or two, maybe more, but some of the ones we want aren't on there. We could catch later series of Only Fools as we have a boxed set of the first two or three series.

You get your first month free, and can cancel at any time. We may get bored with it of course.

Netfix is highly recommended in our opinion - for now at least.
It's a model that BBC could easily emulate and would negate the use of the anachronistic TVL.

[Psamathe]

.....
Netfix is highly recommended in our opinion - for now at least.
.....

A lot comes down to taste in viewing. I periodically look at what Netflix are showing and struggle to find anything I'd spend my time watching. Certainly that have shown some good stuff that I would watch but for me it's cheaper to buy the DVD set (currently working through The Expanse).

Similarly with Amazon Prime - never give money to a station that has chosen to pay Clarkson vast sums of money.

.....
It's a model that BBC could easily emulate and would negate the use of the anachronistic TVL.

I agree that it is certainly a model the BBC could follow.

The trouble is that with so many subscription "systems" Netflix, Amazon, BBC, Sky, Virgin, BT, etc. to watch the programs you want to watch you could end-up with a vast subscription bill as each subscription channel might have a few things you wnat to watch so it becomes subscribe or miss.

I wonder if in the longer term things might move more to a "Pay-per-view". At least I think pay-per-view would be in the viewers best interests though so much seems to be moving to an "all you can eat" subscription (more in the interests of the broadcasters?).

Ian

[NATURAL ANKLING]

Hi,
Watching The Onedin Line at present, would of thought it was right up your street

Red dwarf................pah
Benidorm

[thirdcrank]

... By not playing along with TVL, you MAY focus additional attention upon yourself.

How this manifests itself ( or not ) will be interesting to see. ...

In my efforts to find dependable information over the last couple of days, I've stumbled across various blogs and the like with plenty of anecdotes and quite a bit of video. A big advantage of the internet is that you can watch other peoples adventures without popping your own head above the parapet.

[kwackers]

In my efforts to find dependable information over the last couple of days, I've stumbled across various blogs and the like with plenty of anecdotes and quite a bit of video. A big advantage of the internet is that you can watch other peoples adventures without popping your own head above the parapet.

I was watching a thread on a local FB page about parking. Someone had been nobbled parking somewhere they shouldn't by a parking company (private property).
The usual internet warriors were out telling them they didn't have to pay etc etc.

FF a few months and it's turned into a sad story of having to pay near £400. Turns out the parking company called their bluff and it ended up going to court.
Funnily enough the warriors are now conspicuous by their absence.

The internet is full of amateur legal experts who I think exist for the entertainment of those of us who think if you've been caught simply paying up is probably the best option.

[Psamathe]

In my efforts to find dependable information over the last couple of days, I've stumbled across various blogs and the like with plenty of anecdotes and quite a bit of video. A big advantage of the internet is that you can watch other peoples adventures without popping your own head above the parapet.

I was watching a thread on a local FB page about parking. Someone had been nobbled parking somewhere they shouldn't by a parking company (private property).
The usual internet warriors were out telling them they didn't have to pay etc etc.

FF a few months and it's turned into a sad story of having to pay near £400. Turns out the parking company called their bluff and it ended up going to court.
Funnily enough the warriors are now conspicuous by their absence.

The internet is full of amateur legal experts who I think exist for the entertainment of those of us who think if you've been caught simply paying up is probably the best option.

I think it's down to how people give and take comments posted.

If somebody asking a question blindly without thought does what somebody suggests then they maybe need to learn about the limitations of the internet. I tend to try and give my own personal thoughts and/or what I might do in a similar situation (given the interpretational considerations as to the asker's situation).

In many ways there is little difference between advice over a parking fine and advice over a rear brake cable - blindly do what some unknown person says and the parking situation might cost you money (you might not be able to afford) whilst brake cable might cost you your life (when hammering downhill towards a busy junction).

I go to buy a washing machine in my local white goods store and I generally don't accept the "advice" the sales person gives - even though they undoubtedly know far more about washing machines than I do. Asking for advice is a skill (e.g expressing your question/aims/situation accurately) and assessing advice given also a skill. Do something without the appropriate skills and it's less likely to go as you'd want.

Information asked for on the internet and information given always has to be assessed in the light of risk and limitations. We are continually asking for and accepting/rejecting/qualifying advice we are given (internet or in the real world).

Same parking alleged offender would probably find just as many "legal experts" down their local pub as on the internet.

Ian

[Mick F]

The difference here, is that we aren't breaking any laws.
They write asking for a written statement in return. If we don't give them a written statement, what then?
They hassle you.

Still not breaking any laws though.
Nothing to fear except fear itself.

[kwackers]

The difference here, is that we aren't breaking any laws.
They write asking for a written statement in return. If we don't give them a written statement, what then?
They hassle you.

Still not breaking any laws though.

Laws? I fear you're being too literal.
My point is that there's no shortage of crap advice on the internet.

[Mick F]

No I'm not being too literal.
The rules are clearly laid down on their letters. That's what they want you to reply to and attest your non TVL requirement.

We're not breaking them, and I'm not asking or seeking advice.

[kwackers]

We're not breaking them, and I'm not asking or seeking advice.

Lots of advice on here on what to do - yes?
When you post on the subject what's the point of your post?

Isn't the whole point of this thread about the letters and anecdotal advice on how to deal with them?

[Mick F]

No.
Not IMHO, no.

It's pub talk, it's chat, it's conversation.
Who started this thread?
Not me, though I have been banging on about TVL for some time and will continue to do so. I often chat to people locally in the "local" about telly and how we don't have one or watch it and how the TVL is an anachronism with all the online malarky is these days.

Hobby horse of mine no doubt.
I'm not giving advice or taking it, just minded to ignore the letters to see what happens.