Tubing

Cycle-touring, Expeditions, Adventures, Major cycle routes NOT LeJoG (see other special board)
Bmblbzzz
Posts: 4432
Joined: 18 May 2012, 7:56pm
Location: From here to there.

Re: Tubing

Post by Bmblbzzz »

So it's a difference of 90g in weight or £90 on the price, and an unquantified strength difference? I'd say that 90g is not noticeable on the weight of a bike and similarly £90 is very minor in the overall cost of a bike. TBH I'd say, as you can't get to test ride it, go for whichever is the nicer colour.
PhilD28
Posts: 305
Joined: 26 Sep 2016, 8:31am

Re: Tubing

Post by PhilD28 »

If the bike is to be used for long haul camping /expedition type use and is in anything other than a small size I would say that Reynolds 525 in .8/.5.8mm would be too light and if the unbranded tubing with .9/.6.9mm has the same UTS that would be preferable. The weight difference between the two is negligible on a loaded bike.

I've ridden many long camping tours on a Reynolds 525 .9/.6/.9 oversize tubed bike built by Dave Yates.

.8/.5/.8 tubing is fine for day touring/B7B/hostelling bikes or very small size camping bikes at a push, tube diameter and selection of course does make a difference but you don't provide any of that info so only general observations can be made.
BikeBuddha
Posts: 23
Joined: 11 Aug 2019, 6:15pm

Re: Tubing

Post by BikeBuddha »

PhilD28 wrote: 24 Nov 2021, 2:56pm

What height are you. Tube length has far more effect on stiffness than wall thickness, as does the amount of load the frame is intended to carry. Is this frame to be used for day touring, B&B/hostelling, or camping touring. These are questions of more importance than the difference of 0.1mm in wall thickness.

I would agree that Lee Cooper really knows his stuff and will certainly have had some input in any frame design he is building for OBW.

Another option is to look at Thorns frames, they are made in Taiwan but to the highest standards using excellent tubing, their frames are designed from many years of real touring experience using Rohloff hubs. Both their Raven and Mercury are excellent choices.

I'm 6ft. I imagine using the bike for heavy loads, and travelling to the horizon, and beyond. An indefinite length trip, working on organic farms along the way. Well, at least that was my original thought. It is my retirement plan. Low-carbon transport, working for food and board, and wild camping along the way. So, I prefer the bike to be flexible, allowing me to do the world tour.

The alternative is also travelling around scotland, living in bothies, and using bike to get to shops.


I watch the guy on cycling about, who has his super duper Koga world traveller. But, I've heard mixed views about belt drives. Chains can get replaced anywhere, without hte need to going into town to order more parts. I will have a dynamo hub, but not much else except audible books and music. Maybe power a camera.


I even looked at the titanium pioneer. A bit shiny, more nickable.

I thought the OBW bike, designed by Tom Allan, had its advantages over the Thorn Nomad... notably chris king headset. But maybe other brands are better?

But I haven't ever had a touring bike before. Never toured. But have OCD, and find myself compelled down the road of getting the world touring bike, in a covid pandemic. :shock: I watched a video of a guy on a bike doing a three - year trip on you tube. I thought Canada, where I used to live. I thought south america to Canada... to the Yukon, where I used to be a goat herder. I'm 51 now. So best adopt this low carbon life style sooner than later, and go meet people on Organic Farms, and maybe do some environmental research on the way.


Just thoughts.... Sounds like the majority prefer the thicker, generic tubing.

Thank you, one and all. I have to finalise my decision by 20th december.
m-gineering
Posts: 193
Joined: 23 May 2015, 12:01pm

Re: Tubing

Post by m-gineering »

BikeBuddha wrote: 25 Nov 2021, 5:20pm

But I haven't ever had a touring bike before. Never toured. But have OCD,
It's great to have touring bike which is just perfect for you, but you will never know what it is until you have toured. And you can tour on anything provided it is mechanically sound and sort of fits. So forget about those high zoot must haves you read about, just get a servicable bike and tour. If you like it, and you get ideas about things you'd like to change when pedalling all those miles, then go and spend serious money if that is what it takes.
Marten

Touring advice for NL: www.m-gineering.nl/touringg.htm
pwa
Posts: 14421
Joined: 2 Oct 2011, 8:55pm

Re: Tubing

Post by pwa »

Looking for the Reynolds label was once a quick way of assuring yourself that a frame was made of nice stuff. But I don't think you need to do that these days. Another assurance is trusting the supplier of the frame to make a good choice of tubes. Most of Thorn's frames, as an example, are now made with "generic" tubes, i.e. made by a company whose name you will not be told, but who make tubes that the builder / designer thinks are right for the job. It would be nice to know a bit more about this particular chromo tubing, but to be honest Reynolds 525 isn't especially high spec and can easily be bettered by generic tubes. I think the generic stuff Thorn use is higher spec than 525, for example. It is closer to 725. So if you trust OBW to make sound choices, don't worry about the lack of a label and enjoy having a frame that is less likely to get a dent if it topples when you lean it against a tree.
PhilD28
Posts: 305
Joined: 26 Sep 2016, 8:31am

Re: Tubing

Post by PhilD28 »

BikeBuddha wrote: 25 Nov 2021, 5:20pm
PhilD28 wrote: 24 Nov 2021, 2:56pm

What height are you. Tube length has far more effect on stiffness than wall thickness, as does the amount of load the frame is intended to carry. Is this frame to be used for day touring, B&B/hostelling, or camping touring. These are questions of more importance than the difference of 0.1mm in wall thickness.

I would agree that Lee Cooper really knows his stuff and will certainly have had some input in any frame design he is building for OBW.

Another option is to look at Thorns frames, they are made in Taiwan but to the highest standards using excellent tubing, their frames are designed from many years of real touring experience using Rohloff hubs. Both their Raven and Mercury are excellent choices.

I'm 6ft. I imagine using the bike for heavy loads, and travelling to the horizon, and beyond. An indefinite length trip, working on organic farms along the way. Well, at least that was my original thought. It is my retirement plan. Low-carbon transport, working for food and board, and wild camping along the way. So, I prefer the bike to be flexible, allowing me to do the world tour.

The alternative is also travelling around scotland, living in bothies, and using bike to get to shops.


I watch the guy on cycling about, who has his super duper Koga world traveller. But, I've heard mixed views about belt drives. Chains can get replaced anywhere, without hte need to going into town to order more parts. I will have a dynamo hub, but not much else except audible books and music. Maybe power a camera.


I even looked at the titanium pioneer. A bit shiny, more nickable.

I thought the OBW bike, designed by Tom Allan, had its advantages over the Thorn Nomad... notably chris king headset. But maybe other brands are better?

But I haven't ever had a touring bike before. Never toured. But have OCD, and find myself compelled down the road of getting the world touring bike, in a covid pandemic. :shock: I watched a video of a guy on a bike doing a three - year trip on you tube. I thought Canada, where I used to live. I thought south america to Canada... to the Yukon, where I used to be a goat herder. I'm 51 now. So best adopt this low carbon life style sooner than later, and go meet people on Organic Farms, and maybe do some environmental research on the way.


Just thoughts.... Sounds like the majority prefer the thicker, generic tubing.

Thank you, one and all. I have to finalise my decision by 20th december.
I think the headset is the least of your problems after countless loaded touring miles I've never had a failure of any brand, wheels are number one consideration. I've been long haul touring on multi month trips almost every year for over thirty years. I always build my own wheels and have never had a failure, I've often helped fellow travellers with broken spokes, pringled rims etc, sometimes on very well known bikes - including Koga. I agree with a previous poster, stick with a chain.

Without doubt Thorn are the most experienced builder of Rohloff based expedition touring bikes and I suggest giving them another look. particularly as you are a large size. While 525 is good Tubing and Dave Yates' favourite for this kind of bike, he custom selects each tubes guage for it's intended purpose as do Thorn but Thorn use superior tubing in terms of UTS, their build quality is also as good as any I've seen including my Dave Yates and Roberts Roughstuff.

I had a Thorn Nomad for years and my wife tours on a Raven and I can confirm that they are superb bikes for multi month loaded touring, their Rohloff built wheels are reliable and all components are carefully selected to suit long haul touring and the Nomad is possibly the most used bike by around the world travellers.

Personally in your position I would look around for a used excellent condition Thorn, they often crop up for a little over half price, check on the for sale section on the Thorn forum.
PhilD28
Posts: 305
Joined: 26 Sep 2016, 8:31am

Re: Tubing

Post by PhilD28 »

You might want to consider this, it looks like it might be close to your size a bargain price for the spec. and superb condition.
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/MENS-Thorn-T ... 635-2958-0
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