Looking For Advice For Mosel/Rhein Tour

Cycle-touring, Expeditions, Adventures, Major cycle routes NOT LeJoG (see other special board)
Ronno57
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Location: Fife Scotland and Jockgrim Germany

Looking For Advice For Mosel/Rhein Tour

Postby Ronno57 » 7 Jul 2017, 8:24pm

Hi, thanks for allowing me into your forum. I''ve recently returned from a two week holiday in Germany with my wife. We were based for one week in Bacharach am Rhein near Koblenz and a second week further south staying with family in Jockgrim which is on the Eurovelo Rhein route between Karlsruhe and Speyer. We had our hybrid bikes with us and cycled every day albeit we started and finished at the same place every trip and our overnight stays were always at either of our two bases.
Our shortest day was about 10 miles in the Deutscher Weinstraße and our longest was 32 miles around the Loreley are of the middle Rhein.

I'm looking to go back next spring with a mate and cycle the Mosel route between Remich in Luxembourg and Koblenz. Our plan is to be a full 5 or 6 days cycling with additional overnight stays before and after the run. We will take the bikes with us by car, leave the car at Remich and get a train from Koblenz back to Remich at the end of the tour. I've looked at Macs Adventure Tour just to get an idea of stop offs and mileages but it looks like they're aiming to cover only 30 to 40 miles per day.

I've never done this kind of touring before and wonder if 3 or 4 hours riding is all that I should be aiming for? I'm confident that we could easily do 50 miles or so daily. Judging by google maps, Remich to Koblenz should be fairly easy with 3 overnight stops. If that's the case, we might carry on and cycle south on the Rhein for a couple of days.

Has anyone done this route? I'm looking for any advice on 1. practicality of leaving a car safe and secure for a week in Remich 2. advice on bnb/hotels (is it better to pre book or use the likes of AirBnB app or booking.com when you stop for the day?) and any other advice that might help us. I've been to the area before and appreciate that places like Trier and Bernkastel Keus are worth spending some time in.

Me and my mate are fairly used to regular 30 to 40 mile runs in Scotland and last year did the Etap Caledonia although neither of us are likely to be competing in Le Tour anytime soon. We are looking to have a fairly leisurely ride each day with maybe 5 or 6 hours in the saddle.

Thanks in advance

ossie
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Re: Looking For Advice For Mosel/Rhein Tour

Postby ossie » 7 Jul 2017, 8:47pm

I cycled through Jockgrim on my journey down the Rhine...have a photo somewhere of the sign as the night before Scotland had lost to Germany and I'd watched it from a bar in Duisburg. :D

That aside I met plenty of of tourers who'd parked their cars up and cycled from A to B and got to a train back to their cars. Many German/ French tourers do this so leaving your car isnt an issue as long as you find the right spot.

I can only speak for the Rhine but 40/50 miles a day was the comfort zone, 60/70 was me giving it a bit of welly but not OTT.

Although as a rule I camp, accommodation is readily available and I met people who were approaching 5pm and simply looking on booking.com. The majority however had pre booked accommodation including static mobile homes on camp sites.

Perhaps book your accommodation in advance but aim for 40 mile intervals between hotels etc.

Ronno57
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Location: Fife Scotland and Jockgrim Germany

Re: Looking For Advice For Mosel/Rhein Tour

Postby Ronno57 » 7 Jul 2017, 10:22pm

Thanks for your advice, Ossie. Much appreciated. Its a small world. My dad was born and grew up in Jockgrim and although I was born there, I moved to Scotland as a small child although I've returned several times a year to visit family for many years.

I'm still amazed at the amount of designated cycle routes (even between villages) that the Germans have. I love my bike and am lucky enough to live in a nice part od Scotland (the East Neuk of Fife) but you share A and B class roads with everyone and their gran when you go out

PDQ Mobile
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Re: Looking For Advice For Mosel/Rhein Tour

Postby PDQ Mobile » 8 Jul 2017, 11:01am


dnrc
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Re: Looking For Advice For Mosel/Rhein Tour

Postby dnrc » 8 Jul 2017, 11:38am

I did this route start of june

Flew in to luxembourg, cycled to remich and then all the way along the mosel to koblenz

i did it in 2 days though (i had a bunch of other stuff to fit into my week)

remich to koblenz along the river cycle path is about 150 miles, it's flat (obviously) and easy cycling, and very pretty.


I camped so no experience of hotels etc, there are loads of them though so reckon you'll be fine just to show up.


If you're doing regular 30-4 mile runs i reckon you'll easily manage 50 miles a day. 10mph for 5 hours on that terrain should be pretty easy

have fun

dnrc
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Re: Looking For Advice For Mosel/Rhein Tour

Postby dnrc » 8 Jul 2017, 11:45am

Ronno57 wrote:I'm still amazed at the amount of designated cycle routes (even between villages) that the Germans have. I love my bike and am lucky enough to live in a nice part od Scotland (the East Neuk of Fife) but you share A and B class roads with everyone and their gran when you go out



After Koblenz i came back to Hook of Holland through Germany

Germany is fantastic to cycle through. most of the time you're on well signposted hard gravel/tarmac 8 foot wide cycle paths that run along fields and rivers and at times you barely see an actual road for 30 mins or a hour

when you do get on a road drivers are generally respectful to you


then you get back to england where cycling is a total afterthought and you are lucky to get 10m of painted white line at a traffic light.

such a contrast

Ronno57
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Re: Looking For Advice For Mosel/Rhein Tour

Postby Ronno57 » 8 Jul 2017, 2:16pm

Great stuff. Thanks for the replies

Ronno57
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Location: Fife Scotland and Jockgrim Germany

Re: Looking For Advice For Mosel/Rhein Tour

Postby Ronno57 » 8 Jul 2017, 2:23pm

dnrc wrote:
Ronno57 wrote:I'm still amazed at the amount of designated cycle routes (even between villages) that the Germans have. I love my bike and am lucky enough to live in a nice part od Scotland (the East Neuk of Fife) but you share A and B class roads with everyone and their gran when you go out





when you do get on a road drivers are generally respectful to you


then you get back to england where cycling is a total afterthought and you are lucky to get 10m of painted white line at a traffic light.

such a contrast


That's probably because most car drivers in Germany are also cyclists (certainly from my experience and connections there) so are much more aware and considerate when confronted by cyclists on a main road.

As a contrast to continental cycle routes, Fife Council announced yesterday that they are to build a designated cycle path that will be completed by the end of next year. It's primarily for road bikes and hybrids and being built next to an existing MTB track.

The tarmaced looped circuit will measure 1.8 kilometres.

mongoose
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Re: Looking For Advice For Mosel/Rhein Tour

Postby mongoose » 9 Jul 2017, 5:40pm

My brother and I did the Mosel in the summer of 2015. We aimed for a daily mileage of 40-50 miles for a relaxing tour with lots of sightseeing.

As my brother lives in Dundee and I live in the south we flew Easyjet with bikes to Basel, him from Edinburgh and me from Gatwick. From Basel airport we cycled to the nearest station and took the train to Strasbourg - well worth visiting. From Strasbourg we followed the Canal de la Marne au Rhin [EV5] to Sarrebourg stopping overnight in a convent. We continued following the canal into Germany stopping overnight at Sarreguemines, Mettlach and then at Trier on the Mosel. Up to this point we had only seen a few other cycle tourists but thereafter there were loads of cyclists, some camping, some staying in hotels/B&B's and some day touring. One of the B&B's we stopped at in Bernkastel was Kathi's - well recommended. Kathi explained that you could day tour the whole of the Mosel as the buses that run between the towns had large bike carriers, so some guests used her as a base and just used the buses to get to the start and back from that day's finish. After that we stopped in Messenich and Koblenz. We continued down the Rhine to Mainz stopping at Bingen then on to Heidleberg before getting the train back to Basel. We found the canal and the Mosel more interesting than the Rhine, even though this section is supposed to be the most scenic.

Hope this is useful

Ronno57
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Re: Looking For Advice For Mosel/Rhein Tour

Postby Ronno57 » 10 Jul 2017, 9:14am

mongoose wrote:My brother and I did the Mosel in the summer of 2015. We aimed for a daily mileage of 40-50 miles for a relaxing tour with lots of sightseeing.

As my brother lives in Dundee and I live in the south we flew Easyjet with bikes to Basel, him from Edinburgh and me from Gatwick. From Basel airport we cycled to the nearest station and took the train to Strasbourg - well worth visiting. From Strasbourg we followed the Canal de la Marne au Rhin [EV5] to Sarrebourg stopping overnight in a convent. We continued following the canal into Germany stopping overnight at Sarreguemines, Mettlach and then at Trier on the Mosel. Up to this point we had only seen a few other cycle tourists but thereafter there were loads of cyclists, some camping, some staying in hotels/B&B's and some day touring. One of the B&B's we stopped at in Bernkastel was Kathi's - well recommended. Kathi explained that you could day tour the whole of the Mosel as the buses that run between the towns had large bike carriers, so some guests used her as a base and just used the buses to get to the start and back from that day's finish. After that we stopped in Messenich and Koblenz. We continued down the Rhine to Mainz stopping at Bingen then on to Heidleberg before getting the train back to Basel. We found the canal and the Mosel more interesting than the Rhine, even though this section is supposed to be the most scenic.

Hope this is useful
very useful info. Thanks. I hadn't considered taking the bikes by plane. Just as a matter of interest, how long did that trip take you from flight to flight?

mongoose
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Re: Looking For Advice For Mosel/Rhein Tour

Postby mongoose » 13 Jul 2017, 9:54pm

Sorry for the delay in replying - away on holiday. Looking back we were away for 13 days including flights. This does include sightseeing days [not moving on] in Strasbourg, Heidelberg and Basel and not counting the flying days - so 8 days touring on the bike.

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plancashire
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Re: Looking For Advice For Mosel/Rhein Tour

Postby plancashire » 3 Sep 2017, 6:25pm

I've done the Mosel but only from Trier to Koblenz. My wife and I cycle slowly. It is pretty flat and almost all well surfaced. There's a bit that is through woods but we managed with 37 mm tyres.

If you can read German there are some excellent guides available in book form suitable for the bar bag map carrier. They have lots of detailed maps so you could use them just for those. We used the bikeline one. They have the route to download as GPX. Book: http://www.esterbauer.com/db_detail.php?buecher_code=MOSEL.

The tourist office has a GPX route here: https://www.tourenplaner-rheinland-pfalz.de/de/tour/radfernweg/mosel-radweg/3371404/ - see the GPX button top right.

I recommend Bett und Bike accommodation: they welcome cyclists. http://www.bettundbike.de. They have a GPX POI file you can use to find places: http://www.bettundbike.de/service/alle-gastbetriebe-als-poi/.

Allow time to enjoy things along the route. A place not to miss, but off in a side valley, is Burg Eltz. http://burg-eltz.de/en/. It is my favourite castle.

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foxyrider
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Re: Looking For Advice For Mosel/Rhein Tour

Postby foxyrider » 7 Sep 2017, 5:31pm

Get yourself a copy of the Esterbauer Mosel guide, its available in English. :) has good maps of the route, advice on accommodation and stuff to see and breaks the route into nice easily ridden chunks.

From memory, the train from Koblenz will get you to Trier before it heads away to Luxembourg city, you'll need to ride from Trier to Remich.

I've ridden bits of the valley and agree it's fairly easy going if you are fit. Add 20kg of touring gear and even so you might not want to do 100km days (I've just got back from a short trip to Holland - a loaded 100km day took me over 7 hours, you need to allow for photo stops, food stops and other tourist stuff!)

I would suggest that if you are going in the summer you might save some angst by pre booking accommodation - the last thing you want is to be chasing accommodation for an hour each evening because they are all booked up. For me that detracts from the enjoyment of the trip.

Hope these tidbits help
Convention? what's that then?

Airnimal Chameleon touring, Orbit Pro hack, Orbit Photon audax, Focus Mares AX tour, Peugeot Carbon sportive, Owen Blower vintage race - all running Tulio's finest!

steady eddy
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Re: Looking For Advice For Mosel/Rhein Tour

Postby steady eddy » 11 Sep 2017, 11:18am

Cicerone publications do two very good guide books for these routes.

Ronno57
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Re: Looking For Advice For Mosel/Rhein Tour

Postby Ronno57 » 20 Sep 2017, 4:02pm

Thanks for all the input and advice. We've decided to visit my family in Jockgrim near Speyer and spend a few days there doing a short stretch of the Rhein Route, head to the nearby Deutscher Weinstraße and spend a day there and also cross the border at Weissembourg and ride a route in Alsace.

We're then booked into a cracking house in Trier for five nights (thanks to AirBnB) so we'll ride parts of the Mosel route from there using my car and train and bus to ferry us from starting and finishing positions along the route.

Obviously we won't manage the entire Mosel route but I'm sure we'll do enough to get a real feel of it and experience some of the great route and scenery.

This will be my mate's first trip to Germany and we decided to let him see and experience a bit more than we would by staying in the Mosel region for our entire stay.

I've bought the cicerone books on both Mosel and Rhein bike routes and Burg Elz is in our plans

Roll on May, 2018