Touring or gravel frame?

Cycle-touring, Expeditions, Adventures, Major cycle routes NOT LeJoG (see other special board)
Bmblbzzz
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Re: Touring or gravel frame?

Postby Bmblbzzz » 9 Aug 2020, 12:37pm

Wouldn't you then need much higher pressures - or larger volumes - to support the same vehicle weight?

PaulaT
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Re: Touring or gravel frame?

Postby PaulaT » 9 Aug 2020, 1:46pm

Bmblbzzz wrote:Wouldn't you then need much higher pressures - or larger volumes - to support the same vehicle weight?


No. Pressure is pressure in a tyre regardless of which gas you use to fill it.

Bmblbzzz
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Re: Touring or gravel frame?

Postby Bmblbzzz » 9 Aug 2020, 2:48pm

Okay, thinking about it, that does make sense even to my long-ago O level physics knowledge.

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RickH
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Re: Touring or gravel frame?

Postby RickH » 9 Aug 2020, 4:36pm

In contrast to others I hated the flared bars that came on my Kona Sutra

kona bars.JPG

They weren't wildly flared but I just couldn't get comfortable on the hoods, which is were I probably ride 80% of the time. I found they made me bend my wrists & press my upper arms into the sides of my chest.

After about 3 weeks I took them off, sold them on, & fitted Deda Zero1 bars (& a longer stem), which are very similar to the FSA Vero that I liked on my previous bike.

But I've loved the fatter slick tyres - I got a stock of Vittoria Voyager Hypers in the 38/40 size before they disappeared - & about the only things they struggle with are mud, where you have to be careful due to lack of lateral grip, & rougher rocky terrain, where you just have to tiptoe through slowly. I pilot a tandem for a friend which is limited to 32mm tyres, they seem very narrow & a bit skittery in comparison when we leave the tarmac.

djb
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Re: Touring or gravel frame?

Postby djb » 9 Aug 2020, 5:43pm

RickH wrote:In contrast to others I hated the flared bars that came on my Kona Sutra

kona bars.JPG
They weren't wildly flared but I just couldn't get comfortable on the hoods, which is were I probably ride 80% of the time. I found they made me bend my wrists & press my upper arms into the sides of my chest.

After about 3 weeks I took them off, sold them on, & fitted Deda Zero1 bars (& a longer stem), which are very similar to the FSA Vero that I liked on my previous bike.

But I've loved the fatter slick tyres - I got a stock of Vittoria Voyager Hypers in the 38/40 size before they disappeared - & about the only things they struggle with are mud, where you have to be careful due to lack of lateral grip, & rougher rocky terrain, where you just have to tiptoe through slowly. I pilot a tandem for a friend which is limited to 32mm tyres, they seem very narrow & a bit skittery in comparison when we leave the tarmac.


interesting. They look similar to my Cowbells, but I've never really noticed any feeling like you describe. I guess diff bars have slightly diff angles, and then of course bar width comes into play also. I suspect also the fact that Im a slight fellow plays a part, although I suspect too that where the hoods are on my Cowbells, they have very much a minimum of "angle in" that would cause the "arms in" feeling.
Width wise, mine are 42cm, and I could have put on 44s, but went with 42s like drops on another bike of mine that seems to fit me well width wise.
From what I read and see, bar widths seem to getting wider all in all, although at a certain point one would probably start to feel a bit too opened up and be "saily" feeling. Guess how much that bug someone would depend on the type of riding they do, slower speeds would probably appreciate wider , especially on loose surfaces.

andrewwillans49
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Re: Touring or gravel frame?

Postby andrewwillans49 » 15 Aug 2020, 12:28am

I bought a Cube gravel bike partly based on the fact that the specification states ' with rack and mudguard eyes. Whilst the bike is fit for purpose as a gravel bike, as a tourer that remains to be seen . The eyelets are so close to the through axles I've had to release the front mudguard to remove the through axle to fix front puncture. On the back I have to release the rack to remove the through axle. Additionally, the rear mudguard stay has to be attached to the rack as there's only one eyelet ( per side) , also, the eyelets don't go right through the frame but appear to be stainless steel inserts tapped into the aluminium frame.
Caveat emptor

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Sweep
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Re: Touring or gravel frame?

Postby Sweep » 15 Aug 2020, 8:22am

andrewwillans49 wrote: the eyelets don't go right through the frame but appear to be stainless steel inserts tapped into the aluminium frame.
Caveat emptor

one of several reasons why i won't be buying another aluminium bike.
thanks for the caveat emptor - that frame design with regard to the mudguard mounting can only be incomptetent - so much for progress.
Sweep

Bmblbzzz
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Re: Touring or gravel frame?

Postby Bmblbzzz » 15 Aug 2020, 2:15pm

I had similar issues fitting a mudguard to the fork of my Specialized Sequoia - no problems at the rear. The fork (and the rear dropouts) is fitted with Specialized's own "plug and play" system, which the shop told me right from the start was no good, so I used the dedicated mount at the end of the fork. This is really intended as part of the plug n play system (can't remember Specialized's proprietary name) so is in front of the through axle, leading to the same problem with punctures etc. Fortunately, there are three other mounting points approximately halfway up the fork; two on the outside, which I'm using for load, and one on the inside, where my mudguard stays are mounted. A happy outcome - and it's a marvellous bike for loaded touring and for urban riding. :D

Cowsham
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Re: Touring or gravel frame?

Postby Cowsham » 15 Aug 2020, 7:45pm

Sweep wrote:
andrewwillans49 wrote: the eyelets don't go right through the frame but appear to be stainless steel inserts tapped into the aluminium frame.
Caveat emptor

one of several reasons why i won't be buying another aluminium bike.
thanks for the caveat emptor - that frame design with regard to the mudguard mounting can only be incomptetent - so much for progress.


No such problems with the R2 it's well suited for a touring setup.

Mackiemill
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Re: Touring or gravel frame?

Postby Mackiemill » 22 Aug 2020, 9:35pm

Just back from LBS: my 2006 Dawes Ultra Galaxy now gravel-worthy (105 shifters, 2x11 GRX, Avid Shorty Ultimate brakes, Schwalbe Marathon Tour tyres). Didn't want to give up my very comfortable 853 frame, nor pay £2500. Looking forward to a first spin tomorrow

willem jongman
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Re: Touring or gravel frame?

Postby willem jongman » 24 Aug 2020, 10:23pm

I have just come back from two weeks touring in northern Germany, with 15 kg of luggage. Tyres were 55 mm Schwalbe Almotion and I would not have wanted anything narrower on the many coarse gravel trails. Grr. The tyres were excellent, with enough tread for pretty bad surfaces but fast enough on tarmac. Not as fast as my Compass Rat Trap Pass, but those would not have survived.

slowster
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Re: Touring or gravel frame?

Postby slowster » 24 Aug 2020, 10:34pm

willem jongman wrote:Tyres were 55 mm Schwalbe Almotion

May I ask what the internal width of your rims is, and what is the actual width of the tyre on those rims?

m-gineering
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Re: Touring or gravel frame?

Postby m-gineering » 25 Aug 2020, 6:45am

slowster wrote:
willem jongman wrote:Tyres were 55 mm Schwalbe Almotion

May I ask what the internal width of your rims is, and what is the actual width of the tyre on those rims?


rim is 19.5mm inside (sp19) and the tyre is 55mm wide x 55mm tall (measured from rim edge)

(it's in the shop for some tlc ;) )
Marten

Touring advice for NL: www.m-gineering.nl/touringg.htm

slowster
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Re: Touring or gravel frame?

Postby slowster » 25 Aug 2020, 10:25am

m-gineering wrote:rim is 19.5mm inside (sp19) and the tyre is 55mm wide x 55mm tall (measured from rim edge)

That's interesting, based on my and others' experience of the Marathon Supreme usually being narrower than its nominal width, I was anticipating that the Almotion might be similar, but evidently that is not the case.

djb
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Re: Touring or gravel frame?

Postby djb » 25 Aug 2020, 11:14am

I'll try to remember to measure my rims with the 2 inch supremes 50mm that measure only to 45mm...