EU Vaccine Passport

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Jdsk
Posts: 24639
Joined: 5 Mar 2019, 5:42pm

Re: EU Vaccine Passport

Post by Jdsk »

PDQ Mobile wrote: 10 May 2021, 5:00pmFirst vaccination on the 16/03 and second offered on the 14th of July.
Is that your own?

The North Wales Health Board is asking anyone who hasn't had the second by 11 weeks to make contact:
http://www.deeside.com/missed-vaccinati ... lth-board/

I haven't heard of a systematic problem resulting in delayed second doses.

Jonathan
PDQ Mobile
Posts: 4659
Joined: 2 Aug 2015, 4:40pm

Re: EU Vaccine Passport

Post by PDQ Mobile »

Jdsk wrote: 10 May 2021, 5:06pm
PDQ Mobile wrote: 10 May 2021, 5:00pmFirst vaccination on the 16/03 and second offered on the 14th of July.
Is that your own?

The North Wales Health Board is asking anyone who hasn't had the second by 11 weeks to make contact:
http://www.deeside.com/missed-vaccinati ... lth-board/

I haven't heard of a systematic problem resulting in delayed second doses.

Jonathan
It is someone of 68 years old who is very close to me.
I will provide details by PM if you question my veracity.
This happened only today.
Deeside in not the actual health area concerned (AFAIK) but rather Betsi Cadwaladr.
I shall however, in the light of your info persue it further, though phone waiting times of over a hour, only to be cut off, are not unheard of.
I would add that this is not any missed appointment, as the title of your link might suggest but simply a failure to give a second appointment date at the time of the first. A second was stated to be on or around the 24th of May but upon inquiring an earliest date of the 14th of July was offered.
Last edited by PDQ Mobile on 10 May 2021, 5:27pm, edited 2 times in total.
Jdsk
Posts: 24639
Joined: 5 Mar 2019, 5:42pm

Re: EU Vaccine Passport

Post by Jdsk »

It would be helpful to let the relevant authority know. That might help them uncover a fault in the process.

I haven't heard of a systematic problem resulting in delayed second doses.

Jonathan
PDQ Mobile
Posts: 4659
Joined: 2 Aug 2015, 4:40pm

Re: EU Vaccine Passport

Post by PDQ Mobile »

Jdsk wrote: 10 May 2021, 5:20pm It would be helpful to let the relevant authority know. That might help them uncover a fault in the process.

I haven't heard of a systematic problem resulting in delayed second doses.

Jonathan
That is not what the appointments clerk told me. She said that there a great many older people very upset about such an extension.
And that one should perhaps contact one's MP!!
I said (for it was me that made the inquiry), "do you really think that would be helpful/ make any difference?"

"Might be worth a try" she said.!!
...
As for "fault in the process" she said it was new and revised policy.
Make of it what you will, but that is what was said and what happened.
willem jongman
Posts: 2750
Joined: 7 Jan 2008, 4:16pm

Re: EU Vaccine Passport

Post by willem jongman »

Things are moving fast. The EU has said the Certificate will be ready by 1 June, and that EU countries should be able to get their implementaions operational by mid June. My hunch is that this may be true for some countries, but not for all. The Dutch prime minister has said it may take us longer :x
In the meantime, Germany has just released the AZ vaccine for all age groups, and decided that everyone who wants to have it can come and get it. People are queing. I think that this is indeed the best approach to deal with vaccine hesitancy: OK you do not want it, who is next? Germany has decided to do the same with the one shot Janssen vaccine of which they will get 10 million before the end of June. Apparently many people are motivated by the benefits that vaccination will give once the vaccination certificate is operational. See here: https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/ ... f-all-ages
Jdsk
Posts: 24639
Joined: 5 Mar 2019, 5:42pm

Re: EU Vaccine Passport

Post by Jdsk »

Psamathe wrote: 8 May 2021, 8:01pm
Jdsk wrote: 8 May 2021, 6:56pm GOV.UK: "Demonstrating your COVID-19 vaccination status when travelling abroad":
https://www.gov.uk/guidance/demonstrati ... ing-abroad
Pity the info (your linked page and others I've checked) don't say whether or not the app requires to be online whenever your Veccine Status is checked (or does it retain the vaccination record on the device). Rather relevant when arriving in a foreign country at immigration with no SIM for that country (yet) and do immigration areas provide free Wi-Fi (many Customs areas say "no smartphones). Unless I've missed it.

It's a general thing I've noticed amongst city dwellers - the forget the possibility that you might ever spend time away from internet coverage (through 4/5G or Wi-Fi) whereas rural people tend to think bout being offline a bit more.
Just got an answer about the NHS app:

1 The app won't work without network access because you can't log in.

2 You can download the information.

3 You can have a copy emailed to you.

4 You can get the information on paper without using the app.

Jonathan
willem jongman
Posts: 2750
Joined: 7 Jan 2008, 4:16pm

Re: EU Vaccine Passport

Post by willem jongman »

The EU app does not require you to be online. Of course you have be online once to download your status, but not after that. And the app does not have any other private information about you that could be stolen.
Psamathe
Posts: 17650
Joined: 10 Jan 2014, 8:56pm

Re: EU Vaccine Passport

Post by Psamathe »

Jdsk wrote: 17 May 2021, 7:13pm
Psamathe wrote: 8 May 2021, 8:01pm
Jdsk wrote: 8 May 2021, 6:56pm GOV.UK: "Demonstrating your COVID-19 vaccination status when travelling abroad":
https://www.gov.uk/guidance/demonstrati ... ing-abroad
Pity the info (your linked page and others I've checked) don't say whether or not the app requires to be online whenever your Veccine Status is checked (or does it retain the vaccination record on the device). Rather relevant when arriving in a foreign country at immigration with no SIM for that country (yet) and do immigration areas provide free Wi-Fi (many Customs areas say "no smartphones). Unless I've missed it.

It's a general thing I've noticed amongst city dwellers - the forget the possibility that you might ever spend time away from internet coverage (through 4/5G or Wi-Fi) whereas rural people tend to think bout being offline a bit more.
Just got an answer about the NHS app:

1 The app won't work without network access because you can't log in.

2 You can download the information.

3 You can have a copy emailed to you.

4 You can get the information on paper without using the app.

Jonathan
(My bold and colour.)
I'd have hoped for some local caching. The displayed "certificate" could present a cached indicator. After all, a paper document is in effect a permanently cached copy. But I suppose it depends on exactly what you can download or even more relevant what those requiring the passport will accept.

As others have said (and I've probably said), pity the Uk had to (yet again) go it alone rather than being part of the EU scheme.

Ian
Jdsk
Posts: 24639
Joined: 5 Mar 2019, 5:42pm

Re: EU Vaccine Passport

Post by Jdsk »

Psamathe wrote: 17 May 2021, 8:28pmI'd have hoped for some local caching.
Me too. I can barely believe this.

I might ask if we can see the use cases...

Jonathan
Jdsk
Posts: 24639
Joined: 5 Mar 2019, 5:42pm

Re: EU Vaccine Passport

Post by Jdsk »

A bit more on the NHS record of vaccination status...

"... downloads a PDF with details of the vaccination and a security QR code."

That's using web browser access not the NHS app.

Jonathan
Psamathe
Posts: 17650
Joined: 10 Jan 2014, 8:56pm

Re: EU Vaccine Passport

Post by Psamathe »

Jdsk wrote: 17 May 2021, 8:34pm
Psamathe wrote: 17 May 2021, 8:28pmI'd have hoped for some local caching.
Me too. I can barely believe this.

I might ask if we can see the use cases...

Jonathan
Thing is that it all becomes academic depending on who will accept it and for what purposes. If it's only used for foreign travel then online becomes dependent on internet access with your phone on going through immigration.

As far as I'm aware this will be the first time such a passport system has been implemented on a phone and screen display is pretty easy to fake. But then things like the Yellow Fever vaccination certificate are pretty easy to fake (you can buy blank ones all over the place and fill them in yourself! It could be that immigration requirements end up being "Greatest Good, Greatest Numbers" and if a few fake ones get through then they'll rely on that the majority are valid. And probably still a better solution that test results given you could take the test and then catch Covid on the way out of the test centre. And if UK is catching 100 fake test certificates per day (https://news.sky.com/story/covid-19-at- ... d-12282433) - they probably realise they are not detecting a fair number of fake ones.

I do wonder if it might start to be used domestically. Maybe as they "test" more big events and they start "NHS App showing vaccination" or a test result (particularly in short term before youngsters have had the opportunity). Maybe as the Indian variant spreads and Johnson is desperate to keep relaxing rules then domestic passports could lower risks for some opening-up?

Ian
Jdsk
Posts: 24639
Joined: 5 Mar 2019, 5:42pm

Re: EU Vaccine Passport

Post by Jdsk »

Jdsk wrote: 17 May 2021, 8:42pm A bit more on the NHS record of vaccination status...

"... downloads a PDF with details of the vaccination and a security QR code."

That's using web browser access not the NHS app.
And the ability to download from the app has just appeared.

Jonathan

21d56c99d3e91c032b8579f6374877f49ae1d706.jpg
Psamathe
Posts: 17650
Joined: 10 Jan 2014, 8:56pm

Re: EU Vaccine Passport

Post by Psamathe »

Jdsk wrote: 17 May 2021, 9:55pm
Jdsk wrote: 17 May 2021, 8:42pm A bit more on the NHS record of vaccination status...

"... downloads a PDF with details of the vaccination and a security QR code."

That's using web browser access not the NHS app.
And the ability to download from the app has just appeared.

Jonathan


21d56c99d3e91c032b8579f6374877f49ae1d706.jpg
I've not downloaded the app but their use of the "Share" terminology makes me wonder if they might (or may have already) link your Covid vaccination status to your passport number and allow you to grant foreign immigration services access e.g. through some shared link you can provide them. I don't see a massive security risk as the information is not particularly useful without the physical passport and we readily enter our passport number online already and that number with your Covid vaccination record is hardly going to allow fraudsters to impersonate you ...

I do see it as a big problem is lots of countries all go their own way doing their own thing so every immigration has to verify and accommodate loads of different systems.

But still early days and can't expect everything to be perfect on Day 1, just wish the UK was more enthusiastic about talking and coordinating with others rather than yet again wanting to "go it alone" and expect the rest of the world to accommodate us.

Ian
Psamathe
Posts: 17650
Joined: 10 Jan 2014, 8:56pm

Re: EU Vaccine Passport

Post by Psamathe »

An interesting article about the UK NHS vaccine passport app.
https://theconversation.com/nhs-vaccine-passports-are-here-but-will-they-be-used-beyond-international-travel-161122 wrote: ...
The latest privacy policy also contains a long and confusing list of personal data under “The Personal Data we collect and how it is used”, some of which look worryingly sensitive – such as ethnicity, vehicle registration plate, national insurance number, employer, biometric and genetic information and criminal convictions.
...
Possible reassurances

Is there anything NHSX could do to reassure me? Absolutely. A data protection impact assessment should be produced and published. This would tell us all about what data is actually used, including an explanation of why data collection is both necessary and proportional.

I’d be looking out for an assessment of the risk of “function creep”: the widening of the scope of use, which could see our tickets for international travel converted into something more sinister and concerning. It would also need to address general impacts to rights and freedoms, such as those related to equality.

Performing such an impact assessment is actually specifically legally required, and should already have been done. Publication is unfortunately not compulsory, but we still don’t know whether one was done at all.

For now, however, it appears that the UK government has definitively abandoned its previous cautious position on vaccine passports, without providing any reassurances that would enable broad public support.
A few excerpts above but those are my selections and others might find other bits of the article of more interest.

Ian
Jdsk
Posts: 24639
Joined: 5 Mar 2019, 5:42pm

Re: EU Vaccine Passport

Post by Jdsk »

"EU Digital COVID Certificate: European Parliament and Council reach agreement on Commission proposal"
https://ec.europa.eu/commission/pressco ... ip_21_2593

Jonathan
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