Drive Belt vs Chain, Rohloff Hub vs Derailler, and other questions.

Cycle-touring, Expeditions, Adventures, Major cycle routes NOT LeJoG (see other special board)
PH
Posts: 13106
Joined: 21 Jan 2007, 12:31am
Location: Derby
Contact:

Re: Drive Belt vs Chain, Rohloff Hub vs Derailler, and other questions.

Post by PH »

doodah wrote:Thorn have possibly been one of the last bike builders coming to the market re belt drive,

I think they'll still try and talk you out of it, I'm guessing it's been introduced to satisfy customer demand, much like disc brakes, those are the sorts of compromises businesses have to make to be viable. The argument against belt drives isn't whether a frame is strong enough, that's just design, but that they introduce more problems than they solve. I'm not making that argument, I've never used a belt to compare, but then I've never felt disadvantaged by using a chain.
doodah
Posts: 164
Joined: 9 Aug 2008, 2:26pm

Re: Drive Belt vs Chain, Rohloff Hub vs Derailler, and other questions.

Post by doodah »

PH wrote:
doodah wrote:Thorn have possibly been one of the last bike builders coming to the market re belt drive,

I think they'll still try and talk you out of it, I'm guessing it's been introduced to satisfy customer demand, much like disc brakes, those are the sorts of compromises businesses have to make to be viable. The argument against belt drives isn't whether a frame is strong enough, that's just design, but that they introduce more problems than they solve. I'm not making that argument, I've never used a belt to compare, but then I've never felt disadvantaged by using a chain.


A very good point and one that I had not considered. You have made me think twice and closely look at the pro's and con's from a different perspective.

Thank you.

Doodah
simonhill
Posts: 5226
Joined: 13 Jan 2007, 11:28am
Location: Essex

Re: Drive Belt vs Chain, Rohloff Hub vs Derailler, and other questions.

Post by simonhill »

If the OP is interested in belt drive, he can read ad nauseam here viewtopic.php?f=5&t=133807&hilit=belt+drive&start=30

I've also posted before that you can buy very cheap commuter/utility bikes in Japan that have hub gears and belt drive. Only about £250. I've seen a few, but they are not very popular (as a %age of all bikes I've seen). I'm not sure why they have such a high premium when applied to a touring bike.
BikeBuddha
Posts: 52
Joined: 11 Aug 2019, 6:15pm

Re: Drive Belt vs Chain, Rohloff Hub vs Derailler, and other questions.

Post by BikeBuddha »

There is so much conflicting messages about belt drives. The chap from cycling about loves them.

https://www.cyclingabout.com/belt-drive-best-bicycle-drivetrain/

Thorn, until recently, refused to fit them. https://www.cyclingabout.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/06/Belt-Drive-Thorn-Cycles.jpg

Perhaps cycling about, being koga sponsored, gets a load of replacements and free replacements?

Its really hard to find the answer in all these polarised opinions, being a newbie.

I think the only thing I have decided on its the Chris King Headset... apparently, there is no better.

I am thinking something that can handle a bit of off road as well, like the guy from cycling about does. So, am I thinking 26 inch wheels. Thorn nomad accommodates 2.5" tyres, OBW accommodates 2.1"? Would 2.1 inch tires be enough? Or is 1.9" good?

There are just too many variables for the beginner to gain meaningful insight into. :(
simonhill
Posts: 5226
Joined: 13 Jan 2007, 11:28am
Location: Essex

Re: Drive Belt vs Chain, Rohloff Hub vs Derailler, and other questions.

Post by simonhill »

IT DOESN'T MATTER!

I've done some of my hardest touring on a steel frame mountain bike I bought new for £250 after a few mods and transplants (tyres, guards, rack, saddle, etc). India, NW Vietnam (Tonkin Alps), SW China, N Lao, etc,etc, plus tons of easier stuff.

I've rarely had any failures because I looked after it - rim in Thailand, flat spot on tyre in China, buckled wheel ex flight in Oz. Nothing terminal and never a headset.

For now, get a bike, probably an old MTB as they are cheap and solid. Put a rack and mudguards on it and start pedalling.

Life's what happens while you make plans.

Edited in "For now" as any RTW will be a year or so off.
ossie
Posts: 1793
Joined: 15 Apr 2011, 7:52pm

Re: Drive Belt vs Chain, Rohloff Hub vs Derailler, and other questions.

Post by ossie »

As Simon says. I toured UK and Europe on the below bike for a month fully loaded. I made it up from an old steel Raleigh 80's frame, the total cost was £250 for new wheels, crankset, BB and a few other things (the frame was free). Its still going strong. The parts could all be replaced in any corner of the planet. I kind of did it as a project, can I tour on this type thing (notwithstanding I'd toured for six years previously on other bikes) . Building it also confirmed my confidence in fixing the thing should it go wrong.

Its not my only touring bike but the important thing is that you may want to get out cycling / camping and start learning what works and what doesn't be it your tent, your mat, your cooking pot, your tyres, your saddle, your pump, your bars, the wear and tear on your body day after day after day, how you deal with it, Its an absolutely massive subject and experience really is your best friend. Best of luck and I think you've started planning on a great forum with some tremendously experienced posters.

P1050088.JPG
User avatar
Sweep
Posts: 8442
Joined: 20 Oct 2011, 4:57pm
Location: London

Re: Drive Belt vs Chain, Rohloff Hub vs Derailler, and other questions.

Post by Sweep »

doodah wrote:- even Sweep has come up with an app for a brothel - .

Doodah

not sure what the "even" means doodah :)
and in the interests of not giving casual forum visitors an odd view of me, I should point out that it is not an app for a brothel, it's just a mapping navigation package which draws on open street map data which does have a tag for brothels.

https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag ... %3Dbrothel

other amenities are available :)
Sweep
willem jongman
Posts: 2750
Joined: 7 Jan 2008, 4:16pm

Re: Drive Belt vs Chain, Rohloff Hub vs Derailler, and other questions.

Post by willem jongman »

When my frame was designed belt drive did not exist. However I would not choose one now. Belts are slightly less efficient, are more expensive, and require a very rigid rear triangle which I do not like. Finally, Rohloff do not really like them either. That will do for me.
Last edited by willem jongman on 31 Mar 2021, 8:22pm, edited 1 time in total.
Bonefishblues
Posts: 11009
Joined: 7 Jul 2014, 9:45pm
Location: Near Bicester Oxon

Re: Drive Belt vs Chain, Rohloff Hub vs Derailler, and other questions.

Post by Bonefishblues »

Serious question if I may?

A couple of times the need for a very rigid rear triangle for use with belts has been mentioned, possibly by WJ. How much compliancy is there is any specialist endurance tourer's rear triangle - aren't they all pretty overbuilt if they are to do their job properly, with almost all compliancy coming from tyres?
doodah
Posts: 164
Joined: 9 Aug 2008, 2:26pm

Re: Drive Belt vs Chain, Rohloff Hub vs Derailler, and other questions.

Post by doodah »

Sweep wrote:
doodah wrote:- even Sweep has come up with an app for a brothel - .

Doodah

not sure what the "even" means doodah :)

Yes, I can see how that may be misinterpreted. Please allow me to re phrase that:-

- Sweep has even come with an app for a brothel.
Absolutely no slant or derogatory intent there - rest assured.


and in the interests of not giving casual forum visitors an odd view of me, I should point out that it is not an app for a brothel, it's just a mapping navigation package which draws on open street map data which does have a tag for brothels.

https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag ... %3Dbrothel

Now here, I really did think you used your investigative powers and came up with a winner for BikeBuddha and posted same in your impeccable style. Apologies for getting that wrong Sweep.

other amenities are available :)
simonhill
Posts: 5226
Joined: 13 Jan 2007, 11:28am
Location: Essex

Re: Drive Belt vs Chain, Rohloff Hub vs Derailler, and other questions.

Post by simonhill »

A few bikes have appeared on the For Sale section of this forum. Ranging from a Galaxy through Koga Miyata and Van Nicholas Gates Drive Rohloff (may be in process of being sold) to a Ridgeback Expedition. viewtopic.php?f=40&t=144922

I'd favour the Ridgeback as a way of starting touring if he likes flat bars. I also reckon it would easily handle a long haul tour. If he wants drops, then maybe the Galaxy could be worth a look. Both of them are up north, Northumberland and Cumbria.
geocycle
Posts: 2177
Joined: 11 Jan 2007, 9:46am

Re: Drive Belt vs Chain, Rohloff Hub vs Derailler, and other questions.

Post by geocycle »

I wouldn’t choose a belt drive for a round the world tourer. If something gets damaged you’d have little local back up whereas single speed or similar chains are available anywhere. As far as I know Gates are the only makers, if they went out of business future proofing them might be tricky. I might risk it on a commuter as it does sound to be a good solution to oil free longevity.
User avatar
Sweep
Posts: 8442
Joined: 20 Oct 2011, 4:57pm
Location: London

Re: Drive Belt vs Chain, Rohloff Hub vs Derailler, and other questions.

Post by Sweep »

simonhill wrote:A few bikes have appeared on the For Sale section of this forum. Ranging from a Galaxy through Koga Miyata and Van Nicholas Gates Drive Rohloff (may be in process of being sold) to a Ridgeback Expedition. viewtopic.php?f=40&t=144922

I'd favour the Ridgeback as a way of starting touring if he likes flat bars. I also reckon it would easily handle a long haul tour. If he wants drops, then maybe the Galaxy could be worth a look. Both of them are up north, Northumberland and Cumbria.

I don't have any disc bikes but I can say that my Ridgeback Expedition with V brakes is a great rough touring bike.
Sweep
doodah
Posts: 164
Joined: 9 Aug 2008, 2:26pm

Re: Drive Belt vs Chain, Rohloff Hub vs Derailler, and other questions.

Post by doodah »

Hi BikeBuddha,

Don't know what height you are, but here is something worth viewing and bidding for if it looks likely to fit:-

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/265108481774

Cheers

Doodah
Bonefishblues
Posts: 11009
Joined: 7 Jul 2014, 9:45pm
Location: Near Bicester Oxon

Re: Drive Belt vs Chain, Rohloff Hub vs Derailler, and other questions.

Post by Bonefishblues »

Seller has an unusually short Rohloff service interval, I note!
Post Reply