Tools and mechanic skills required with a Thorn Raven tour?
- matt2matt2002
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- Location: Aberdeen Scotland UK
Re: Tools and mechanic skills required with a Thorn Raven tour?
All good comments and advice above.
My Raven has never let me down on many foreign tours.
Re the cables: a friend changed his to ordinary brake cables. So no need to carry the Thorn thin cables and easy to replace on the road.
Maybe I've been lucky but none of my tours have ever required anywhere near half the ' essential' spares I carry.
Sod's law I'll need them one day.....
My Raven has never let me down on many foreign tours.
Re the cables: a friend changed his to ordinary brake cables. So no need to carry the Thorn thin cables and easy to replace on the road.
Maybe I've been lucky but none of my tours have ever required anywhere near half the ' essential' spares I carry.
Sod's law I'll need them one day.....
2017 Ethiopia.5 weeks.
2018 Marrakech 2 weeks.
2023 Thailand 8 weeks.
Always on a Thorn Raven/Rohloff hub.
2018 Marrakech 2 weeks.
2023 Thailand 8 weeks.
Always on a Thorn Raven/Rohloff hub.
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- Joined: 7 Jan 2008, 4:16pm
Re: Tools and mechanic skills required with a Thorn Raven tour?
For all I know the Raven has an internal shift mechanism on the hub and this requires a thin cable for the length nearest the hub. Getting the special ready made Rohloff Easy Set for this is the easiest way. Thus far I have not yet needed it, but it is a reassuring thought that I have it with me. It is small and light, and very Rohloff specific.
Last edited by willem jongman on 6 Aug 2021, 9:16am, edited 2 times in total.
Re: Tools and mechanic skills required with a Thorn Raven tour?
It appealed to my sense of humour
Disclaimer: Treat what I say with caution and if possible, wait for someone with more knowledge and experience to contribute.
Re: Tools and mechanic skills required with a Thorn Raven tour?
One extra thing you do need with a Thorn Raven is the two prong thing for rotating the body of the eccentric bottom bracket do-dah (I know all the terms).
Our Raven tandem uses the thicker brake cables for gear changing and failure is very unlikely. Even so, taking a cut-to-length cable for gears and brakes takes up very little room and weighs almost nowt, so why not do it?
Ravens are the sort of bike where, if you double check everything beforehand and you start off with everything tested by a few rides, little or nothing should go wrong beyond the odd puncture and the need to do basic maintenance along the way. Brake pads, chain lubing and so forth. And take a small bag of spare screws in case any fall out. For mudguards, bottle cages etc. A few zip ties can also come in useful.
Our Raven tandem uses the thicker brake cables for gear changing and failure is very unlikely. Even so, taking a cut-to-length cable for gears and brakes takes up very little room and weighs almost nowt, so why not do it?
Ravens are the sort of bike where, if you double check everything beforehand and you start off with everything tested by a few rides, little or nothing should go wrong beyond the odd puncture and the need to do basic maintenance along the way. Brake pads, chain lubing and so forth. And take a small bag of spare screws in case any fall out. For mudguards, bottle cages etc. A few zip ties can also come in useful.
Re: Tools and mechanic skills required with a Thorn Raven tour?
You don't really need the special tool to adjust the EBB. The only time I've had to do it in the field I just borrowed a 15mm spanner from a passing garage. Once the bolts are loose you can move the EBB about in its shell by hand. There might be a case for smearing it with a bit of anti-seize grease when you first get the bike - you don't have to take the cranks off to do this there's enough side to side movement.
My standard comment on chain tensioning and cleaning: with a Rohloff it doesn't matter how much slack is in the chain and it doesn't matter how dirty or worn the chain is. "Leave the chain alone."
Now I've seen the light, I only adjust the chain if it starts falling off when going round corners. And I only replace rings/sprockets/chain when absolutely necessary. As long as they all wear together they'll be fine. I do mark a tooth on the sprocket and a tooth on the chainring so I can keep the chain phase the same: https://sheldonbrown.com/chain-life.html
Thorn Raven Tour? An excellent choice.
My standard comment on chain tensioning and cleaning: with a Rohloff it doesn't matter how much slack is in the chain and it doesn't matter how dirty or worn the chain is. "Leave the chain alone."
Now I've seen the light, I only adjust the chain if it starts falling off when going round corners. And I only replace rings/sprockets/chain when absolutely necessary. As long as they all wear together they'll be fine. I do mark a tooth on the sprocket and a tooth on the chainring so I can keep the chain phase the same: https://sheldonbrown.com/chain-life.html
Thorn Raven Tour? An excellent choice.
Please do not use this post in Cycle magazine
Re: Tools and mechanic skills required with a Thorn Raven tour?
While nether a thorn nor rohlof owner, I can add that with any bike, but especially new bikes, doing a good amount of loaded kilometers miles on the wheels is important so that after a certain point, you get an experienced wheel guy or gal to go over the spoke tensions.
I would imagine it's also in your best interests to go somewhere where they have experience with rohlof wheels and touring loads, to be sure they really know the proper spoke tensions.
Other than that, the usual stuff like threadlock on rack and fender bolts.
If you are mechanically minded, regular checks of the bike when doing a weekly drivetrain clean and lube generally means you'll keep on top of anything.
Enjoy the new bikes
Ps re chain wear. I personally abide by the 1/8 stretch over a foot rule for changing chains. That and keeping drivetrain clean means both chain ring and rear cog will last a lot longer.
A chain is cheap to change. Cogs not so cheap nor rohlof stuff common.
I would imagine it's also in your best interests to go somewhere where they have experience with rohlof wheels and touring loads, to be sure they really know the proper spoke tensions.
Other than that, the usual stuff like threadlock on rack and fender bolts.
If you are mechanically minded, regular checks of the bike when doing a weekly drivetrain clean and lube generally means you'll keep on top of anything.
Enjoy the new bikes
Ps re chain wear. I personally abide by the 1/8 stretch over a foot rule for changing chains. That and keeping drivetrain clean means both chain ring and rear cog will last a lot longer.
A chain is cheap to change. Cogs not so cheap nor rohlof stuff common.
Re: Tools and mechanic skills required with a Thorn Raven tour?
That's a good rule for derailleurs where the rear cogs wear at different rates and so a "stretched" chain may catch or ramp in certain gears. That's not going to happen where there's only one chain ring at the front and one cog at the back so you can basically fit and forget if you want to.
Please do not use this post in Cycle magazine
Re: Tools and mechanic skills required with a Thorn Raven tour?
Thanks for clarifying. The OP has an internal shifting hub, we wouldn't want to be sending them off with the wrong spares!
My hubs are external, I understood the issue with running generic cables was the nipple not being the ideal size for the shifter, have you not found that to be the case?
Re: Tools and mechanic skills required with a Thorn Raven tour?
We have probably done no more than about five thousand miles on the tandem (and it has been dormant for the last ten years) so we have never needed to change the gear cables. There are two, for anyone who doesn't know, one to pull one way, the other to pull the other way. As the indexing is done within the hub rather than the twist grip, cable tension is not sensitive. If you ever did lose cable function out in the sticks you can, I believe, change gear with a small spanner. Obviously you have to stop and get off to do that, but you can decide which gear to be stuck in.PH wrote: ↑6 Aug 2021, 5:21pmThanks for clarifying. The OP has an internal shifting hub, we wouldn't want to be sending them off with the wrong spares!
My hubs are external, I understood the issue with running generic cables was the nipple not being the ideal size for the shifter, have you not found that to be the case?
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Re: Tools and mechanic skills required with a Thorn Raven tour?
If you have to remove the rear wheel it is possible that the rear hub and the twist grip may become out of sync. This is all covered in the various booklets, including the ‘ living with a Rohloff’ publication. Take new cables and spokes as mentioned above, plus a spanner ( 10mm I think) so that you align the hub to the twist grip. Otherwise a great gear set arrangement with no trouble os far ( about 10,000 across europe with all the gear
Re: Tools and mechanic skills required with a Thorn Raven tour?
My comment waa more in response to someone here who said just let the chain drivetrain wear all together until it's all worn out.hufty wrote: ↑6 Aug 2021, 1:26pm That's a good rule for derailleurs where the rear cogs wear at different rates and so a "stretched" chain may catch or ramp in certain gears. That's not going to happen where there's only one chain ring at the front and one cog at the back so you can basically fit and forget if you want to.
Even with a rohlof I reckon it's prudent to change a chain at the 1/8 mark as teeth are teeth, and why wear a nice chain ring or special rohlof rear cog more than necessary.
Seems to me that rohlof or derailleur, teeth on cogs will be worn by an overly stretched chain the same.
On this note, when I was considering getting a rohlof for my tough touring bike, I was very interested in those hebie? Or whatever brand chain covers, to keep grit and mud off the drivetrain. They seem like a great option if riding on dirt roads a lot or in lots of rain, especially in a long trip.
Would reduce drivetrain wear by a lot, and chain cleaning too.
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Re: Tools and mechanic skills required with a Thorn Raven tour?
..I'd consider a couple of spare bolts for the handlebar grip shifter (the M4 torx bolts which bolt the cable stop housing to the body of the grip shifter) when I was using a rolhoff speed hub, one of these bolts fell out, and I couldn't shift gears, until I replaced it. I might have got away with using a cable tie, but I didn't have any of those either.
...i'd also carry a flexi spoke, some touch up paint (air travel allowing), a spare rolhoff oil screw, and some spare rolhoff oil in a little bottle (air travel allowing)
...However as Turkey isn't outer Mongolia I might be erring too much on the side of caution..
...i'd also carry a flexi spoke, some touch up paint (air travel allowing), a spare rolhoff oil screw, and some spare rolhoff oil in a little bottle (air travel allowing)
...However as Turkey isn't outer Mongolia I might be erring too much on the side of caution..
Re: Tools and mechanic skills required with a Thorn Raven tour?
Yes and no. Because you can reverse the sprocket you can get a lot of miles out of one. The new splined versions are very easy to change and not that expensive. I’d use perhaps two chains per side. I never measure wear and run it until it is slack with no further eccentric adjustments. You could remove a link and carry on although I draw the line there. It really is very simple tech, until you look inside the hub. It is different on my derailleurs where a worn chain starts skipping. Chain glider cases are good as long as they can fit your frame and give greatly reduced chain wear. My thorn raven tour had one and was good, the tighter clearance on the raven sport tour in the same size worked less well.djb wrote: ↑8 Aug 2021, 11:37amMy comment waa more in response to someone here who said just let the chain drivetrain wear all together until it's all worn out.hufty wrote: ↑6 Aug 2021, 1:26pm That's a good rule for derailleurs where the rear cogs wear at different rates and so a "stretched" chain may catch or ramp in certain gears. That's not going to happen where there's only one chain ring at the front and one cog at the back so you can basically fit and forget if you want to.
Even with a rohlof I reckon it's prudent to change a chain at the 1/8 mark as teeth are teeth, and why wear a nice chain ring or special rohlof rear cog more than necessary.
Seems to me that rohlof or derailleur, teeth on cogs will be worn by an overly stretched chain the same.
On this note, when I was considering getting a rohlof for my tough touring bike, I was very interested in those hebie? Or whatever brand chain covers, to keep grit and mud off the drivetrain. They seem like a great option if riding on dirt roads a lot or in lots of rain, especially in a long trip.
Would reduce drivetrain wear by a lot, and chain cleaning too.