Cycling on the A5

Cycle-touring, Expeditions, Adventures, Major cycle routes NOT LeJoG (see other special board)
thelawnet
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Re: Cycling on the A5

Postby thelawnet » 16 Mar 2019, 1:53am

cheadle hulme wrote:
DougR wrote:Tell your martian buddy that a stationary vehicle on the hard shoulder of a Brit motorway has a 50% chance of being involved in an accident inside an hour.


My martian buddy finds this hard to believe and asks if you have any evidence for the rate you quote? :D


since this has been bumped and is obviously ludicrous, I found this

https://www.autobutler.co.uk/blog/11-mi ... d-shoulder

"Did you know the average time before a car is hit by another vehicle is 11 minutes when stopped on the hard shoulder?"

And a source, which says something completely different
https://trl.co.uk/sites/default/files/TRL465.pdf
"Between June and September 1999 the Highways
Agency instigated a questionnaire survey of drivers
stopped on the hard shoulder to determine their reasons for
stopping and, where vehicles were there as a result of an
accident, the circumstance"

"Three hundred and sixty vehicles (77% of the total)
had stopped on the hard shoulder as a result of
accidents. Twenty four of these had been involved in
collisions with vehicles already on the hard shoulder.
Vehicles hit while parked on the hard shoulder had
been there for an average of just over 11 minutes
and, in two cases, for as little as 10 seconds."

In other words of about 468 vehicles questioned on the hard shoulder, 24, or ~5% had been in accidents while stopped on that hard shoulder. And of those 24 that were hit, the average time before they were hit was 11 minutes.

That of course leaves 444 vehicles that were not hit.

Which makes the 11 minute & 30 minute stats ridiculous.
Last edited by thelawnet on 16 Mar 2019, 11:28am, edited 2 times in total.

Thehairs1970
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Re: Cycling on the A5

Postby Thehairs1970 » 16 Mar 2019, 7:20am

cheadle hulme wrote:
DougR wrote:Tell your martian buddy that a stationary vehicle on the hard shoulder of a Brit motorway has a 50% chance of being involved in an accident inside an hour.


My martian buddy finds this hard to believe and asks if you have any evidence for the rate you quote? :D

French autoroutes and N roads have shoulders, but they're a lot more casual about it, often on N roads, they can be used as a nice 1m cycle lane. Sometimes they're even marked as a cycle lane!!

Although I wouldn't fancy cycling up the M6 shoulder, I think we're a bit over the top in terms of the danger levels - willing to be convinced otherwise with accident stats though....


There's nobody on French motorways. In fact there's nobody in France.

Hard shoulders on British motorways are notoriously dangerous. That's why roadside workers get paid well. Also as the lower speed limit on motorways is 50mph, it's not for me.

drossall
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Re: Cycling on the A5

Postby drossall » 16 Mar 2019, 8:14am

Thehairs1970 wrote:Also as the lower speed limit on motorways is 50mph, it's not for me.

?? What lower speed limit? There isn't one (although you could in principle get pulled over for delaying traffic unreasonably if you went at 10mph, I imagine.

And speed limits don't apply to bikes anyway. Not that that's relevant on motorways, given that they aren't allowed there in the first place.

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mjr
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Re: Cycling on the A5

Postby mjr » 16 Mar 2019, 10:49am

bilban wrote:This just reminded me, I cycled a short stretch, from Long Buckby to near to just past Weedon Bec, with another person late/afternoon/dusk. And it was utterly utterly horrible. This was about 15 years back. When there are two trucks coming from opposing directions, you are pretty much stuffed. Avoid if at all possible.

I agree this is a popular back route, I had assumed traffic would be using the M1, and was amazed at the quantity of freight on it. Heart was in the back of my mouth for most of the journey, and I regret putting another cyclist in danger on that day.

I used to ride the A5 near this decades ago. I've driven it recently and the layout has changed little and not for the better. I wouldn't ride it now. Use the parallel back roads like Deanshanger-Whittlebury-Maidford- National 50, or Towcester-Gayton-Flore. And curse Highways England for not fixing this relatively simple road yet: it used to be mostly three lane single carriageway and has now been repainted as two lane but they've preferred to use the extra as wide shoulders or centre hatching instead of cycleways.
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freiston
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Re: Cycling on the A5

Postby freiston » 17 Mar 2019, 12:11am

I cycled the stretch between Tamworth and Brownhills a few times in the early eighties (it no longer runs entirely the same route) and it was hell then. As well as the traffic, there was a lot of debris and broken glass on the road, as I recall it.
Disclaimer: Treat what I say with caution and if possible, wait for someone with more knowledge and experience to contribute. ;)

landsurfer
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Re: Cycling on the A5

Postby landsurfer » 17 Mar 2019, 6:32am

DougR wrote:
cheadle hulme wrote:
DougR wrote:Tell your martian buddy that a stationary vehicle on the hard shoulder of a Brit motorway has a 50% chance of being involved in an accident inside an hour.


My martian buddy finds this hard to believe and asks if you have any evidence for the rate you quote? :D
...
Although I wouldn't fancy cycling up the M6 shoulder, I think we're a bit over the top in terms of the danger levels - willing to be convinced otherwise with accident stats though....


Source was a police road safety lecture for BP in the early nineties - but that wasn't his best stat.

What is the fastest moving thing on a busy UK Motorway? - Answer a tailback - in heavy traffic the leading edge of the compression travels upstream at three miles a miles a minute - 180 mph.


In 2016 i read of a mother and son being killed by debris while standing beside their car on the M3 awaiting a break down waggon. The paper made the statement that their research could show no passengers or drivers in stationary cars on motorway hard shoulders being killed or seriously injured in a 12 year period but 17 major injuries and 5 deaths of people standing by the motorway awaiting rescue. Detached wheels, HGV tyre debris and on one occasion a bottle of urine caused the injuries.
My family always stay in the vehicle, seatbelts on, handbrake off or at the lowest setting to prevent roll, in neutral.
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pwa
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Re: Cycling on the A5

Postby pwa » 17 Mar 2019, 7:19am

I use the nearest motorway quite a lot, several times a week usually, and I have yet to see signs of an accident on the hard shoulder. I see vehicles stopped on the hard shoulder but I have yet to see one that has been driven into. So I reckon that 50% figure has the decimal point in the wrong place.

Bonefishblues
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Re: Cycling on the A5

Postby Bonefishblues » 17 Mar 2019, 8:50am

landsurfer wrote:My family always stay in the vehicle, seatbelts on, handbrake off or at the lowest setting to prevent roll, in neutral.

That sounds like you have numbers of breakdowns?

Cyril Haearn
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Re: Cycling on the A5

Postby Cyril Haearn » 17 Mar 2019, 8:56am

landsurfer wrote:..
My family always stay in the vehicle, seatbelts on, handbrake off or at the lowest setting to prevent roll, in neutral

I thought the advice was, get the vehicle as far from the running lanes as possible, put on the hazard lights, get all people out on the near side and go behind the crash barrier, up or down the bank if possible
Gear engaged, handbrake on of course

Often seen trucks meandering into the shoulder, maybe while the driver lights a ciggie or shaves, Minus One
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Thehairs1970
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Re: Cycling on the A5

Postby Thehairs1970 » 23 Mar 2019, 5:33pm

drossall wrote:
Thehairs1970 wrote:Also as the lower speed limit on motorways is 50mph, it's not for me.

?? What lower speed limit? There isn't one (although you could in principle get pulled over for delaying traffic unreasonably if you went at 10mph, I imagine.

And speed limits don't apply to bikes anyway. Not that that's relevant on motorways, given that they aren't allowed there in the first place.


Blimey! I always thought you had to have a vehicle capable of maintaining an average of 50mph.
My tongue was firmly in cheek when I made my comment though.

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Mick F
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Re: Cycling on the A5

Postby Mick F » 23 Mar 2019, 6:08pm

My sister had an old Landrover for a while, and that wouldn't do much above 50mph.
The police pulled her over on the M6 for going too slow and advised her not to use her LR on a motorway at all.
Mick F. Cornwall

drossall
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Re: Cycling on the A5

Postby drossall » 23 Mar 2019, 7:23pm

Thehairs1970 wrote:Blimey! I always thought you had to have a vehicle capable of maintaining an average of 50mph.

Consensus from a quick Google is that the vehicle has to be able to maintain 25mph (on level ground).
My tongue was firmly in cheek when I made my comment though.

:D

Aquila
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Re: Cycling on the A5

Postby Aquila » 24 Mar 2019, 10:57am

Niborf wrote:Hi,

Just like to say a big thanks for all your input re the A5 - most notably from MartinBrice. I have now completed the trip and am thankfully alive to tell the tale. As I had 233 miles to cover in 2 days (Battersea, London to Ilkley, N.Yorks), I decided I had no option but to go for the A5, since I figured that A roads are all going to be much of a muchness and I didn't much fancy the idea of going through Northampton and Leicester as an alternative. Having tested out the first section of the A5 (J9, MI to Hockliffe) the day before I was ready to accept the challenge. I decided to take Martin's advice and started out at 7am about 3 miles due south of Milton Keynes and made it to Hinckley in approx 4 hours (60miles). It's certainly wasn't the scariest part of the trip, and I was really pleased to have broken the back of that day's journey by midday. I gave me the confidence to go further than I expected that day, clocking up a total of 120 miles that day to get as far as Buxton, Derbyshire (I was aiming for Ashbourne). I'm glad I did as the next day the conditions were not so good and the cycling much harder. So if anyone wants a detailed analysis on the first section of the A5 to Hinckley - I'm your man!


Your a braver man than me.....I doth my cap sir not a chance in hell you'd catch me cycling on the A5

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Sweep
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Re: Cycling on the A5

Postby Sweep » 25 Mar 2019, 6:58pm

Curious trip niborf.
Am impressed.
Can I ask what you did about sleeping?
Apologies if I have missed something upthread.
Sweep