Rear view mirrors?

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stewartpratt
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Re: Rear view mirrors?

Postby stewartpratt » 20 Mar 2012, 10:56pm

Tacascarow wrote:What about when you're overtaking slower traffic (like cyclists) do you pull in blindly & hope you have passed them?


Well, knowing what it's like to be the cyclist I'd like to think that when I do overtake it's not remotely marginal anyway - if I don't know I'm easily past without having to look then it's not a move I'd make in the first place. If it was marginal then they'd be right in the blind spot anyway. Either way, the mirrors aren't really contributing too much.

That aside, it's a slightly moot point in this context since on a bike you aren't the overtaker anyway. (And how many cyclists fit a mirror to the nearside?)

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horizon
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Re: Rear view mirrors?

Postby horizon » 20 Mar 2012, 11:09pm

crossroads wrote:
horizon wrote:If you use a Blackburn drop bar mirror, there is little or no vibration, the mirror is large enough to see cars a long way off, especially at night, and it allows you to see cars you cannot hear - the ones following the one you can hear. A mirror enables you to ride assertively because you can constantly check where cars are and position yourself accordingly. It's not my job to encourage you to use a mirror - it's your choice. But how you cycle safely and calmly without one, I don't know.


on the last point - Very easily


I don't like my MTB mirror much (it tends to swivel as it's strapped to the hand grip) so on one trip I didn't use it for long periods and was able to compare. All I would say is that it is really a personal choice and I didn't want to make the case for using one, just to report my feelings. To me it is so useful that my remark for me still stands - I really don't know how you can ride in traffic as well as you can with a mirror*. Having said that, other folks have different ways and what they choose is entirely up to them. BTW I've amended my original post to "But how you can cycle as safely and as calmly without one, I don't know."

* The mirror seems to support a certain style of riding where you constantly place yourself in relation to vehicles on the road behind you and affect their behaviour as a consequence. I don't know how you can realistically do that without a mirror but, as I said, other people have other ways of riding.

PS Any expansion on the "very easily" would be appreciated (genuinely).
Last edited by horizon on 20 Mar 2012, 11:25pm, edited 2 times in total.
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horizon
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Re: Rear view mirrors?

Postby horizon » 20 Mar 2012, 11:13pm

stewartpratt wrote:
crossroads wrote:on the last point - Very easily


+1, though I'm tempted to have a fling with the B&M to see what (if anything) I'm missing out on.

Assuming you can perform a shoulder check safely, I'm still a little lost as to how much they help (though I could see one being rather more useful on the tandem). If someone's going to drive a car into the back of you then being able to watch them do it doesn't seem particularly advantageous (and if they're going to miss you then I'm not sure what you gain either). I quite like having to look around anyway, since it's an indication to anyone behind that you're likely to want to make some sort of manoeuvre.


stewart: you really don't have to use one you know. Very few cyclists do - at least I haven't noticed them.
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snibgo
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Re: Rear view mirrors?

Postby snibgo » 21 Mar 2012, 3:11am

stewartpratt wrote:I quite like having to look around anyway, since it's an indication to anyone behind that you're likely to want to make some sort of manoeuvre.

It's no substitute for a proper look (and I never manoeuvre without a proper look), but one advantage is that I can see what's happening without the motorist knowing. They are more cautious around me when they think I don't know they are there.

This effect is very obvious when I am walking around narrow village streets that have no pavements. When I hear a car coming behind me, if I don't look round it will slow down and overtake very carefully. If I do look round, it will continue charging forwards.

zojosc
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Re: Rear view mirrors?

Postby zojosc » 21 Mar 2012, 7:54am

snibgo wrote:
stewartpratt wrote:
This effect is very obvious when I am walking around narrow village streets that have no pavements. When I hear a car coming behind me, if I don't look round it will slow down and overtake very carefully. If I do look round, it will continue charging forwards.


I was always told as a child that when walking on the road to walk on the side of the road of oncoming traffic.

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Ambler
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Re: Rear view mirrors?

Postby Ambler » 21 Mar 2012, 8:22am

So was I but most of the tourists who visit this area seem to walk on the left.

On mirrors, I find it much easier to see cars with headlights passing, (in daylight) so these new car daytime headlight requirements will help.

stewartpratt
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Re: Rear view mirrors?

Postby stewartpratt » 21 Mar 2012, 8:25am

horizon wrote:stewart: you really don't have to use one you know. Very few cyclists do - at least I haven't noticed them.


Oh, I know - I've managed fine for over 20 years without one and rarely if ever felt that I've needed one. But I'm the curious type.

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Re: Rear view mirrors?

Postby johnb » 21 Mar 2012, 12:50pm

stewartpratt wrote:
Tacascarow wrote:What about when you're overtaking slower traffic (like cyclists) do you pull in blindly & hope you have passed them?



That aside, it's a slightly moot point in this context since on a bike you aren't the overtaker anyway. (And how many cyclists fit a mirror to the nearside?)


I do.

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crossroads
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Re: Rear view mirrors?

Postby crossroads » 21 Mar 2012, 4:39pm

horizon wrote:PS Any expansion on the "very easily" would be appreciated (genuinely).


I did not want to take it further because I did not want to dig down into the old 'I do/I Don't' debate (that rage on here with Helmets, RLJ, Mirrors etc etc.) which seemed a bit pointless.
I find I ride perfectly happily and safely (and calmly) without the need for a mirror. I don’t get stressed and I ride every day to work (for the last 7 years at any rate) in a built up area, and I must admit I fail to see why I would need one but there you go, each to their own.
Edit: Also to add that if I make a manoeuvre I always look behind me and still would even if I did have a mirror, so my feeling is a mirror would be redundant. Simply seeing cars etc behind me all the time would not offer me any comfort when I am cycling along straight and true (if you get what I mean).

stewartpratt
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Re: Rear view mirrors?

Postby stewartpratt » 21 Mar 2012, 6:08pm

johnb wrote:I do.


What is the benefit of a nearside one? (Genuine question - albeit from the position of currently being sceptical about the value of an offside one...)

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Re: Rear view mirrors?

Postby johnb » 21 Mar 2012, 6:28pm

stewartpratt wrote:
johnb wrote:I do.


What is the benefit of a nearside one? (Genuine question - albeit from the position of currently being sceptical about the value of an offside one...)



The mirrors I use go on before the handlebars are wrapped. So as I tour on the continent a lot, its easier to put one both sides rather than changing back and forth.
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horizon
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Re: Rear view mirrors?

Postby horizon » 21 Mar 2012, 6:36pm

crossroads wrote:
horizon wrote:PS Any expansion on the "very easily" would be appreciated (genuinely).


I did not want to take it further because I did not want to dig down into the old 'I do/I Don't' debate (that rage on here with Helmets, RLJ, Mirrors etc etc.) which seemed a bit pointless.
I find I ride perfectly happily and safely (and calmly) without the need for a mirror. I don’t get stressed and I ride every day to work (for the last 7 years at any rate) in a built up area, and I must admit I fail to see why I would need one but there you go, each to their own.
Edit: Also to add that if I make a manoeuvre I always look behind me and still would even if I did have a mirror, so my feeling is a mirror would be redundant. Simply seeing cars etc behind me all the time would not offer me any comfort when I am cycling along straight and true (if you get what I mean).


Thank you.
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thirdcrank
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Re: Rear view mirrors?

Postby thirdcrank » 21 Mar 2012, 6:46pm

I have two mirrors on my shopping bike. It has quite wide handlebars and I find that the usual approach for looking around - left hand near the centre of the bars, remove right hand, look round - doesn't work very well at all. I have two Zéfal Dooback mirrors and it's a system I've been pleased with for well over ten years - nearly 15 when I think about it.

I suppose it's all a matter of personal preference.

I've not read every post in this thread by any means because we've had one or two similar before. Parallels with motor cycling are often drawn. I'll stick my neck out and say that a it seems to me that some things prescribed by instructors have more to do with the pupil being required to do something which is easily observable by the instructor. It's possible to check a mirror with an almost imperceptible movement of the eyeballs and that just won't do at all.

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matt2matt2002
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Re: Rear view mirrors?

Postby matt2matt2002 » 21 Mar 2012, 7:49pm

Bit late to chip in my 2 pee worth but here goes...
I fitted a mirror 10 months ago and now find it very strange not to cycle with one.
Maybe this just proves that we get use to things and then miss them when they are gone? Rather than anything about the benefits of a mirror.
:wink:
However, most of my cycling is done on narrow roads up here in Scotlandshire and whenever a car drives towards me I always check my mirror to see if owt is coming up behind and I am about to become a bike sarnie.
If this looks likely then I pull in rather than be brown bread!
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stewartpratt
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Re: Rear view mirrors?

Postby stewartpratt » 21 Mar 2012, 9:26pm

johnb wrote:I tour on the continent a lot


Makes sense :)

(slightly jealous)