Very tentatively considering JOGLE 2020 - ideas?

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LittleGreyCat
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Very tentatively considering JOGLE 2020 - ideas?

Postby LittleGreyCat » 24 Aug 2019, 5:37pm

In September 2020 I will be 70 years old.
Scary thought, but apart from getting wasted on the day I was wondering how to suitably celebrate.

As i'm just getting into touring cycling at around 40-50 miles a day I was very tentatively contemplating doing JOGLE in September 2020 with the aim to finish around my birthday at the end of September.

I realise that this is right at the end of the normal season but it seemed appropriate.

https://cycle.travel/map/journey/122770 is a simple reversal of a LEJOG route posted on this forum as a Cycle.Travel route avoiding the most extreme hills, and it does seem an attractive route.

The simplest option seems to be credit card B&B, with the downside of not being 100% sure what each day will bring and if you will make the planned evening stop.

The simplest solution to this would be to plan a conservative schedule and accept that you might take a few days longer and have days when you arrived at your destination early. Alternatively, book the first few nights and then wing it.

Today we are near the end of August and the beginning of September.
Looking at the rain radar it is hurling it down from Inverness upwards, to it would be reasonable to assume that there are likely to be a good few wet days until the ride gets south of Leeds. Global warming only seems to apply from the Midlands down.

Assuming a total route length of 1091 miles at 60 miles per day that gives 18 days cycling which does seem reasonable.
Advice from http://cycle-endtoend.org.uk/index.php?option=com_jefaq&view=faq&Itemid=218 suggests that rest days may not be a good idea because people struggle to get back into the rythm after a day off (also seen in the TdF).
There is also the issue of flat days and hilly days; presumably the hilly days should be planned as shorter days (as long as they can be identified).

The biggest message I have so far is not to be too ambitious; one recent thread had some bold cyclist blowing his legs away about half way down after a day of about 200 km of hard hills. 30-40 miles of hills and 60-70 miles of flat seems much more reasonable.

The other main issue is support.
I don't have anyone lined up as a ride partner (which would make life a bit easier on the lonely bits) nor do I currently have a support vehicle and driver.
It might be possible if our ancient cat finally snuffs it, but even then 20 days pootling along just to support a cyclist doesn't seem like the holiday of a lifetime. 60 miles a day is a full day on a bike but not in a car.

Anyway, this is all very tentative and I'm looking for any experiences from people who have attempted a similar route, and how accommodation was found, and if real life was anything near the planning.

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robgul
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Re: Very tentatively considering JOGLE 2020 - ideas?

Postby robgul » 24 Aug 2019, 5:54pm

Go for it - either fully-planned or part-planned for stops.

My first E2E was to be with a friend but he, for health reasons with his wife, had to drop out ... I posted a "lonely hearts" message here and on yacf seeking a riding companion - found one - we met up for a couple of rides, decided we got on and went for it in June 2005 (See Rob & Joe's JOGLE in the Journals on the http://www.cycle-endtoend.org.uk website ... I'm the Rob in the story, and run the website)

As for support - that's cheating :D - it's no big deal to carry luggage if you're doing B&B - and if you're desperate for something there are shops!

.... and I would recommend JOGLE for a first effort as the hills in Scotland aren't as brutal as Cornwal giving you the chance to get match-fit en route (and for most people getting home from LE is rather easier with regular trains from Penzance)

We planned to the nth degree and that remains my preferred solution - a credit card and a taxi can cope with a disaster!

Rob

PS - I'm almost tempted to suggest joining you - I'm a couple of years older than you . . . .

LittleGreyCat
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Re: Very tentatively considering JOGLE 2020 - ideas?

Postby LittleGreyCat » 24 Aug 2019, 6:16pm

robgul wrote:Go for it - either fully-planned or part-planned for stops.

My first E2E was to be with a friend but he, for health reasons with his wife, had to drop out ... I posted a "lonely hearts" message here and on yacf seeking a riding companion - found one - we met up for a couple of rides, decided we got on and went for it in June 2005 (See Rob & Joe's JOGLE in the Journals on the http://www.cycle-endtoend.org.uk website ... I'm the Rob in the story, and run the website)

As for support - that's cheating :D - it's no big deal to carry luggage if you're doing B&B - and if you're desperate for something there are shops!

.... and I would recommend JOGLE for a first effort as the hills in Scotland aren't as brutal as Cornwal giving you the chance to get match-fit en route (and for most people getting home from LE is rather easier with regular trains from Penzance)

We planned to the nth degree and that remains my preferred solution - a credit card and a taxi can cope with a disaster!

Rob

PS - I'm almost tempted to suggest joining you - I'm a couple of years older than you . . . .


I've no objection to an experienced companion as long as we are reasonably matched in our abilities and expectations. :D

I know that it is still very tentative, but you are always welcome to give in to temptation.

I'm based in Suffolk so not very much hill climbing experience.

rareposter
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Re: Very tentatively considering JOGLE 2020 - ideas?

Postby rareposter » 24 Aug 2019, 8:28pm

My preferred option for touring has always been to have a route in mind with some options to accommodate being faster or slower than expected. Around lunchtime, work out where I'll be based on how fast I've been so far, how much more riding I actually want to do and therefore where I'll be at maybe 6pm. Then look online (booking.com is good for this), find appropriate accommodation and book it.

If you're doing the ride in September, you'll be out of holiday season and therefore most places shouldn't be too rammed - that approach does not always work in July / August in tourist hotspots!

However it does cover off things like wanting to stop a bit early if you're tired or to avoid torrential rain or wanting to extend the day a bit because it's a lovely evening with a tailwind. It also means that if the weather is against you or you've had mechanicals or been slowed down for whatever reason, you're not pushing on into darkness, just to make it to a certain overnight stop that you booked a month before.

To be honest, the riding is the easy part, even aged 70. It's the logistics that cause the biggest headaches for people!

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Paulatic
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Re: Very tentatively considering JOGLE 2020 - ideas?

Postby Paulatic » 24 Aug 2019, 8:32pm

I would echo @rareposter that seems very good advice.
Whatever I am, wherever I am, this is me. This is my life

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Spinners
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Re: Very tentatively considering JOGLE 2020 - ideas?

Postby Spinners » 25 Aug 2019, 7:29am

It'll make a brilliant birthday celebration and September is a good choice anyway.
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robgul
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Re: Very tentatively considering JOGLE 2020 - ideas?

Postby robgul » 25 Aug 2019, 7:33am

LittleGreyCat wrote:
robgul wrote:Go for it - either fully-planned or part-planned for stops.

My first E2E was to be with a friend but he, for health reasons with his wife, had to drop out ... I posted a "lonely hearts" message here and on yacf seeking a riding companion - found one - we met up for a couple of rides, decided we got on and went for it in June 2005 (See Rob & Joe's JOGLE in the Journals on the http://www.cycle-endtoend.org.uk website ... I'm the Rob in the story, and run the website)

As for support - that's cheating :D - it's no big deal to carry luggage if you're doing B&B - and if you're desperate for something there are shops!

.... and I would recommend JOGLE for a first effort as the hills in Scotland aren't as brutal as Cornwal giving you the chance to get match-fit en route (and for most people getting home from LE is rather easier with regular trains from Penzance)

We planned to the nth degree and that remains my preferred solution - a credit card and a taxi can cope with a disaster!

Rob

PS - I'm almost tempted to suggest joining you - I'm a couple of years older than you . . . .


I've no objection to an experienced companion as long as we are reasonably matched in our abilities and expectations. :D

I know that it is still very tentative, but you are always welcome to give in to temptation.

I'm based in Suffolk so not very much hill climbing experience.


I've sent a PM . . . . now possibly planning my application for a "kitchen pass" :wink:

Rob

Jamesh
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Re: Very tentatively considering JOGLE 2020 - ideas?

Postby Jamesh » 25 Aug 2019, 9:19am

Given your previous form!

I would think 70 miles per day would be appropriate to your age!!

Unless you really want to see the countryside then 50 miles might be too long!

How do I get a kitchen pass lol!

Cheers James

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NATURAL ANKLING
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Re: Very tentatively considering JOGLE 2020 - ideas?

Postby NATURAL ANKLING » 25 Aug 2019, 9:42am

Hi,
Say you will do the washing up for a year/ whatever pleases :P
Once you hit a certain age getting a free pass is easy, normally they can't wait for you to get you leg over.......your bike :lol:
NA Thinks Just End 2 End Return + Bivvy
You'll Still Find Me At The Top Of A Hill
Please forgive the poor Grammar I blame it on my mobile and phat thinkers.

PH
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Re: Very tentatively considering JOGLE 2020 - ideas?

Postby PH » 25 Aug 2019, 11:14am

Do it, what's the worst that can happen? You're not enjoying it so you go home?
There's a middle way with a couple of the options.
Accommodation - We booked every third night, knowing that's where we needed to be to stay on schedule, then winged it for the other two (Except in the Highlands where we were concerned about not finding anywhere)
Riding partner/s - My preference for riding with others is to not be under any obligation to stay together all the time. If this is clear from the start, there's no feeling of compromise or holding the other person up, if one of you wants to wait an hour at a location for the perfect sunset photo and the other just wants to get there... If you plan to leave together, ride together, stop together and arrive together, you'll either be very well matched or much more tolerant than me!

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robgul
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Re: Very tentatively considering JOGLE 2020 - ideas?

Postby robgul » 25 Aug 2019, 12:26pm

PH wrote:Do it, what's the worst that can happen? You're not enjoying it so you go home?
There's a middle way with a couple of the options.
Accommodation - We booked every third night, knowing that's where we needed to be to stay on schedule, then winged it for the other two (Except in the Highlands where we were concerned about not finding anywhere)
Riding partner/s - My preference for riding with others is to not be under any obligation to stay together all the time. If this is clear from the start, there's no feeling of compromise or holding the other person up, if one of you wants to wait an hour at a location for the perfect sunset photo and the other just wants to get there... If you plan to leave together, ride together, stop together and arrive together, you'll either be very well matched or much more tolerant than me!


The issue as implied in parts of Scotland is that accommodation being listed as being at "x" could well be 30 miles from there - not a problem in a car but not so clever on a bike - that's why I booked every day for the whole trip.

... and yes to not necessarily riding together - when i rode JOGLE I was the better rider and waited every now and again for Joe - on LEJOG Jon was the better rider (and MUCH younger) so he rode and waited for me.

Rob

LittleGreyCat
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Re: Very tentatively considering JOGLE 2020 - ideas?

Postby LittleGreyCat » 25 Aug 2019, 1:48pm

Riding together(ish) is a delicate balancing act.

On our mini tour one rider had a problem with loose spokes (took about an hour of twiddling with the combined toolkit to fix) and a thorn puncture (perhaps 15-30 minutes to fix.

We were riding as a group of 3 and so were all there to offer helpful advice at both incidents. :D

There has to be a balance between one rider powering up a hill and another spinning slowly, and one rider having a mechanical and perhaps needing something from the joint toolkit.

So how far ahead do you get and how long do you wait before turning back to help?

I am assuming that you can't guarantee a mobile signal at all times.

Edited to add: if you are cycling at 10 mph then in 6 minutes you are a mile away. after 10 minutes of "no contact" that is a minimum of around 4 miles and 20 minutes extra on the ride.
Assuming that you aren't going down hill and have to climb back.
Even if you wait at the top of a climb you face the possibility of having to cycle back down and do the climb again.
OK if you are feeling chipper and it is a sunny day and a shortish ride.
Not so good if it is pouring with rain and there has been a headwind all day.

LittleGreyCat
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Re: Very tentatively considering JOGLE 2020 - ideas?

Postby LittleGreyCat » 25 Aug 2019, 3:40pm

Idly looking up train times and I can get to Thurso by 22:20 in a single day of train travel.
Almost £200 as an anytime fare, though.
It does save money from an overnight stop part way.

This also means stopping in central Thurso and not in various attractive looking B&B locations to the North.

However a hard core start to an adventure.
14 hours 17 minutes on a train.
19 miles to JoG the next day to reach the starting point.
Presumably another 40 miles to get the first day's ride rolling.
20 of which would be retracing steps to Thurso.

Alternatively arrive at 22.52 at Wick then cycle North the next day to avoid the retracing of steps, possibly stopping in Thurso to make the first day easy at around 40 miles.

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Re: Very tentatively considering JOGLE 2020 - ideas?

Postby PH » 25 Aug 2019, 4:07pm

LittleGreyCat wrote:Idly looking up train times and I can get to Thurso by 22:20 in a single day of train travel.
Almost £200 as an anytime fare, though.

Yes but why would you be using an anytime fare? You're going to need to book the bike on so it'll be specified trains and the cheap tickets won't be available till around 12 weeks before. I doubt it's the cheapest of trips, but expect it to be around half the price of an anytime. You might also look at the LNER fares if you can get over to Grantham or Peterborough, there's sometimes real bargains (Grantham > Edinburgh last year for £14) though it might be a job to fit them in with the other parts of the journey.
We travelled by train from Derby to Wick which took all day, spent the night in Wick and rode Wick > Jog > Bettyhill on the first day, which is 70 miles. or as you say Thurso would have been 40.

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robgul
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Re: Very tentatively considering JOGLE 2020 - ideas?

Postby robgul » 25 Aug 2019, 4:12pm

. . . . . I thought this was very tentative for 12 months from now?? - looks like you've probably already got your panniers out and the kit laid out on the bed in the spare room :D

AND - yes, don't fret about getting trains yet - loads of options and bargains nearer the time.

Rob