Jess Varnish ..

landsurfer
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Re: Jess Varnish ..

Postby landsurfer » 11 Dec 2018, 7:06pm

mjr wrote:
landsurfer wrote:No ... just read the article in the Grauniad ... often wondered what her issue was .... discrimination, bullying, rude Aussies .... but Laura Kenny grew during the coach's tenure .... and went fast enough ...... JV didn't. Her funding was removed because she did not meet performance standards, i believe, feel free to put me right.

Let's leave that to the hearings. It wouldn't be the first time BC was accused of removing funding from a woman for other reasons.


WOW ... what where the other occasions ?
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Re: Jess Varnish ..

Postby 1982john » 11 Dec 2018, 8:10pm

landsurfer wrote:
mjr wrote:
landsurfer wrote:No ... just read the article in the Grauniad ... often wondered what her issue was .... discrimination, bullying, rude Aussies .... but Laura Kenny grew during the coach's tenure .... and went fast enough ...... JV didn't. Her funding was removed because she did not meet performance standards, i believe, feel free to put me right.

Let's leave that to the hearings. It wouldn't be the first time BC was accused of removing funding from a woman for other reasons.


WOW ... what where the other occasions ?


https://www.cyclist.co.uk/news/2179/has ... e-taxpayer

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Re: Jess Varnish ..

Postby pjclinch » 12 Dec 2018, 4:06pm

landsurfer wrote:No ... just read the article in the Grauniad ... often wondered what her issue was .... discrimination, bullying, rude Aussies .... but Laura Kenny grew during the coach's tenure .... and went fast enough ...... JV didn't. Her funding was removed because she did not meet performance standards, i believe, feel free to put me right.


You seem to have missed the fact that there's more to the whole thing than race times.
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Re: Jess Varnish ..

Postby Bonefishblues » 12 Dec 2018, 4:29pm

landsurfer wrote:
De Sisti wrote:
landsurfer wrote:So she was dropped for being too slow .... and now she will destroy the incomes of all semi professional cyclists .... discuss.

Me thinks the OP has a vested inerest in this. :roll:


No ... just read the article in the Grauniad ... often wondered what her issue was .... discrimination, bullying, rude Aussies .... but Laura Kenny grew during the coach's tenure .... and went fast enough ...... JV didn't. Her funding was removed because she did not meet performance standards, i believe, feel free to put me right.

The issue is why one did and one didn't.

If JV had every opportunity and failed, so be it. If it's the case that of the two, only LK was able to stand the oppressive and bullying climate that prevailed (it is alleged), then that's a wholly different matter (or if it was directed at JV alone, perhaps?).

That is what the ET is there to judge.

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Re: Jess Varnish ..

Postby awavey » 15 Dec 2018, 2:14pm

Bonefishblues wrote:
landsurfer wrote:
De Sisti wrote:Me thinks the OP has a vested inerest in this. :roll:


No ... just read the article in the Grauniad ... often wondered what her issue was .... discrimination, bullying, rude Aussies .... but Laura Kenny grew during the coach's tenure .... and went fast enough ...... JV didn't. Her funding was removed because she did not meet performance standards, i believe, feel free to put me right.

The issue is why one did and one didn't.

If JV had every opportunity and failed, so be it. If it's the case that of the two, only LK was able to stand the oppressive and bullying climate that prevailed (it is alleged), then that's a wholly different matter (or if it was directed at JV alone, perhaps?).

That is what the ET is there to judge.


its worth highlighting also that bullying cultures in the workplace tend not to be uniformly distributed, its not a one size fits all and everyone gets the same "bad" treatment, which unless you are on the receiving end of it can be sometimes hard to understand and why you often hear people in the same work environment whenever bullying allegations are raised say "well such and such never gave me any issues/cause for concern" it tends to be more focussed and targetted at specific individuals.

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Re: Jess Varnish ..

Postby Bonefishblues » 15 Dec 2018, 2:28pm

awavey wrote:
Bonefishblues wrote:
landsurfer wrote:
No ... just read the article in the Grauniad ... often wondered what her issue was .... discrimination, bullying, rude Aussies .... but Laura Kenny grew during the coach's tenure .... and went fast enough ...... JV didn't. Her funding was removed because she did not meet performance standards, i believe, feel free to put me right.

The issue is why one did and one didn't.

If JV had every opportunity and failed, so be it. If it's the case that of the two, only LK was able to stand the oppressive and bullying climate that prevailed (it is alleged), then that's a wholly different matter (or if it was directed at JV alone, perhaps?).

That is what the ET is there to judge.


its worth highlighting also that bullying cultures in the workplace tend not to be uniformly distributed, its not a one size fits all and everyone gets the same "bad" treatment, which unless you are on the receiving end of it can be sometimes hard to understand and why you often hear people in the same work environment whenever bullying allegations are raised say "well such and such never gave me any issues/cause for concern" it tends to be more focussed and targeted at specific individuals.

Yes, absolutely.

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Re: Jess Varnish ..

Postby reohn2 » 15 Dec 2018, 3:26pm

awavey wrote:
Bonefishblues wrote:
landsurfer wrote:
No ... just read the article in the Grauniad ... often wondered what her issue was .... discrimination, bullying, rude Aussies .... but Laura Kenny grew during the coach's tenure .... and went fast enough ...... JV didn't. Her funding was removed because she did not meet performance standards, i believe, feel free to put me right.

The issue is why one did and one didn't.

If JV had every opportunity and failed, so be it. If it's the case that of the two, only LK was able to stand the oppressive and bullying climate that prevailed (it is alleged), then that's a wholly different matter (or if it was directed at JV alone, perhaps?).

That is what the ET is there to judge.


its worth highlighting also that bullying cultures in the workplace tend not to be uniformly distributed, its not a one size fits all and everyone gets the same "bad" treatment, which unless you are on the receiving end of it can be sometimes hard to understand and why you often hear people in the same work environment whenever bullying allegations are raised say "well such and such never gave me any issues/cause for concern" it tends to be more focussed and targetted at specific individuals.

Quite right,ask the NCB Undermanager who when I worked as a Mining Deputy I jammed up against the wall of his office with his own desk for continually referring to one of my workmen of Indian descent as Sambo.
I thought it would cost me dearly,but as we were alone in his office at the time he didn't do much but crap himself and never ever used that name again.
That Undermanager was the biggest liar I've ever come across and a total creep to boot.
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Re: Jess Varnish ..

Postby thirdcrank » 15 Dec 2018, 3:33pm

Funding for élite athletes is inherently discriminatory.

landsurfer
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Re: Jess Varnish ..

Postby landsurfer » 15 Dec 2018, 8:22pm

thirdcrank wrote:Funding for élite athletes is inherently discriminatory.


So lets stop it .... if the Derby Track Racers can do it so can anyone ......No more state sponsored support ... for that is what it is .... lets pick our elite athletes from those the are really doing it in the real world ...... the Kenny's would have made it in pro teams .... or their not so elite as they think ... I think they would have excelled where ever they where ....
End the British Cycling cadre ... go and do it ... and reap the benefits .....
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Re: Jess Varnish ..

Postby Vorpal » 15 Dec 2018, 11:25pm

awavey wrote:its worth highlighting also that bullying cultures in the workplace tend not to be uniformly distributed, its not a one size fits all and everyone gets the same "bad" treatment, which unless you are on the receiving end of it can be sometimes hard to understand and why you often hear people in the same work environment whenever bullying allegations are raised say "well such and such never gave me any issues/cause for concern" it tends to be more focussed and targetted at specific individuals.

Not only that, but it affects different people differently. One person might have learned to stand up to it, another ignore it, and third have no idea how to deal with it. Some people are naturally sensitive and will take such things personally, no matter how hard they work not to. They just *feel* it in a way that others can't. People with something like ADHD, and some other disorders are particularly inclined to do that but many people without any disorders or particular problems have a similar sensitivity.
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Re: Jess Varnish ..

Postby pjclinch » 16 Dec 2018, 1:15pm

landsurfer wrote:
thirdcrank wrote:Funding for élite athletes is inherently discriminatory.


So lets stop it .... if the Derby Track Racers can do it so can anyone ......No more state sponsored support ... for that is what it is .... lets pick our elite athletes from those the are really doing it in the real world ...... the Kenny's would have made it in pro teams .... or their not so elite as they think ... I think they would have excelled where ever they where ....
End the British Cycling cadre ... go and do it ... and reap the benefits .....


Laura Kenny has had stints on the road with Wiggle that were reasonably successful, but Jason doesn't fit in to pro teams because he's a track sprinter. Note how Viviani and Cav, top line sprinters in road teams, are "endurance" on the track and wouldn't have a prayer in a match sprint or kierin at the top level as they don't have the raw power. Top track sprinters, OTOH, wouldn't have a prayer in a road bunch sprint because they'd have dropped off too much in the preceding 200 km.
I don't think there's a model for professional track sprinter outside of state sponsored support at present, but that support (at least in the UK) comes from lottery tickets and people who buy lottery tickets seem to be okay with that and are doing it voluntarily, so why stop that?
There's also the issue that for women pros it's very hard to make a living, even at the very top. Froome is a millionaire, Marianne Vos isn't.

Huub/Wattbike are a rather special case, because they're concentrating on one event where there's room for out-of-the-box thinking. They're fantastic and I loved their gold on Friday, but I can't really see it working with sprints.

Funding for scholarships for medical students is inherently discriminatory. Should we stop that too?

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Re: Jess Varnish ..

Postby thirdcrank » 16 Dec 2018, 1:30pm

Just to make myself clear: I was only making the point that funding élite athletes discriminates against everybody else. In the past it's been dressed up as shamateurism, giving people notional military ranks or even paying them as straightforward professionals. In the context of this thread, it does mean that for the relatively few at the top, there will be some who benefit and some who don't and the latter may be more acutely disappointed than I am at my failure to qualify for that status.

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Re: Jess Varnish ..

Postby RickH » 16 Dec 2018, 4:07pm

thirdcrank wrote:Just to make myself clear: I was only making the point that funding élite athletes discriminates against everybody else. In the past it's been dressed up as shamateurism, giving people notional military ranks or even paying them as straightforward professionals. In the context of this thread, it does mean that for the relatively few at the top, there will be some who benefit and some who don't and the latter may be more acutely disappointed than I am at my failure to qualify for that status.

In British Cycling, Sky sponsored the elite racing and the non-racing/social side of BC. When HSBC took over, their sponsorship included all levels of racing as well (though I don't know the proportions of what funding goes to who).

The lottery funding is aimed at winning medals, primarily Olympic, so is going to be limited to elite &, possibly, development riders otherwise the intent of the funding will have to be changed. BC are simply using the funding to "come up with the goods".

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Re: Jess Varnish ..

Postby landsurfer » 16 Dec 2018, 5:58pm

pjclinch wrote:
Funding for scholarships for medical students is inherently discriminatory. Should we stop that too?

Pete.


Is this a clickbait / troll moment .. medical students benefit themselves and all of society ... wherever they practice ... BC cyclists benefit themselves .. :)
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Re: Jess Varnish ..

Postby pjclinch » 17 Dec 2018, 9:27am

landsurfer wrote:
pjclinch wrote:
Funding for scholarships for medical students is inherently discriminatory. Should we stop that too?

Pete.


Is this a clickbait / troll moment .. medical students benefit themselves and all of society ... wherever they practice ... BC cyclists benefit themselves .. :)


ITYM "rhetorical question". If you doubt the Feelgood Factor of national sporting success I think you've been asleep since at least 2008. If you think that 100% of medical students go on to become public servants of medicine then again time to smell the coffee (I work in a teaching hospital, btw, so coffee in plentiful supply here).

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