Cargo bikes, which designs give the best ‘bang per buck’ ?

DIscuss anything relating to non-standard cycles and their equipment.
Carlton green
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Cargo bikes, which designs give the best ‘bang per buck’ ?

Post by Carlton green »

A bike can be a great way to move stuff and it’s amazing what you ‘can’ shift with a ‘normal’ bike. Cargo Bikes take things a step further and the likes of a Bakfiets / Long John is perhaps the most proven and versatile of designs. However Cargo Bikes can be heavy and expensive so unless you’re in need of the best, strong enough and can afford the best compromises need to be made.

Using a trailer is a good alternative and it is my plan ‘b’, however I want to normally stick to a total of two wheels and be able to carry some variety of cargo. What are the better ways to shift stuff without spending a fortune? My first thoughts are that long tailed bikes might be a useful step in the right direction.

Edit. Cargo Bike as defined here: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freight_bicycle
Last edited by Carlton green on 17 Oct 2021, 8:48am, edited 1 time in total.
Don’t fret, it’s OK to: ride a simple old bike; ride slowly, walk, rest and admire the view; ride off-road; ride in your raincoat; ride by yourself; ride in the dark; and ride one hundred yards or one hundred miles. Your bike and your choices to suit you.
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[XAP]Bob
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Re: Cargo bikes, which designs give the best ‘bang per buck’ ?

Post by [XAP]Bob »

Really depends on the variety of cargo, the reason behind wanting to stick to two wheels, and the likely use of the bike unloaded.

A trailer option that might actually fit your "want to keep to two wheels" reasoning is the Bob yak - trailer gets attached by a "fork" to both sides of the back wheel and leans/follows the bike faithfully.

Else you are looking at either a long back and "normal" bike luggage arrangements or something like an 8freight
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photobike
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Re: Cargo bikes, which designs give the best ‘bang per buck’ ?

Post by photobike »

Probably not viewed as a Cargo bike, and as [XAP}Bob says it depends on your proposed cargo, but the Pashley Pronto/Royal Mail/Elephant bike can lug a fair amount and cycle well on 2 wheels. Step through frame, bullet proof wheels with SA 3-speed and drum brakes and large front basket. Long Rear carrier allows a fairly long load as well as huge panniers. https://www.pashley.co.uk/bikes/carrier ... pronto.php Available fairly cheap 2nd hand and takes a beating/neglect fairly well.
Carlton green
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Re: Cargo bikes, which designs give the best ‘bang per buck’ ?

Post by Carlton green »

[XAP]Bob wrote: 15 Oct 2021, 9:40am Really depends on the variety of cargo, the reason behind wanting to stick to two wheels, and the likely use of the bike unloaded.

A trailer option that might actually fit your "want to keep to two wheels" reasoning is the Bob yak - trailer gets attached by a "fork" to both sides of the back wheel and leans/follows the bike faithfully.

Else you are looking at either a long back and "normal" bike luggage arrangements or something like an 8freight
I suppose that it’s best to keep the specification open, well other than which designs give the best ‘bang per buck’.

For my use I’m wanting to stick to a total two wheels because it gives a compact, simple and easy use option. Trailers add weigh, add drag, add width. extend the (total) length and can be a fiddle to manoeuvre, but of course they can be a great asset too. The bike unloaded would, I anticipate, be used as one of my day to day transport bikes. That choice can reflect in costs because a (can only be used for a) single purpose bike plus another bike for general use can tie up more resources than one adaptable bike.

What cargo would I like to shift? Examples would include: weekly shopping for a family (about six full large bags), a full seventy litre back pack type bag, a boxed petrol mower, several large cans of paint, bags of compost, bags of gravel, a large sack of potatoes and a child (baby to junior school age). So say a bit under half of what something like a Bakefiets could shift with the rare demand for more capacity being catered for by a trailer, a load platform might need to be added to a long tail type bike.
photobike wrote: 15 Oct 2021, 10:49am Probably not viewed as a Cargo bike, and as [XAP}Bob says it depends on your proposed cargo, but the Pashley Pronto/Royal Mail/Elephant bike can lug a fair amount and cycle well on 2 wheels. Step through frame, bullet proof wheels with SA 3-speed and drum brakes and large front basket. Long Rear carrier allows a fairly long load as well as huge panniers. https://www.pashley.co.uk/bikes/carrier ... pronto.php Available fairly cheap 2nd hand and takes a beating/neglect fairly well.
Yes, I had wondered about one of those but felt that for my intended use I would be asking a bit too much of one. I believe that they’re a bit heavy too - made from ‘gas pipe’ and unnecessarily heavy parts. Second hand Postie Bikes can be massive value though so a good answer to the question, thank you.
Don’t fret, it’s OK to: ride a simple old bike; ride slowly, walk, rest and admire the view; ride off-road; ride in your raincoat; ride by yourself; ride in the dark; and ride one hundred yards or one hundred miles. Your bike and your choices to suit you.
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[XAP]Bob
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Re: Cargo bikes, which designs give the best ‘bang per buck’ ?

Post by [XAP]Bob »

The advantage trailers have is that they leave the bike as is for the times when it's not being used as cargo (although potentially low geared).
The disadvantage is that you don't always have them with you.

The additional length is a concern, but a long tail or other freight bike is always longer than a solo, whilst a trailer can be stored separately and therefore not be a longer object in the cases where length is limited. They are only a challenge to manoeuvre if they are either significantly wider than your shoulders/elbows or you are going backwards (and that would be vanishingly rare I image).

Cargo bikes on the other hand tend to have better gearing and brakes for the design purpose, and stronger tyres etc.

A few years ago I did look at getting one of the ex postie bikes as a runaround, and they are a good looking option.


Not trying to push you at one rather than any other... I know it looks like I am, but I'm more playing devil's advocate.
A shortcut has to be a challenge, otherwise it would just be the way. No situation is so dire that panic cannot make it worse.
There are two kinds of people in this world: those can extrapolate from incomplete data.
hercule
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Re: Cargo bikes, which designs give the best ‘bang per buck’ ?

Post by hercule »

I’ve got a large Y Frame trailer - rated for 90kg. I’ve used it for all sorts of things, carry bags of compost, logs, garden waste and even carrying the dog. Advantages are it is very adaptable, not too expensive, usable with a variety of machines (as a bonus it has exactly the same track width as my Kettwiesel trike, and stores in a minimal space - the wheels just pop off and you can store it flat against a wall. Downsides: it rattles when empty / unloaded, you need to be aware of its width when negotiating bollards etc, you need good brake on the towing machine especially if heavily laden, and there is a degree of shunt when laden that calls for a very smooth pedalling technique. For my occasional use it’s fine. The manufacturer was kind enough to make an in-line towing arm for the central tow bar on my Kettwiesel.
belgiangoth
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Re: Cargo bikes, which designs give the best ‘bang per buck’ ?

Post by belgiangoth »

I used to ferry my twins in a trailer - riding fixed gear. Trailers are a really good plan and the added length just makes you more noticeable.

Not sure you want a bike to lug loads AND do the kid run. Kids grow out of being ferried about in a year or two - unless they are in some way disabled (like my daughter) or you want to do long rides with them. In both these cases you would be better off with something like a Tern than something like a bakfiets. We had a Christiana trike, but once we were only riding with one kid in it the weight and size made it not especially useful.

Do you regularly ride with bulky loads? If so then something like a cargo bike would make sense. Otherwise, use a trailer in reserve for those moments and get something that will allow decent load carrying and invest in some different panniers.

Currently my best load carrying bike is the recumbent - speedmachine. I can load as much as I want onto it and it still goes. Obviously something with double pannier rack, maybe a recumbent trike, would be better.
If I had a baby elephant, I would put it on a recumbent trike so that it would become invisible.
UpWrong
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Re: Cargo bikes, which designs give the best ‘bang per buck’ ?

Post by UpWrong »

Love the design and versatility of the Tern GSD but not sure I can justify the expense. Electric machines need to be used regularly. I tell myself it would be our second car, and that I could chauffeur my wife to and from work on the back :)
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Re: Cargo bikes, which designs give the best ‘bang per buck’ ?

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Carlton green
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Re: Cargo bikes, which designs give the best ‘bang per buck’ ?

Post by Carlton green »

Thank you to everyone for their replies so far.

As far as I can see the capability and cost progressions are near enough the same and this is roughly it:
# three speed roadster with rear rack (plus a front one if you can find and fit something suitable).
# ‘touring’ bike with racks as above - cheap ‘cause most of us have already got one.
# courier / postie / butcher’s bike - but they tend to both be heavy and with limited gears.
# a long tail bike - the smaller rear wheel variants give a lower load deck.
# a bakfiets / long john - barrow bike, sturdy but heavy and with indirect steering.
# a bakfiets / long john with electric assistance. Possibly the most versatile and good standard cargo machine, but at quite a price.

Trailers are great and would change things for the first three, but really my interest here is in Cargo Bikes by themselves. :D

Please keep the ideas and comments coming.
Don’t fret, it’s OK to: ride a simple old bike; ride slowly, walk, rest and admire the view; ride off-road; ride in your raincoat; ride by yourself; ride in the dark; and ride one hundred yards or one hundred miles. Your bike and your choices to suit you.
belgiangoth
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Re: Cargo bikes, which designs give the best ‘bang per buck’ ?

Post by belgiangoth »

Carlton green wrote: 16 Oct 2021, 11:22am # a long tail bike - the smaller rear wheel variants give a lower load deck.
Bang per Buck I think this is the winning entry - it gives the most extra carrying vs a regular bike but is significantly less expensive than a Cargo bike.
...
That said, second hand Cargo bikes can be had for cheap, we sold our Christiana trike for £300ish (but buyer had to collect or sort collection via third party).

Another thought (more expensive for sure) would be a Circe Helios tandem adapted to be a longtail. Better for kid carrying/ferrying, has the additional "normal tandem" use and a good long tail hauler.

@UpWrong, we got our Tern HSD (not GSD) derailleur gear bike from Go Outdoors for about £3k. Go Outdoors are utterly crap so we had to pay about £25 in remedial repairs, swap new pedals and then we wanted further accessories. It's not really bang/buck unless it's replacing a car, but it is worth re-calibrating your thoughts on a starter bike now being £1k.
If I had a baby elephant, I would put it on a recumbent trike so that it would become invisible.
PH
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Re: Cargo bikes, which designs give the best ‘bang per buck’ ?

Post by PH »

Carlton green wrote: 16 Oct 2021, 11:22am # courier / postie / butcher’s bike - but they tend to both be heavy and with limited gears.
Gearing can always be changed and I'm not sure about the heavy.
Sure, they weigh more than the first two options in the list, but heavier than those options that come after it?
I rejected an Elephant Bike on weight, but I'd have to carry it up and down stairs every day so would have rejected any other cargo bike as well. I don't think there is anything else comes close in terms of filling your needs and value.
OTOH if you have enough use for one they all seem to offer plenty of value, if your use is more casual, well you probably already know the answer's a trailer and all the objections to that you've raised are easily put aside.
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Re: Cargo bikes, which designs give the best ‘bang per buck’ ?

Post by hemo »

I like the Mike burrows designed 8 freight and would much prefer the cargo behind me, Yuba mundo or Kona ute may be another option but the for a low platform base is preferred for over size or bulky stuff. For stability I use a carry freedom larg e for thus reason.
Carlton green
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Re: Cargo bikes, which designs give the best ‘bang per buck’ ?

Post by Carlton green »

Thanks for all the comments folks. :D
belgiangoth wrote: 16 Oct 2021, 5:06pm
Carlton green wrote: 16 Oct 2021, 11:22am # a long tail bike - the smaller rear wheel variants give a lower load deck.
Bang per Buck I think this is the winning entry - it gives the most extra carrying vs a regular bike but is significantly less expensive than a Cargo bike.
...
That said, second hand Cargo bikes can be had for cheap, we sold our Christiana trike for £300ish (but buyer had to collect or sort collection via third party).
Perhaps I’m looking in the wrong places but second hand load luggers seem to be quite expensive to me, and I’m rather surprised that your Christiana Trike didn’t sell for much more.
Don’t fret, it’s OK to: ride a simple old bike; ride slowly, walk, rest and admire the view; ride off-road; ride in your raincoat; ride by yourself; ride in the dark; and ride one hundred yards or one hundred miles. Your bike and your choices to suit you.
hemo
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Re: Cargo bikes, which designs give the best ‘bang per buck’ ?

Post by hemo »

An 8 freight on ebay at the mo at £1100 starting and a UTE ending tonight currently at £430 & £70 p&p if not in the south or S/W.

Also a CF large trailer on the bay as well at £100 no offers on it at the mo.
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