After the Petition, what next?

A place to discuss the issues relating to the proposed change in the national CTC’s structure.
Keith
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After the Petition, what next?

Postby Keith » 8 Sep 2010, 3:57pm

Unless I have missed any other thread on the Forum, it seems that things have gone very quiet, which surprises me considering how emotive this all was a few months ago.

What has happened since the petition was submitted?

What happens next?

Keith.

Regulator
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Re: After the Petition, what next?

Postby Regulator » 9 Sep 2010, 8:35am

The petition should appear in the December/January issue of Cycle. Members will then have the opportunity to vote on rescinding motion 8.

Prepare yourself for an onslaught of propaganda in CycleClips, etc... :wink:

Keith
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Re: After the Petition, what next?

Postby Keith » 9 Sep 2010, 10:04pm

Well, it's important that a balanced view is put to the membership when we are all invited to vote on this. As secretary of a Member Group, I took the opportunity to explain (as best I could) the events since the AGM in our group's latest magazine. I'm not trying to foist my opinion on anyone, but I do think people in our group are entitled to understand what is going on. I've talked to many of our active members, or brought up the subject at 11s, and I get the impression that quite a lot of people are uneasy about the direction the CTC is going (i.e. apparently away from looking after touring cyclists) but most (like me) are still pretty confused as to whether unification of the 'club' and the 'charity' is the right course of action. However, I also get the feeling that this isn't such a big issue in many peoples' minds so getting them to vote means making sure that they know why they need to vote - whatever your point of view.
Initially I was happy to accept that those advocating the merger knew what they were talking about and it seemed (superficially) to be a good idea but the 'save the CTC' campaign sowed sufficient doubt in my mind to make me lodge a proxy vote (not with the chairman) against the motions. That doesn't mean I'm implacably opposed to the merger, just that I have sufficient doubt to want to see some reasoned discussion and to avoid us taking a course of action that *could* prove to be detrimental and *would* prove to be much more difficult to unravel if the fears raised by the anti-merger lobby prove to be correct.
Some persuasive arguments were put forward on the SaveTheCTC web site, and I hope these can now be put, succinctly, to the whole membership. The quality of some of the arguments actually presented in Cycle before the AGM was not as good as that on the web site, and I was actually a bit surprised that the 'no' lobby won the day. From the figures that were reported after the AGM I get the impression that only about 4,000 members voted at all on this issue (of which around 1,800 voted 'no'), which might be a high figure for an AGM but it's tiny as a proportion of the entire membership and if all 62,000 (approx) members are asked to vote, it's anybody's guess what the outcome will be!
Since (in our own case) only about 15% of the members living in our patch are 'active' with the local group, it begs the question what particular aspect of the CTC attracts individuals to be members. The arguments for and against the merger need to be presented in a way that recognises the diverse reasons for being a member, since 'the club' aspect appeals to the tourists but many who are members for the magazine, the insurance, legal services or because they 'want to support a national cycling organisation' may well feel that the issue really doesn't matter to them, or that unification is indeed the best course of action. The implications for all kinds of members need to be made clear in the coming weeks.

I should say that these are my personal view and not necessarily the view of my local group.
Keith.

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Simon L6
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Re: After the Petition, what next?

Postby Simon L6 » 24 Sep 2010, 4:29pm

I've got a funny feeling that the whole merger thing is going to go on the back burner. Cycling England is going to get the chop and funding for cycling is (as we predicted) going to take a hammering. That, and the increasingly desparate competition coming from transport consultancies, who are on their uppers, is going to make the market for the services offered by cycling charities very, very tight.

Something's going to have to give. The service to members and member groups is poor value for money (particularly given the poor coverage of Cyclists Welcome discounts in shops) and can't, surely, be reduced. Magazine advertising is probably tight. It looks as if the CTC Trust is going to have to cut back.

Keith
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Re: After the Petition, what next?

Postby Keith » 24 Sep 2010, 5:33pm

Interesting.... thanks.

Regulator
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Re: After the Petition, what next?

Postby Regulator » 3 Nov 2010, 7:55am

Personalised voting papers will be sent out to all members with their december January copy of 'Cycle'. These will need to be completed and returned, by Freepost, to National Office. Six weeks from the publication date of this issue of 'Cycle' on 1 December will be the deadline for votes.

The voting paper will repeat Motion 8 from the AGM and ask members to vote 'for' or 'against' it.

All members of CTC will be eligible to vote (including family and joint members). If you receive your copy of 'Cycle' and it doesn't have the correct voting papers enclosed, then you will need to contact National Office to get them to send you the correct papers.

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Simon L6
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Re: After the Petition, what next?

Postby Simon L6 » 3 Nov 2010, 9:17am

Greg - could you remind us of the procedure for families?

Regulator
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Re: After the Petition, what next?

Postby Regulator » 3 Nov 2010, 11:46am

Personalised papers should be sent out for each family member (or each member in joint memberships), with the Dec/Jan copy of Cycle - but this will rely on the mailing house getting the right forms in the right envelopes...

If people don't receive the correct forms with their magazine they will need to contact Peter at National Office to get the forms sent to them.

Keith
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Re: After the Petition, what next?

Postby Keith » 3 Nov 2010, 12:02pm

I hope that Peter's contact details are made clear in Cycle, so that folk do know how to get ballot papers if they have a problem.
Keith.

thirdcrank
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Re: After the Petition, what next?

Postby thirdcrank » 3 Nov 2010, 2:20pm

It looks like a different tactic this time then. Keep very quiet, hope nobody notices, then we'll presumably get one of those building society type forms with the 'right' choice highlighted.

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Yorkshireman
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Re: After the Petition, what next?

Postby Yorkshireman » 3 Nov 2010, 2:47pm

I wonder what any impartial information re for/against (in the magazine?) will consist of :roll:
Colin N.
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WildCorgi
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Re: After the Petition, what next?

Postby WildCorgi » 4 Nov 2010, 8:55pm

"Keep voting till you get it right"?

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meic
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Re: After the Petition, what next?

Postby meic » 4 Nov 2010, 9:14pm

I know what you mean but in this case the membership did get it "right" in the eyes of the Council. It is the opposition that have forced this vote due to some technicality.
So for once it isnt the normal case.
Unless of course they include a chance to revote on the one that we got "wrong" at the same time. :wink:
Yma o Hyd

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Si
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Re: After the Petition, what next?

Postby Si » 5 Nov 2010, 9:58am

TBH, given the low numbers that voted at the AGM, the very low numbers that voted in the recent council elections, and the fact that in 'real terms' with this new vote: voting one way means that nothing happens, and voting the other way means that nothing happens, I can't see the membership taking much notice of it at all really.

Regulator
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Re: After the Petition, what next?

Postby Regulator » 6 Nov 2010, 9:40am

meic wrote:I know what you mean but in this case the membership did get it "right" in the eyes of the Council. It is the opposition that have forced this vote due to some technicality.
So for once it isnt the normal case.
Unless of course they include a chance to revote on the one that we got "wrong" at the same time. :wink:



The membership didn't get it 'right' in the eyes of Council. The membership votes were clearly against Motion 8 - until the Chair decided to cast his proxy votes for the motion. Even then, the motion only just scraped through. And one mustn't forget, that many of these Chair's pproxy votes were garnered by National Office staff telling members to 'simply tick the box giving your votes to the Chairman'.

The meeting of Council after the AGM was interesting. Some members of Council wanted to ignore the will of the membership and forge ahead with the conversion, ignoring the outcome of the vote on Motion 10.

And the repeat vote hasn't been forced "...due to some technicality." The vote arises from Article 36 of the CTC's Memorandum and Articles of Association. This allows members to protest any vote taken.

It is similar to the provisions of Section 994 of the Companies Act and that is a valuable safeguard that will be lost if the charity conversion goes ahead...
Last edited by Regulator on 30 Nov 2010, 6:56pm, edited 2 times in total.