British Columbia

This sub-forum all discussions about this "lively" subject. All topics that are substantially about helmets will be moved here, if not placed here correctly in the first place.
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al_yrpal
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British Columbia

Postby al_yrpal » 10 Jun 2017, 6:33pm

We are spending a week in British Columbia. The roads are busy, there are cycle lanes on all the bigger roads. I have never seen anywhere apart from Central London with so many cyclists. Everyone wears a helmet, it's the law http://www2.gov.bc.ca/gov/content/trans ... ions-rules

Motorists are very polite and non aggressive. As a pedestrian you can only cross busy roads at intersections on crossings demarked by white lines. Motorists turning give way and stop yards back from crossings.

The helmet law doesn't seem to have deterred anyone from cycling judging by the numbers. The young commuting or the many retired out for a spin in the daytime.

Al
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al_yrpal
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Re: British Columbia

Postby al_yrpal » 11 Jun 2017, 4:29am

Talked to several groups of cyclists here today, lots more on the road because it's the weekend. The general view was that everyone agrees with the helmet law and anyone who advocates riding without a helmet is nuts.

Al
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drossall
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Re: British Columbia

Postby drossall » 11 Jun 2017, 4:36pm

Just to point out the obvious, talking to cyclists in a place where helmets are compulsory is not going to get you many views from those who will not wear them.

In reality, of course, you have a point because many people assume that wearing them is common sense.

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al_yrpal
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Re: British Columbia

Postby al_yrpal » 11 Jun 2017, 5:13pm

I specifically asked if they thought the compulsory helmet law disuaded anybody from cycling. No one thought it did but one lady did mention that she knew one woman who won't cycle because the helmet would mess up her hair! I also mentioned that some people in the UK thought helmets were unecessary and even caused injury in the event of an accident. The universal response was that they must be nuts.

Al
Touring on a bicycle is a great way to explore and appreciate the countryside and towns you pass through. CTC gone but not forgotten!

tatanab
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Re: British Columbia

Postby tatanab » 11 Jun 2017, 5:47pm

North Americans rediscovered cycling (some might say reinvented when you look at the now defunct ideas they introduced) in the 1970s, and also came up with the idea that it was dangerous. It is probably fair to say that the people you spoke to have never ridden without one. I used to live in the USA and your experience, with my comments above, match my experiences. The majority of cycling I saw was for sport/leisure, not a great deal of commuters, so the helmet is simply another aspect of sports wear.

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deliquium
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Re: British Columbia

Postby deliquium » 11 Jun 2017, 5:50pm

al_yrpal wrote:I also mentioned that some people in the UK thought helmets were unecessary and even caused injury in the event of an accident. The universal response was that they must be nuts.

Al


Living in the UK has many positive benefits still (but only whilst we're vigilant and try very hard to head off the kind of ignorant people who instigate these 'laws') - and can choose whether to BUY into the unproven helmet hype - and are not dictated to by 'lawmakers' whose spurious intent is undemocratic* :twisted:

* democratic adj. = representing or appealing to or adapted for the benefit of
the people at large
Last edited by deliquium on 12 Jun 2017, 5:04pm, edited 4 times in total.
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Mick F
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Re: British Columbia

Postby Mick F » 11 Jun 2017, 7:35pm

I rode from Niagara Falls, Canada to Portsmouth, New Hampshire in the summer of 1986.
500miles in a week, over The Peace Bridge into USA, Buffalo, past the Finger Lakes in NY state, Nashua, crossed into Massachusetts, and into NH to the coast at Portsmouth.

Excellent ride ........................ and not a helmet in sight, not even on me.
Mick F. Cornwall

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The utility cyclist
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Re: British Columbia

Postby The utility cyclist » 11 Jun 2017, 10:40pm

Have cycling deaths gone down since the introduction of the helmet law?
A:No, in fact it is 20% more as of 2015 (12) than in 1993 and 1994 (helmet law came in 1996), it has not gone down at all in the last 10 years.

90% of all fatalities/serious injuries are when in collision with a motorvehicle in BC (their governments own paper)
1994 there were 1926 cycling injuries.
As of 2015 there seems to be am approximate guess as to actual injuries as they are given as 1,600 as of 2013, 2014 and 2015 are not given.
http://www.icbc.com/about-icbc/newsroom ... istics.pdf

http://www.vancouversun.com/health/Risk ... story.html
A recent fatality rate by mode of travel in B.C. There were 14 deaths per 100 million trips for bicycling, 15 for walking and 10 for driving – remarkably similar. Per 100 million kilometres travelled, there were three deaths for bicycling, seven for walking and one for driving. Using distance rather than trips shows that cyclists and pedestrians are more vulnerable road users.

Just as most other places people are duped into thinking cycle hats are protective when in fact the stats say otherwise. :roll:

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Re: British Columbia

Postby tatanab » 12 Jun 2017, 6:57am

The utility cyclist wrote:Using distance rather than trips shows that cyclists and pedestrians are more vulnerable road users.
Using time rather than distance or trips possibly has the motorist at greatest risk. An obvious case for headgear. Statistics huh!

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pjclinch
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Re: British Columbia

Postby pjclinch » 12 Jun 2017, 9:25am

al_yrpal wrote:I specifically asked if they thought the compulsory helmet law disuaded anybody from cycling. No one thought it did but one lady did mention that she knew one woman who won't cycle because the helmet would mess up her hair! I also mentioned that some people in the UK thought helmets were unecessary and even caused injury in the event of an accident. The universal response was that they must be nuts.


Welcome to a biased sample with a view informed by local culture.
Go and ask the same questions in NL and they'll typically think people feeling the need for a cycle helmet are wielrenners or delusional.
Ask me 20 years ago and I'd have told you what the BC folk tell you, ask me now and I go with the Dutch view.

Having asked biased people, then pick your preferred cherries.

al_yrpal wrote:The helmet law doesn't seem to have deterred anyone from cycling judging by the numbers


And your control sample is?
Presumably not this lot...



Pete.
Often seen riding a bike around Dundee...

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The utility cyclist
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Re: British Columbia

Postby The utility cyclist » 12 Jun 2017, 9:51pm

tatanab wrote:
The utility cyclist wrote:Using distance rather than trips shows that cyclists and pedestrians are more vulnerable road users.
Using time rather than distance or trips possibly has the motorist at greatest risk. An obvious case for headgear. Statistics huh!

It wasn't my wording, I should have put quote marks around it to denote it was from the writer of the linked article. But as as i mentioned, there are more cycling deaths now and no real improvement in 20 years since helmets were made compulsary. That IS a statistic.

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Re: British Columbia

Postby Vorpal » 13 Jun 2017, 12:23pm

When I was in Vancouver 5 or 6 years ago, I saw lots of university students riding around the big university campus there entirely without helmets. I also saw lots of utility cyclists without helmets.

I asked and was told that the penalty is cheaper than a helmet.

edited to add http://www.vancouversun.com/health/Pete ... story.html
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pwa
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Re: British Columbia

Postby pwa » 13 Jun 2017, 1:44pm

On the specific point of helmets and women's hair, my wife and daughter have struggled in the past with some helmets that don't work well with pony tails. When they go out buying a new helmet that is one of the things they consider.

My wife bought her first cycle helmet in the mid 1980s when studying at university in Nice. The impetus was provided by her best friend, a Canadian girl who wore a helmet and considered it essential. Together they toured the Northern Med, from France (inc. Corsica) to Italy and Greece, then back up to Paris.

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Re: British Columbia

Postby Steady rider » 14 Jun 2017, 8:40pm

Evaluating bicycle helmet use and legislation in Canada - Mandatory ...

http://www.cycle-helmets.com/canada-hel ... ssment.doc

by C Clarke - ‎Related articles
To evaluate bicycle helmet use and legislation in Canada, a board approach is taken. Are cyclists at a high risk that may warrant helmet legislation? The 'safety ...

BC surveys showed a reduction in cycling for the age group 16 – 30 years, with approximately 5 fewer cycling per extra one wearing a helmet.
surveys 1995 - 99
age.........count, helmeted, count, helmeted, extra helmeted cyclist, reduction
16-30 yrs 1975 ,,,,, 928 ,,,, 1486 ,,,,,, 1025 ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, 97 ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,, -489

https://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/na ... le4366972/
It refers to wearing rate of 59%, if enforcement is not that high people may not have been discouraged to the same extent as where enforcement was at high levels. BC weather is also near to the warmest on average for cycling, in Canada.

I don't think BC published the data on the number of fines in each year. The report by Foss RD, Beirness DJ. Bicycle helmet use in British Columbia: effects of the Helmet Use Law. Chapel Hill, NC: University of North Carolina Highway Safety Research Centre, April, 2000.
did not go into much detail about the weather conditions, or provide data per site surveyed, it was research to support the legislation.

In the last week of July and first week of August 1995 Vancouver had 88mm of rain compared with 18mm in 1999, this was about the time of the surveys.They failed to include such information.