Cycling insurance without lids - does it still exist???

This sub-forum all discussions about this "lively" subject. All topics that are substantially about helmets will be moved here, if not placed here correctly in the first place.
graveltourer
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Cycling insurance without lids - does it still exist???

Postby graveltourer » 16 Aug 2017, 5:50pm

Hi

I must admit I'm rather shocked and extremely disappointed to see that the Cycling UK insurance seems to insist on lids being worn for their travel insurance? Rather against their publical position on the subject generally...

Can anyone recommend me a good cycling insurance for Europe that doesn't require use of lids - impllied or specific in their T&Cs?

graveltourer
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Re: Cycling insurance without lids - does it still exist???

Postby graveltourer » 16 Aug 2017, 7:42pm

Or am I misreading something?

From the CUK insurance policy: "Any involvement is these sports and/or activities is subject to your compliance with local laws and regulations and the use of recommended safety equipment (such as helmet, harness, knee and/or elbow pads)."

Which implied to me that it was requiring a lid for everything where some folks think it's needed, ie including cycling?

But I see that while things like horse riding and roller blading state helmets required next to them cycling doesn't. So perhaps I've misunderstood things? (Although I believe that the best way not to deal with insurers is not to have a claim in the first place :) I have a very large distrust of insurers not to try and wriggle out of claims should the worst happen. And with lids being such an emotive issue it's one that now seems daft to offer them an easy loophole on :x )

Can anyone confirm either way on this?

Thanks!

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gaz
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Re: Cycling insurance without lids - does it still exist???

Postby gaz » 16 Aug 2017, 8:35pm

AFAICT the most recent forum discussion of the polystyrene hat wording of the Cycling UK Travel Insurance policy can be found here.

Confirmation of any part of the policy should only be sought from the policy provider.

Please note that gaz is not FCA regulated and cannot assess individual needs for insurance. You will not receive advice or recommendations from gaz about them. Please direct your queries to your chosen insurance provider, who may be either vaguely reassuring or reassuringly vague in their response (wonderful phrase, my thanks to mjr for providing it on another thread). Posted on a forum that contains track nuts and cannot be guaranteed track nut free. Hand wash only. Do not iron.
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hufty
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Re: Cycling insurance without lids - does it still exist???

Postby hufty » 16 Aug 2017, 8:39pm

This has come up on the forum many times over the years, and I think we can safely assume that in the event of an expensive claim the insurers would be happy to use this clause if they thought they could get out of paying to repatriate you and your non-head injury.

I usually use insureandgo. When I renewed last year there was nothing in the small print to put me off but you would want to read it through. But depending on where you're going in Europe, maybe an EHIC and a credit card would be enough - it's not as if cycling is a high risk activity after all!
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thirdcrank
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Re: Cycling insurance without lids - does it still exist???

Postby thirdcrank » 16 Aug 2017, 9:26pm

graveltourer wrote: ... Can anyone recommend me a good cycling insurance for Europe that doesn't require use of lids - impllied or specific in their T&Cs?


This may seem like nit-picking but AFAIK, nobody without the necessary regulatory approval can make any recommendations about insurance. I suspect the most anybody can do in theory is to point to policies which don't specifically mention helmets. Interpreting implied terms and conditions might be dodgy. Whether there's anybody enforcing any of that is another issue.

graveltourer
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Re: Cycling insurance without lids - does it still exist???

Postby graveltourer » 17 Aug 2017, 9:48am

Many thanks gaz and hufty - and thanks for the link to the other thread - I'd searched but failed to find. Probably assuming it would be under this category and not the others!

Sounds like my usual thoughts of buying insurance is wasting money as they'll just try and weasel out of things at the worst possible time if you're unlucky enough to ever need it still apply... But I'll take a look at Insure and Go and ETA. And try and find that E111 card!

Third Crank - nitpicking really not needed. It seemed a sensible place to ask for others opinions as to whether the CUK insurance was something to avoid or whether others had been around the same loop and they'd discovered it wasn't an issue. And to ask if there were other insurers out there that others had trusted to be ok on the subject. But I'm new here so sorry if I couldn't get my words clear enough first time - seeing CUK apparently going against their "personal choice" approach on this was extremely disappointing and frustrating...

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mjr
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Re: Cycling insurance without lids - does it still exist???

Postby mjr » 17 Aug 2017, 11:23am

http://www.world-first.co.uk (edit: 1000m altitude restriction; edit edit: unless you buy activity pack 7 for mountain biking up to 5000m) and https://aacuk.org.uk/ (edit: actually useless for on-road cycle-touring IMO - I'll go question it in that thread now :roll: ) were suggested in viewtopic.php?f=16&t=109715
Last edited by mjr on 17 Aug 2017, 11:34am, edited 1 time in total.
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graveltourer
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Re: Cycling insurance without lids - does it still exist???

Postby graveltourer » 17 Aug 2017, 11:33am

Just to update in case of help to others in same situation:

In the end sportscoverdirect.com seems to offer a good and reasonably priced option (we're planning a bit of sea kayaking as well as gentle cycle touring, which made things harder elsewhere).

I did have to clarify with their rep that they'd not take "You are required to take all reasonable care to protect yourself and your property and to act at all times as if you are not insured." as an excuse to weasel out if a lid wasn't worn. And got was reassured that as long any tour co we're going with doesn't require a lid and the county we're travelling to doesn't legally require it (neither do), then no we're fine. NB As always, you should check this for yourself with them before relying on it - things can change. I also pointed out that if I was uninsured I'd definitely not be wearing a lid ;-)

graveltourer
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Re: Cycling insurance without lids - does it still exist???

Postby graveltourer » 17 Aug 2017, 11:39am

Thanks mjr - think I'm now sorted, but always useful to know which co's are the most likely to be worth trying.

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mjr
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Re: Cycling insurance without lids - does it still exist???

Postby mjr » 17 Aug 2017, 11:44am

graveltourer wrote:Just to update in case of help to others in same situation:

In the end sportscoverdirect.com seems to offer a good and reasonably priced option

Thanks. I'll see what price they offer next time, although the text on https://www.sportscoverdirect.com/insur ... insurance/ about the dangers of cycling isn't something I'm keen to support.
MJR, mostly pedalling 3-speed roadsters. KL+West Norfolk BUG incl social easy rides http://www.klwnbug.co.uk
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graveltourer
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Re: Cycling insurance without lids - does it still exist???

Postby graveltourer » 17 Aug 2017, 2:40pm

Good point - and I managed to miss that one going straight to the T&Cs... Too late this time round, but equally options do seem to be becoming frustratingly limited.

Really baffles me why the helmet brigade can't see the serious dangers of inactivity and that they're doing all they can to put folks off cycling by making it appear far more dangerous than reality... :x But I'm preaching to the converted here ;-)

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mjr
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Re: Cycling insurance without lids - does it still exist???

Postby mjr » 17 Aug 2017, 4:09pm

graveltourer wrote:Really baffles me why the helmet brigade can't see the serious dangers of inactivity and that they're doing all they can to put folks off cycling by making it appear far more dangerous than reality... :x But I'm preaching to the converted here ;-)

Amen! ;-)

I do wonder whether part of the thinking is that inactive people will develop various consequential conditions before dying and many travel insurers will charge extra for those, or deny cover completely. They won't care if you die from inactivity at home in bed - they just don't want you to die or get injured messily while travelling.

Some US health insurers offer discounts to active club members because of their lower claim rates - I wonder whether some might start doing similar things in the UK soon.
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pjclinch
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Re: Cycling insurance without lids - does it still exist???

Postby pjclinch » 18 Aug 2017, 8:29am

graveltourer wrote:
Really baffles me why the helmet brigade can't see the serious dangers of inactivity and that they're doing all they can to put folks off cycling by making it appear far more dangerous than reality


To quote Robert Heinlein, "Man is not a rational animal, he is a rationalising animal."

You start with the answer that boils down to your gut feeling (e.g. "cycle helmets are good and therefore should be used") and you selectively ignore, re-arrange, cherry-pick etc. evidence and arguments to support the predetermined conclusion. Since you're sure you're right the conclusion is the fundamental point and the arguments amount to reassurance rather than the way to get there.

We all do this to some extent, some are better than others at catching themselves.

Pete.
Often seen riding a bike around Dundee...

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gaz
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Re: Cycling insurance without lids - does it still exist???

Postby gaz » 24 Nov 2017, 6:53pm

ETA

https://twitter.com/ETAservicesltd/stat ... 9446518784

https://www.eta.co.uk/wp-content/upload ... y-2017.pdf

Confirmation of any part of the policy should only be sought from the policy provider.

Please note that gaz is not FCA regulated and cannot assess individual needs for insurance. You will not receive advice or recommendations from gaz about them. Please direct your queries to your chosen insurance provider, who may be either vaguely reassuring or reassuringly vague in their response (wonderful phrase, my thanks to mjr for providing it on another thread). Posted on a forum that contains track nuts and cannot be guaranteed track nut free. Hand wash only. Do not iron.
2020 : To redundancy ... and beyond!

irc
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Re: Cycling insurance without lids - does it still exist???

Postby irc » 24 Nov 2017, 9:50pm

gaz wrote:ETA

https://twitter.com/ETAservicesltd/stat ... 9446518784

https://www.eta.co.uk/wp-content/upload ... y-2017.pdf

Confirmation of any part of the policy should only be sought from the policy provider.

Please note that gaz is not FCA regulated and cannot assess individual needs for insurance. You will not receive advice or recommendations from gaz about them. Please direct your queries to your chosen insurance provider, who may be either vaguely reassuring or reassuringly vague in their response (wonderful phrase, my thanks to mjr for providing it on another thread). Posted on a forum that contains track nuts and cannot be guaranteed track nut free. Hand wash only. Do not iron.


I used ETA for my 6 week USA tour this year. A very reasonable £93 for a 56 year old male with no health issues.