School trying to make helmets compulsory

This sub-forum all discussions about this "lively" subject. All topics that are substantially about helmets will be moved here, if not placed here correctly in the first place.
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horizon
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Re: School trying to make helmets compulsory

Postby horizon » 10 Oct 2017, 3:23pm

Sometimes the anti-helmet brigade on here gets criticised for being over-hasty in responding to every mention of a helmet. Can those who find this annoying now see why this is so? Helmets are now being forced on people - their penetration is now extreme thanks to endless promotion.
Let's just get Brexit done so that we can get on with the important job of re-joining the EU!

Psamathe
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Re: School trying to make helmets compulsory

Postby Psamathe » 10 Oct 2017, 3:33pm

horizon wrote:Sometimes the anti-helmet brigade on here gets criticised for being over-hasty in responding to every mention of a helmet. Can those who find this annoying now see why this is so? Helmets are now being forced on people - their penetration is now extreme thanks to endless promotion.

... and every increasing compulsion.

Ian

axel_knutt
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Re: School trying to make helmets compulsory

Postby axel_knutt » 10 Oct 2017, 4:46pm

Psamathe wrote:
horizon wrote:Sometimes the anti-helmet brigade on here gets criticised for being over-hasty in responding to every mention of a helmet. Can those who find this annoying now see why this is so? Helmets are now being forced on people - their penetration is now extreme thanks to endless promotion.

... and every increasing compulsion.

Ian

The problem is that it's like a ratchet, it only goes in one direction. Once helmets become compulsory there will be no going back.
“I'm not upset that you lied to me, I'm upset that from now on I can't believe you.”
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Si
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Re: School trying to make helmets compulsory

Postby Si » 10 Oct 2017, 5:15pm

I would put it to the school that by setting rules as to what the children do beyond the school gates the school is in fact taking responsibility for the children's safety when they are outside of school. In which case they may be liable for any injury, cycling related or not, to the children. At this point the representative of the school may start to get very worried.

pwa
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Re: School trying to make helmets compulsory

Postby pwa » 10 Oct 2017, 5:20pm

I wear a helmet for most of my cycling. I've just come back from a 30 miler, for which I wore my lid. But riding around the village I don't bother. I'm playing a percentages game, I suppose. But a few weeks back my 18 year old daughter and I were cycling slowly through the village, without lids, when we were passed by an more than mature lycra clad gentleman on a carbon race bike. He must have been 65+. As he passed he said "Wear a helmet, folks". Instinctively I snapped back "No!" He continued on his way.

Psamathe
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Re: School trying to make helmets compulsory

Postby Psamathe » 10 Oct 2017, 5:41pm

Si wrote:I would put it to the school that by setting rules as to what the children do beyond the school gates the school is in fact taking responsibility for the children's safety when they are outside of school. In which case they may be liable for any injury, cycling related or not, to the children. At this point the representative of the school may start to get very worried.

I would agree. If they are taking responsibility for your child's safety outside the school premises & outside school hours, they presumably take responsibility up to the point your child arrives home. And as you say they must then take responsibility for all aspects of safety, not just related to cycling. They cannot selectively only take responsibility for certain types of transport or certain risks.

Ian

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Cunobelin
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Re: School trying to make helmets compulsory

Postby Cunobelin » 10 Oct 2017, 5:48pm

DaveMcK wrote:OK, I got a response this morning. Looks like we've got a fight on our hands.

----
Many thanks for your e mail and feedback. Although we appreciate that cycle helmets are not a guarantee of road safety, we feel that anything we can do to reduce risk to our students is a valuable measure.


The evidence shows that children are far more likely to suffer a head injury int he playground Han cycling to or from School. I therefore welcome firstly a breakdown of all head injuries suffered by pupils over the last 5 years and the date when you will be instituting helmets in teh playground


----[/quote]

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Cunobelin
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Re: School trying to make helmets compulsory

Postby Cunobelin » 10 Oct 2017, 5:50pm

Friend of ours in a similar situation started a campaign with like minded parents for the teachers to follow this to a logical conclusion and start confiscating the cars of the parents who parked illegally outside the school to drop off the children!

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Cunobelin
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Re: School trying to make helmets compulsory

Postby Cunobelin » 10 Oct 2017, 6:14pm

THis is a useful document

It would be worth asking a few questions about the legality, as the School would have ti justify the seizure, and there is nothing in this document that would allow the confiscation of a bicycle.... it would arguably be a theft if the Government guidelines were not followed

There are also other areas to play with.

As part of the school's confiscation policy, they will have a responsibility to safeguard any site they seize tYou could easily ask the school to demonstrate how they will keep the cycle safe and secure during the period of confiscation.

Turn up with an old, ill fitting and unfit for use helmet.... it does not say in the policy it has to be worn.

landsurfer
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Re: School trying to make helmets compulsory

Postby landsurfer » 10 Oct 2017, 6:53pm

More importantly i would like to know the name of this School.
Then we could all go to the schools website and see ourselves how helmets are being delt with.
Naming the school on here will allow us all to comment and will in no way compromise the OP.
Unless this is just another "clickbait" event ???

What is the name of the school OP ?

I went to Grandsha High School, Jules went to Wickersley Comprehensive, My grandson goes to Sheffield Technology College and granddaughters to Wath Victoria Primary.
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Re: School trying to make helmets compulsory

Postby Vorpal » 10 Oct 2017, 7:08pm

landsurfer wrote:What is the name of the school OP ?

Not everyone wants to publish the name of the school their child/ren go to. Even a large school could be located in a place where the OP could be readily identified, from knowing about this post and the name of the school.

That has certainly been true of a couple of places I have lived, including the village we lived in in Essex. Anyone there could have told who the only mum in the village was who had school aged children and liked cycling (or was likely to post on a cycling forum :shock: )
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landsurfer
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Re: School trying to make helmets compulsory

Postby landsurfer » 10 Oct 2017, 7:15pm

Sorry i'm missing something, when did it become a crime to question what a school does.
Our family always have done ... its called open nights and parents evenings.
If "identified" what would the school do, send burly chaps round to threaten the family ??
Our kids and grand kids schools have always entered in to friendly discussion when challenged on their rules and regs.

Maybe it's because we live in Yorkshire ... the "blunt" county ... :)
Be a do'er, not a watcher.
Be a Sceaphierde, not a Sheep.
Mike Hall, Jenny Graham .. Respect. ....

The Road Goes On Forever

Vorpal
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Re: School trying to make helmets compulsory

Postby Vorpal » 10 Oct 2017, 7:20pm

landsurfer wrote:Sorry i'm missing something, when did it become a crime to question what a school does.
Our family always have done ... its called open nights and parents evenings.
If "identified" what would the school do, send burly chaps round to threaten the family ??
Our kids and grand kids schools have always entered in to friendly discussion when challenged on their rules and regs.

Maybe it's because we live in Yorkshire ... the "blunt" county ... :)

It's not a crime. It won't likely even make a fuss outside of wherever he lives. But that doesn't mean that he wants all and sundry to know who he is either. There are reasons to respect someone's privacy on an internet forum that have nothing to do with the subject of this thread.
“In some ways, it is easier to be a dissident, for then one is without responsibility.”
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meic
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Re: School trying to make helmets compulsory

Postby meic » 10 Oct 2017, 7:29pm

Our kids and grand kids schools have always entered in to friendly discussion when challenged on their rules and regs.

They do, but in the end you have to admit that they are right and you will obey them in future.
Discussion is encouraged, so long as you accept they are right in the end. I havent yet met a Headteacher who could ever be wrong. Believing that they know best is a key point in the job profile.

I think it is an important part of a child's education to learn how to deal with having to obey stupid rules.
We accept a whole host of school's pointless rules, we dont really have much choice in the matter.

The same rules apply at Scouts or a British Cycling children's cycling club.
Yma o Hyd

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Re: School trying to make helmets compulsory

Postby irc » 10 Oct 2017, 8:22pm

Cunobelin wrote:
DaveMcK wrote:OK, I got a response this morning. Looks like we've got a fight on our hands.

----
Many thanks for your e mail and feedback. Although we appreciate that cycle helmets are not a guarantee of road safety, we feel that anything we can do to reduce risk to our students is a valuable measure.


The evidence shows that children are far more likely to suffer a head injury int he playground Han cycling to or from School. I therefore welcome firstly a breakdown of all head injuries suffered by pupils over the last 5 years and the date when you will be instituting helmets in teh playground


----
[/quote]

As a public body they would be required to respond to a freedom of information request for all injuries to pupils within the school grounds. It would be interesting to see how many head injuries there have been.

I fail to see what power they have to set rules for what children wear outside of school premises.