Four year old killed by bike helmet.

For all discussions about this "lively" subject. All topics that are substantially about helmet usage will be moved here.
niggle
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Location: Cornwall, near England

Re: Four year old killed by bike helmet.

Postby niggle » 20 Feb 2020, 10:51am

Mick F wrote::lol:

The Rotunda.
The building dates back to the 60s. Very modern for the day, and the first time we moved down here in Jan 1980, it was a Chrysler(?) dealership. Prior to that, it was Turnbulls garage.

https://www.oldclassiccar.co.uk/garage_plymouth.htm

Same building, now Evans.the-premises-of-evans-cycles-in-the-rotunda-charles-cross-plymouth-H7RD5F.jpg

Ha! The last time I went in that building, 10-15 years ago, it was a Hein Gericke shop, selling motorcycle clothing and accessories. I remember it for being a stone's throw from the bus station.

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Mick F
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Re: Four year old killed by bike helmet.

Postby Mick F » 20 Feb 2020, 11:19am

The bus station at Bretonside went a couple of years ago. Big student centre now. (Not the students being big!)
Here it is, being built.
https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@50.37103 ... 312!8i6656

It's moved to where the concrete Mayflower Multistorey Carpark was. It was demolished and a carpark and bus terminus put in its place.
https://www.google.co.uk/maps/place/Ply ... -4.1426565

---------------------------------

Any road up, I popped into Evans and had a shufti at the kid's helmets. All sorts of designs from cats to monsters. :D
All were labelled EC1078 and all had black (adult) clips.
The shop was quite busy and the staff were all occupied, so I didn't speak to them.

It struck me whilst I was there, that the staff are innocent in all this and there'd be no point in talking to them about the issue anyway.
I'm going to email them and other companies about it. I'll get round to it in the next day or three.

Maybe some of you could email them all as well?
The more the merrier.
Mick F. Cornwall

Bonefishblues
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Re: Four year old killed by bike helmet.

Postby Bonefishblues » 20 Feb 2020, 4:32pm

Post their email addresses Mick.

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Mick F
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Re: Four year old killed by bike helmet.

Postby Mick F » 20 Feb 2020, 7:29pm

All I can find is this but it's Evans nationally.
https://www.evanscycles.com/help/contact-us
Mick F. Cornwall

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Syd
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Re: Four year old killed by bike helmet.

Postby Syd » 20 Feb 2020, 8:22pm

Mick F wrote:All I can find is this but it's Evans nationally.
https://www.evanscycles.com/help/contact-us

Could alway try

Mike.Ashley@sportsdirect.com

Likely a team there to handle emails to that.

Bonefishblues
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Re: Four year old killed by bike helmet.

Postby Bonefishblues » 20 Feb 2020, 8:29pm

Mick F wrote:Any road up, I popped into Evans and had a shufti at the kid's helmets. All sorts of designs from cats to monsters. :D
All were labelled EC1078 and all had black (adult) clips.
The shop was quite busy and the staff were all occupied, so I didn't speak to them.

It struck me whilst I was there, that the staff are innocent in all this and there'd be no point in talking to them about the issue anyway.
I'm going to email them and other companies about it. I'll get round to it in the next day or three.

Maybe some of you could email them all as well?
The more the merrier.

Just thinking, might have been a useful conversation to at least tell them to warn parents about the buckles?

Peter F
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Re: Four year old killed by bike helmet.

Postby Peter F » 5 Jun 2020, 10:51am

Such a sad story, but my first thought was not about the helmet strap. This could just have easily been an item of clothing. How do strangulation by helmet straps stats compare to similar incidents not involving helmets.

But no, my first thought was what was a 4 year old doing playing out without an adult? Seriously? This isn't a "wrap your kids in cotton wool" thing either. When I was 4 back in the late 70s I wouldn't have been playing out without an adult there. Kids of that age have no sense of danger and need adult supervision. I have a 4 year old and there is no way he would be playing out with friends without me or my wife or another adult being present.

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The utility cyclist
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Re: Four year old killed by bike helmet.

Postby The utility cyclist » 8 Jun 2020, 12:23am

Peter F wrote:Such a sad story, but my first thought was not about the helmet strap. This could just have easily been an item of clothing. How do strangulation by helmet straps stats compare to similar incidents not involving helmets.

But no, my first thought was what was a 4 year old doing playing out without an adult? Seriously? This isn't a "wrap your kids in cotton wool" thing either. When I was 4 back in the late 70s I wouldn't have been playing out without an adult there. Kids of that age have no sense of danger and need adult supervision. I have a 4 year old and there is no way he would be playing out with friends without me or my wife or another adult being present.

The kid had their helmet on so they were obviously perfectly safe :roll: , possibly some risk compensation by the parent/s as well, I agree, leaving a four year old out of sight for an extended period with dangers in vicinity, no way.

Peter F
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Re: Four year old killed by bike helmet.

Postby Peter F » 8 Jun 2020, 7:57am

The utility cyclist wrote:The kid had their helmet on so they were obviously perfectly safe :roll:.

My point is that this story has nothing to do with cycle helmets.
Reminded me very much of a toddler that drowned in a garden pond in my local area 15 years ago. She was 15 months old unsupervised in the back garden. Despite calls to fill in ponds this was a story about not looking after your children.

Oldjohnw
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Re: Four year old killed by bike helmet.

Postby Oldjohnw » 8 Jun 2020, 8:37am

Peter F wrote:
The utility cyclist wrote:The kid had their helmet on so they were obviously perfectly safe :roll:.

My point is that this story has nothing to do with cycle helmets.
Reminded me very much of a toddler that drowned in a garden pond in my local area 15 years ago. She was 15 months old unsupervised in the back garden. Despite calls to fill in ponds this was a story about not looking after your children.


I wrote this pages ago. Nothing has changed.

"The title of his thread is somewhat provocative as well as misleading. The child was not "killed by bike helmet". She was killed through wearing a bike helmet whilst climbing a tree.

On the logic of some it should be that trees should be chopped down."
John

profpointy
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Re: Four year old killed by bike helmet.

Postby profpointy » 8 Jun 2020, 9:20am

Oldjohnw wrote:
Peter F wrote:
The utility cyclist wrote:The kid had their helmet on so they were obviously perfectly safe :roll:.

My point is that this story has nothing to do with cycle helmets.
Reminded me very much of a toddler that drowned in a garden pond in my local area 15 years ago. She was 15 months old unsupervised in the back garden. Despite calls to fill in ponds this was a story about not looking after your children.


I wrote this pages ago. Nothing has changed.

"The title of his thread is somewhat provocative as well as misleading. The child was not "killed by bike helmet". She was killed through wearing a bike helmet whilst climbing a tree.

On the logic of some it should be that trees should be chopped down."


Yebbutt - for many here it would be argued as "obvious" that wearing a helmet makes cycling safer, yet the seemingly equally obvious safety benefit of wearing a helmet climbing trees is dismissed by the same people. The point is that neither is at as clear cut as claimed

Oldjohnw
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Re: Four year old killed by bike helmet.

Postby Oldjohnw » 8 Jun 2020, 9:47am

profpointy wrote:
Oldjohnw wrote:
Peter F wrote:My point is that this story has nothing to do with cycle helmets.
Reminded me very much of a toddler that drowned in a garden pond in my local area 15 years ago. She was 15 months old unsupervised in the back garden. Despite calls to fill in ponds this was a story about not looking after your children.


I wrote this pages ago. Nothing has changed.

"The title of his thread is somewhat provocative as well as misleading. The child was not "killed by bike helmet". She was killed through wearing a bike helmet whilst climbing a tree.

On the logic of some it should be that trees should be chopped down."


Yebbutt - for many here it would be argued as "obvious" that wearing a helmet makes cycling safer, yet the seemingly equally obvious safety benefit of wearing a helmet climbing trees is dismissed by the same people. The point is that neither is at as clear cut as claimed


I'm agnostic about it. But there is no doubt that a helmet with a strap - could have been a toy police helmet - caused this. Whether or not to wear a helmet for cycling is an entirely different discussion.
John

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Re: Four year old killed by bike helmet.

Postby Vorpal » 8 Jun 2020, 11:02am

Peter F wrote:Such a sad story, but my first thought was not about the helmet strap. This could just have easily been an item of clothing. How do strangulation by helmet straps stats compare to similar incidents not involving helmets.

But no, my first thought was what was a 4 year old doing playing out without an adult? Seriously? This isn't a "wrap your kids in cotton wool" thing either. When I was 4 back in the late 70s I wouldn't have been playing out without an adult there. Kids of that age have no sense of danger and need adult supervision. I have a 4 year old and there is no way he would be playing out with friends without me or my wife or another adult being present.

How old before he is allowed to play out on his own?

My kids were allowed to play out once I was confident that they understood & could follow the limits set (stay in the garden; don't go near the street, etc.) They were within hearing, and I could see them out the window. My oldest did climb up & fall out of a tree once, though she was not seriously injured. My youngest was more likely to do something potentially dangerous when there was a parent around. I think that when we were there, he tended to rely on what we told him, and when we weren't he thought about it for himself.
“In some ways, it is easier to be a dissident, for then one is without responsibility.”
― Nelson Mandela, Long Walk to Freedom

Jdsk
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Re: Four year old killed by bike helmet.

Postby Jdsk » 8 Jun 2020, 11:10am

Oldjohnw wrote:But there is no doubt that a helmet with a strap - could have been a toy police helmet - caused this. Whether or not to wear a helmet for cycling is an entirely different discussion.

Nothing has a single cause, and especially not "accidents".

Jonathan

profpointy
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Re: Four year old killed by bike helmet.

Postby profpointy » 8 Jun 2020, 11:23am

Oldjohnw wrote:
profpointy wrote:
Oldjohnw wrote:
I wrote this pages ago. Nothing has changed.

"The title of his thread is somewhat provocative as well as misleading. The child was not "killed by bike helmet". She was killed through wearing a bike helmet whilst climbing a tree.

On the logic of some it should be that trees should be chopped down."


Yebbutt - for many here it would be argued as "obvious" that wearing a helmet makes cycling safer, yet the seemingly equally obvious safety benefit of wearing a helmet climbing trees is dismissed by the same people. The point is that neither is at as clear cut as claimed


I'm agnostic about it. But there is no doubt that a helmet with a strap - could have been a toy police helmet - caused this. Whether or not to wear a helmet for cycling is an entirely different discussion.


I quite agree it's a different discussion, but the point remains that many helmet advocates regularly say things like "motorcyclists wear helmets therefore so should cyclists"

I've also heard a helmet advocate on here assert that those climbing trees were "abusing" cycle helmets by wearing them, without seeing the contradiction between the claims that it was common sense to wear a helmet cycling yet "abuse" to wear one climbing a tree. The hypocritical inconsistency of logic is what annoyed me