helmets from Why wear black?

[BlueRider]

So thats a big, fat, "no answer!" from the two of you on the simple question i asked?

Hmm

[Mike Sales]

Mike: where does your quote - the "no benefit" one - come from?
(I suspect I've read it before, but I'm not sure!)

It is from Spiegelhalter's and Goldacre's BMJ editorial.

Goldacre links to it in this post in his Bad Science blog.

https://www.badscience.net/2013/12/bicycle-helmets-and-the-law-a-perfect-teaching-case-for-epidemiology/

[mattheus]

So thats a big, fat, "no answer!" from the two of you on the simple question i asked?

Hmm

I give you a view that I would apply to many many "simple questions" on the internet:

I really don't feel any obligation to answer questions from anyone. Is this a court of law? Are you my mum??

Now try this one:
Have you stopped beating your wife?

[Mike Sales]

So thats a big, fat, "no answer!" from the two of you on the simple question i asked?

Hmm

In over sixty years of cycling I have only banged my head that once, and that was trivial.
I don't feel the need to wear a helmet which is not shown to work.
A similar conclusion has been reached by Henry Marsh, a neurosurgeon who cycles around London in a cowboy hat and has come to the conclusion cycle helmets are too flimsy to bother with.

A leading neurosurgeon has been accused of putting lives at risk after he controversially claimed that cyclists who wear helmets are wasting their time.
Henry Marsh, an eminent doctor and keen cyclist himself, reportedly said helmets were "too flimsy" to offer much protection.

Speaking at the Hay Festival, Mr Marsh, a consultant at St George's Hospital in Tooting, south London, said: "I ride a bike and I never wear a helmet. In the countries where bike helmets are compulsory there has been no reduction in bike injuries whatsoever.
"I see lots of people in bike accidents and these flimsy little helmets don't help."
He added: "I have been cycling for 40 years and have only been knocked off once. I wear a cowboy hat and cowboy boots. I look completely mad."

https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/neurosurgeon-says-bike-helmets-waste-3630012

P.S.
I strongly recommend his books.

His widely acclaimed memoir Do No Harm: Stories of Life, Death and Brain Surgery was published in 2014.According to The Economist, this memoir is "so elegantly written it is little wonder some say that in Mr Marsh neurosurgery has found its Boswell." A further memoir Admissions: A life in brain surgery was published in 2017.

[BlueRider]

So thats a big, fat, "no answer!" from the two of you on the simple question i asked?

Hmm

In over sixty years of cycling I have only banged my head that once, and that was trivial.
I don't feel the need to wear a helmet which is not shown to work.
A similar conclusion has been reached by Henry Marsh, a neurosurgeon who cycles around London in a cowboy hat and has come to the conclusion cycle helmets are too flimsy to bother with.

A leading neurosurgeon has been accused of putting lives at risk after he controversially claimed that cyclists who wear helmets are wasting their time.
Henry Marsh, an eminent doctor and keen cyclist himself, reportedly said helmets were "too flimsy" to offer much protection.

Speaking at the Hay Festival, Mr Marsh, a consultant at St George's Hospital in Tooting, south London, said: "I ride a bike and I never wear a helmet. In the countries where bike helmets are compulsory there has been no reduction in bike injuries whatsoever.
"I see lots of people in bike accidents and these flimsy little helmets don't help."
He added: "I have been cycling for 40 years and have only been knocked off once. I wear a cowboy hat and cowboy boots. I look completely mad."

https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/neurosurgeon-says-bike-helmets-waste-3630012

P.S.
I strongly recommend his books.

His widely acclaimed memoir Do No Harm: Stories of Life, Death and Brain Surgery was published in 2014.According to The Economist, this memoir is "so elegantly written it is little wonder some say that in Mr Marsh neurosurgery has found its Boswell." A further memoir Admissions: A life in brain surgery was published in 2017.

Which is still not an answer to my simple question

[BlueRider]

So thats a big, fat, "no answer!" from the two of you on the simple question i asked?

Hmm

I give you a view that I would apply to many many "simple questions" on the internet:

I really don't feel any obligation to answer questions from anyone. Is this a court of law? Are you my mum??

Now try this one:
Have you stopped beating your wife?

You won't answer the question either.

I am shocked, lol.

[Mike Sales]

Which is still not an answer to my simple question

You have missed your vocation as an interrogator.

I think I made it clear that I think that banging my head is extremely unlikely, and if it were to happen I believe that a helmet does not give a worthwhile amount of protection.

May I demand a answer? If you were to be struck by lightning, would you rather be carrying a lightning conductor, or not?

You seem to think your silly question tells us something worthwhile.

[BlueRider]

Which is still not an answer to my simple question

You have missed your vocation as an interrogator.

I think I made it clear that I think that banging my head is extremely unlikely, and if it were to happen I believe that a helmet does not give a worthwhile amount of protection.

May I demand a answer? If you were to be struck by lightning, would you rather be carrying a lightning conductor, or not?

You seem to think your silly question tells us something worthwhile.

Still not answering the simple question in a simple and striaght forward manner huh?

Ok,

Scenario: You are falling off your bike. You know not the speed, or circumstance, but you will be sustaining a impact to the head. You have the following options at this point:

A) Wearing a helmet
B) Not wearing a helmet.


Which option would you choose?

[Wanlock Dod]

... I have posted the Guardian report which does actually focus on the effects of helmets on head injuries, rather than the secondary/tertiary effects...

Should bike helmets be compulsory? Lessons from Seattle and Amsterdam
The big bike helmet debate: 'You don’t make it safe by forcing cyclists to dress for urban warfare'
Mandatory bike helmet laws do more harm than good, Senate hears
Why forcing cyclists to wear helmets will not save lives – video explainer
The Guardian view on cycle helmets: head cases make bad law
There's no ethical case for mandatory cycle helmets
Do helmets save lives?

I'm wondering whether a weight of evidence might emerge from all of this, rather than us having to rely on an individual study?

[Mike Sales]

Which is still not an answer to my simple question

You have missed your vocation as an interrogator.

I think I made it clear that I think that banging my head is extremely unlikely, and if it were to happen I believe that a helmet does not give a worthwhile amount of protection.

May I demand a answer? If you were to be struck by lightning, would you rather be carrying a lightning conductor, or not?

You seem to think your silly question tells us something worthwhile.

Still not answering the simple question in a simple and striaght forward manner huh?

Ok,

Scenario: You are falling off your bike. You know not the speed, or circumstance, but you will be sustaining a impact to the head. You have the following options at this point:

A) Wearing a helmet
B) Not wearing a helmet.


Which option would you choose?

When you have got your teeth into the wrong end of the stick you don't like to let go, do you.

Your hypothetical scenario is impossible.
There are many other ways to get hurt in our lives. Some we judge as not worth guarding against, especially with an unproven guard.
I make my decisions about these risks at leisure, by reading the science.
Basta.

[Wanlock Dod]

... would choose to have a helmet on or not during an actual head injury incident ...

I am confident that hitting my head is unlikely given my instincts to protect my head with my limbs during a crash.

[BlueRider]

... I have posted the Guardian report which does actually focus on the effects of helmets on head injuries, rather than the secondary/tertiary effects...

Should bike helmets be compulsory? Lessons from Seattle and Amsterdam
The big bike helmet debate: 'You don’t make it safe by forcing cyclists to dress for urban warfare'
Mandatory bike helmet laws do more harm than good, Senate hears
Why forcing cyclists to wear helmets will not save lives – video explainer
The Guardian view on cycle helmets: head cases make bad law
There's no ethical case for mandatory cycle helmets
Do helmets save lives?

I'm wondering whether a weight of evidence might emerge from all of this, rather than us having to rely on an individual study?

The argument here is that helmets don't help you in an accident, not do helmets help statistics or secondary/tertiary safety issues.

[BlueRider]

You have missed your vocation as an interrogator.

I think I made it clear that I think that banging my head is extremely unlikely, and if it were to happen I believe that a helmet does not give a worthwhile amount of protection.

May I demand a answer? If you were to be struck by lightning, would you rather be carrying a lightning conductor, or not?

You seem to think your silly question tells us something worthwhile.

Still not answering the simple question in a simple and striaght forward manner huh?

Ok,

Scenario: You are falling off your bike. You know not the speed, or circumstance, but you will be sustaining a impact to the head. You have the following options at this point:

A) Wearing a helmet
B) Not wearing a helmet.


Which option would you choose?

When you have got your teeth into the wrong end of the stick you don't like to let go, do you.

Your hypothetical scenario is impossible.
There are many other ways to get hurt in our lives. Some we judge as not worth guarding against, especially with an unproven guard.
I make my decisions about these risks at leisure, by reading the science.
Basta.

"I am not answering you" would have been easier for you to write (and more accurate)

[Mike Sales]

"I am not answering you" would have been easier for you to write (and more accurate)

No answers about lightning conductors then?

[BlueRider]

"I am not answering you" would have been easier for you to write (and more accurate)

No answers about lightning conductors then?

Easy answer tbh.

If you are going to get struck by lightning, hold the rod. The current will take the easiest path to earth via the rod. (Not that it would be any less dangerous for you mind but every little helps).