Helmets a taboo?

For all discussions about this "lively" subject. All topics that are substantially about helmet usage will be moved here.
Freddie
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Helmets a taboo?

Postby Freddie » 8 Jan 2011, 1:12pm

I know we each have our own viewpoint on the subject, but have helmets become so contentious they are now CTC taboo?.

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meic
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Re: Helmets a taboo?

Postby meic » 8 Jan 2011, 1:15pm

Yes,

As will soon be proven when this thread is dragged kicking and screaming by the moderators to that secret little space reserved for this taboo subject.
Yma o Hyd

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hubgearfreak
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Re: Helmets a taboo?

Postby hubgearfreak » 8 Jan 2011, 1:21pm

taboo's a good word, as it has conotations of religiousness.

which is quite fitting for something with no evidence to support it's benefits exist that people put their faith into

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Mick F
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Re: Helmets a taboo?

Postby Mick F » 8 Jan 2011, 1:34pm

Just moved this thread here.

Best place for it!
Mick F. Cornwall

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mill4six
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Re: Helmets a taboo?

Postby mill4six » 8 Jan 2011, 1:36pm

There's a phrase "agree to differ". I don't talk about helmets anymore.

gilesjuk
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Re: Helmets a taboo?

Postby gilesjuk » 8 Jan 2011, 1:44pm

Freddie wrote:I know we each have our own viewpoint on the subject, but have helmets become so contentious they are now CTC taboo?.


People have such differing view points, I'll summarise:

Some grew up without wearing them (myself included), rode BMXs and did crazy stunts without wearing one. If anything I needed shin pads after taking a chunk of flesh out of my leg.

Helmets are blamed for a decline in cycling, the perceived need to wear one makes road cycling seem dangerous.

Helmets are used in legal trials against drivers as some sort of get out clause by the defence. Motorist kills cyclist, but since cyclist wasn't wearing a helmet it was his own fault, even if the driver ran straight over the person and squished them or the impact threw the cyclist 50 ft in the air.

Helmets are a very poor design, purely because nobody wants a heavy helmet that covers their head and makes them sweat.

Some people who fall over on their bike tend to claim the helmet saved their life.

Some people dislike the whole Health and Safety nanny state culture.

Wearing a helmet makes a cyclist look more protected and so if the driver makes a mistake overtaking then a cyclist they will be okay if they get knocked off.

Freddie
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Re: Helmets a taboo?

Postby Freddie » 8 Jan 2011, 1:51pm

meic wrote:Yes,

As will soon be proven when this thread is dragged kicking and screaming by the moderators to that secret little space reserved for this taboo subject.
Wow, there actually is a secret little place, how nice.
mill4six wrote:There's a phrase "agree to differ". I don't talk about helmets anymore.
I know, but in effect it's been made a sacred cow. Whilst moderates will stand around "agreeing to differ", the militant will become more vociferous and legislate against our freedom to differ.

There is a helmet thread in the technical section that hasn't been moved, yet like a thief in the night, a certain mod has stolen (read: deleted) some of the posts. Helmet threads=ok, contention=bad?, It's all a little cloak and dagger, no?.

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meic
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Re: Helmets a taboo?

Postby meic » 8 Jan 2011, 2:18pm

Leave the moderators out of it, they are only trying to do their job.

I imagine that the amount of debate on helmets has plummeted since they started hiding them away in the cupboard under the stairs.
In the old days you would read a thread and then get involved in the debate, normally in response to something that you considered thoroughly ridiculous.
Now you can just pass that whole section of the forum by, unless you are VERY bored.
Yma o Hyd

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CREPELLO
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Re: Helmets a taboo?

Postby CREPELLO » 8 Jan 2011, 2:22pm

I'm in the sub forum now.
I'd expect a problem with weeds growing up amongst the posts come the spring.

irc
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Re: Helmets a taboo?

Postby irc » 8 Jan 2011, 2:27pm

Freddie wrote:Wow, there actually is a secret little place, how nice.


Yes, but you won't get there unless you repent.
No one believes more firmly than Comrade Napoleon that all animals are equal. He would be only too happy to let you make your decisions for yourselves. But sometimes you might make the wrong decisions, comrades, and then where should we be?

goatwarden
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Re: Helmets a taboo?

Postby goatwarden » 8 Jan 2011, 2:33pm

What a nice little spot, I shal skip around it happily until shooed off.

I found a distinct advantage to wearing a helmet, when I had my accident (in which I broke my right femur) last November. I didn't come close to bashing my head in the accident, and knew I hadn't; convincing the Paramedic, Ambulance staff and the entire staff at A&E that I hadn't took a lot of effort though. Despite answering all their memory tests, etc. prfectly, they still seemed doubtful (perhaps their job is more exciting if they have a head injury to deal with?) but I was able to show them that my shiny helmet was still just that and betrayed no evidence of impact so they seemed to believe me then!

I am just reading Mark Beamont's book about riding around the world (don't proceed further if you haven't read it yet, as I am about to spoil the story!) I was amused when he reported the concern of the US Ambulance people, following his being run into by a car, when they noticed his helmet was badly smashed; he was loath to admit to them that it had been strapped to his luggage at the time of the impact.

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meic
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Re: Helmets a taboo?

Postby meic » 8 Jan 2011, 2:54pm

It does seem a bit weird to me how people get so worked up about it.

I think it is a fairly straight forward case of there being a danger and people making their own informal risk assessment and then dealing with it.

It is perfectly valid to argue your point and express your opinion, sometimes people feel they have to resort to some pretty cutting words to get their message across as they are generally arguing against somebody who ISNT LISTENING or they dont notice the other person IS listening because they are so worked up.

My problem and many other peoples problem comes when one side has decided that the other side is too incompetent to make their own risk assessment and must be dictated to.

Consider a similar ethical problem where many more lives are lost, including those of innocent bystanders. Yet many of the arguments are very similar.

A fireman was saying would you take three litres of diesel and heat it up in an open pan on your cooker until it reached boiling point? Like most people I thought, no you would have to be nuts.
Yet people have been doing this their whole lives without injury and reaching a happy old age. Diesel and chip oil being pretty interchangeable (unless you want to eat them).
So we have a situation which is potentially very dangerous yet most people manage quite successfully to contain that danger.
Why are the very sensible calls for chip pans to be banned ignored? (and so much effort put into cycle helmets).
There is safety argument going on and a desire to impose on others getting mixed up with it.
With the chip pans the safety angle is there and despite the fact it ends up killing innocent people, there is a lack of desire to impose on others.

What I can not understand is why so many people have decided that they must make this imposition on others in this one case while ignoring all the others. Totally unfathomable.


and Yes I am aware that it is established beyond doubt that chip pan fires DO kill people and helmets only MAY POSSIBLY help in a crash.
Yma o Hyd

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Re: Helmets a taboo?

Postby yakdiver » 8 Jan 2011, 3:06pm

My helmet is like my buoyance aid when I'm kayaking....I always hope I'll never need
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meic
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Re: Helmets a taboo?

Postby meic » 8 Jan 2011, 3:15pm

Giles,

Your list omitted the way that cyclists have been singled out for this attention.

which is possibly the most contentious issue.
Yma o Hyd

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Steve Kish
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Re: Helmets a taboo?

Postby Steve Kish » 8 Jan 2011, 6:10pm

I think it is a fairly straight forward case of there being a danger and people making their own informal risk assessment and then dealing with it.


Precisely!

I doubt that there is a single cyclist out there who hasn't done this.

I myself am a helmet wearer but have no objection at all to riding with people who don't wear them. I have an ex-American Football cycling friend who commutes with his football helmet because he regards standard bike helmets as underperforming. Two of my off-road mates have hard-shell BMX style 'brain buckets' whereas I just use simple 'less than a tenner' Lidl ones and even wear my 20-year old Specialized Sub Zero on the odd occasion.

As meic implies, each to their own. :P
Old enough to know better but too young to care.