Proposal for Compulsory Cycling helmets in R.O.I.

This sub-forum all discussions about this "lively" subject. All topics that are substantially about helmets will be moved here, if not placed here correctly in the first place.
iron legs
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Proposal for Compulsory Cycling helmets in R.O.I.

Postby iron legs » 16 Oct 2012, 10:44pm

Just heard from a friend in Donegal at the weekend that the Road Safety Authority in the Republic of Ireland are proposing the introduction of compulsory cycle helmets. Cycling Ireland require all their licence holders to wear a helmet and failure to do so invalidates their cycle insurance cover.

If this legislation goes through, then Ireland will be off the map for any cycling for a lot of people.

northstar
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Re: Proposal for Compulsory Cycling helmets in R.O.I.

Postby northstar » 18 Oct 2012, 8:54pm

You know when something has become too popular, they pull this stunt, let's hope it is stopped in it's tracks.

Mike Sales
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Re: Proposal for Compulsory Cycling helmets in R.O.I.

Postby Mike Sales » 18 Oct 2012, 9:00pm

The Irish already have a compulsory lifejacket law. Whenever I have been there in a boat I have, like everyone else, ignored the law. One can only hope they are as tolerant about helmets.
Last edited by Mike Sales on 18 Oct 2012, 10:03pm, edited 2 times in total.

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Claireysmurf
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Re: Proposal for Compulsory Cycling helmets in R.O.I.

Postby Claireysmurf » 18 Oct 2012, 9:04pm

iron legs wrote:Just heard from a friend in Donegal at the weekend that the Road Safety Authority in the Republic of Ireland are proposing the introduction of compulsory cycle helmets.

My sister in law is a cyclist and lives in Dublin. She would be very interested to read about this. Would you be able to find a link please (I had a quick look at the Road Safety Authority website)

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Si
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Re: Proposal for Compulsory Cycling helmets in R.O.I.

Postby Si » 19 Oct 2012, 8:54am

Mike Sales wrote:The Irish already have a compulsory lifejacket law. Whenever I have been there in a boat I have, like everyone else, ignored the law. One can only hope they are as tolerant about helmets.


I suppose that the problem might be that while people are not worried about being pulled for not wearing one (as the garda have better things to do), they might face a contributory negligence call should they get hit and try to claim damages from the other side.

MartinC
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Re: Proposal for Compulsory Cycling helmets in R.O.I.

Postby MartinC » 19 Oct 2012, 9:29am

Si wrote: they might face a contributory negligence call should they get hit and try to claim damages


The principle of contributory negligence and helmets is one thing. A defendant who can find a credible expert witness that will testify that a cycling helmet can make a substantive difference when you're hit by a motor vehicle is something else entirely. I think it's extremely unlikely at best. So when the court decides what proportion of the damages you've contributed to it'll be zero. If you're hit by something else e.g. a wet flannel :) then it may be different

Steady rider
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Re: Proposal for Compulsory Cycling helmets in R.O.I.

Postby Steady rider » 20 Oct 2012, 8:09pm

The Irish already have a compulsory lifejacket law. Whenever I have been there in a boat I have, like everyone else, ignored the law. One can only hope they are as tolerant about helmets.


Cycle helmets - very easy to enforce - police look, no hlemet - ticket, job done.

It is a mistake to hope for tolerence or a lack of enforcement.

The best defence is to attact helmet laws.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hPjvZlAl_js

Tonyf33
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Re: Proposal for Compulsory Cycling helmets in R.O.I.

Postby Tonyf33 » 21 Oct 2012, 7:59pm

I think this one puts it more succinctly http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ADoy7Ggn ... re=related

TonyR
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Re: Proposal for Compulsory Cycling helmets in R.O.I.

Postby TonyR » 21 Oct 2012, 11:00pm

They're going to have to remake this video then. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hPjvZlAl_js

TonyR
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Re: Proposal for Compulsory Cycling helmets in R.O.I.

Postby TonyR » 21 Oct 2012, 11:03pm

Its a story that's been around for a while and its only for children under 13, not that that makes it any better. You can find some information about it here: http://www.independent.ie/national-news ... 54824.html

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RickH
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Re: Proposal for Compulsory Cycling helmets in R.O.I.

Postby RickH » 22 Oct 2012, 12:32am

Reading the EU report (PDF here) that the Irish Independent refers to indicates that it is biased towards helmet wearing as one of the criteria used for scoring* is "a national law requiring use of bicycle helmet while cycling" (p22)! And I note that it also makes the admission "Cycling safety scores did not correspond to cycling deaths for all countries." (p23)

Rick.

* to quote the section in full
Comparison of cycling safety scores
The level of cycling safety for children and adolescents was assessed based on a country’s adoption,
implementation and enforcement of evidence-based national level policies relating to cycling safety
that included:
  • a national law requiring use of bicycle helmet while cycling
  • a national ministry/government department with mandated responsibility for child and youth cycling safety
  • a government approved national strategy with specific targets and timelines related to child and adolescent cycling safety
  • a national media campaign at least once in past five years targeting child and adolescent cycling safety.
Countries were assessed based on the above good practice measures and given a score out of a possible 5 stars.

tyred
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Re: Proposal for Compulsory Cycling helmets in R.O.I.

Postby tyred » 25 Oct 2012, 9:45am

I wrote to my various elected representatives some time ago outlining why I thought this was a bad idea (in a polite way showing various references). I eventually received the following from the Minister for Transport:

Dear *******

I refer further to your email of 1 August 2012 regarding correspondence from your constituent Mr ******** ****** in relation to the wearing of cycling helmets by children.

The press report to which your Mr ********* refers relates to on-going work in the (Road Safety Authority) RSA to prepare the next Road Safety Strategy, which will cover the years 2013-2020. The RSA will submit the Strategy for my approval when it is complete. When it is submitted I will consider its recommendations. Under the law, I have the power, if necessary, to make revisions to the Strategy before approving it.

I cannot speculate on what the RSA may recommend in its final document. I can say however that I have not received any proposals to make the wearing of cycling helmets for children, or others, mandatory.

Yours sincerely,

I don't like the tone of it really.

The fact is that the roads of rural Ireland have become a free for all with no attempt to enforce any rules whatsoever (apart from speed limits on dual carriageways). I can't remember the last time I seen a checkpoint but it must be about 5 years ago.

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CJ
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Re: Proposal for Compulsory Cycling helmets in R.O.I.

Postby CJ » 31 Oct 2012, 1:36pm

Comparison of cycling safety scores
The level of cycling safety for children and adolescents was assessed based on a country’s adoption,
implementation and enforcement of evidence-based national level policies relating to cycling safety
that included:
  • a national law requiring use of bicycle helmet while cycling
  • a national ministry/government department with mandated responsibility for child and youth cycling safety
  • a government approved national strategy with specific targets and timelines related to child and adolescent cycling safety
  • a national media campaign at least once in past five years targeting child and adolescent cycling safety.
Countries were assessed based on the above good practice measures and given a score out of a possible 5 stars.
[/quote]
That's crazy - like saying the streets are safer thanks to a national law requiring everyone to wear a stab vest.
Chris Juden
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Mike Sales
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Re: Proposal for Compulsory Cycling helmets in R.O.I.

Postby Mike Sales » 31 Oct 2012, 1:57pm

Its crazy, and also selects the most dangerous cycling countries. The countries with high casualty rates for cyclists are exactly those which have mandatory helmet laws. AUS, NZ and to some extent USA and CAN get a plus, but NL and DK are marked as dangerous! And they have the chutzpah to call helmet laws "evidence based".