Question on tarps and bivvys

[1982john]

How big of an issue are biting insects like midges and mossies? I've wanted to have a go at this style of camping but been put of from this concern.

[NATURAL ANKLING]

Hi,
Put it this way I had a tent (pride and joy 1982) and it was a 3 minute two skin tent

Took me 45 minutes to put it up one day, only bit not bitten was my underpants

What ever you do, Do Not ever lend you tent out.....................mine was put through the washing machine

[andrew_s]

It depends on where and when you are camping, and what the weather is like.

Midges like the wetter parts of the country - Scotland, the Lake District, Snowdonia, Northern Pennines (Northumbria). You may get midge problems any time between May and September in these areas.
They don't like wind over about 6 mph, or dry weather. "Dry" is the humidity rather than rain - if it cools overnight and things like your tarp start to get damp, they will come out, if present.

If there are midges, they can be quite a problem, unless you can close the bag up completely to keep them out.

Mosquitos may be present anywhere in the country, but like standing water rather than streams. In most places, they aren't really a problem.

Back when I was a penniless student oaf, I used to go caving most weekends in the Dales, and mostly *bivvied out rather than spend beer money on accommodation or campsite fees. I don't remember any midge/mosquito problems at all.
* "bivvied" meaning an orange plastic survival bag, sleeping on top of it unless it was actually raining.

[crazydave789]

midges if you are unlucky to be an area infested is probably better to move. but a headnet saves the irritation unless you react badly to bites.

with mossies a headnet to sleep in will suffice but you can string a bug net inside them which also acts as a modesty curtain. camping away from still water and in a light breeze is usually enough.

skin so soft does a decent enough job of keeping them away without melting your gear.

wrapping up in a jungle hammock keeps everything at bay though.

[random37]

Living as I did on a narrowboat for 12 years meant they were a constant fixture.

Nets over everything, or accept being bitten. Either is fine!

I used to own a mosquito tent, which was quite good. I'd have no problem sleeping in that under a tarp.

Bivvy bags are too much like a shroud for me nowadays though. I like more room, and not having anything over my face.

[1982john]

Living as I did on a narrowboat for 12 years meant they were a constant fixture.

Nets over everything, or accept being bitten. Either is fine!

I used to own a mosquito tent, which was quite good. I'd have no problem sleeping in that under a tarp.

Bivvy bags are too much like a shroud for me nowadays though. I like more room, and not having anything over my face.

Yes I've always used tent and want to try tarp w/o bivvy to get more of an outdoor/adventure feel. I think with a tarp you get better weather protection and it's about the same weight anyway.

The downside with a tarp seems to be you need either trees or hiking poles.

Maybe I'm being over cautious but I think the buggers have a penchant for my odours!

[crazydave789]

Living as I did on a narrowboat for 12 years meant they were a constant fixture.

Nets over everything, or accept being bitten. Either is fine!

I used to own a mosquito tent, which was quite good. I'd have no problem sleeping in that under a tarp.

Bivvy bags are too much like a shroud for me nowadays though. I like more room, and not having anything over my face.

Yes I've always used tent and want to try tarp w/o bivvy to get more of an outdoor/adventure feel. I think with a tarp you get better weather protection and it's about the same weight anyway.

The downside with a tarp seems to be you need either trees or hiking poles.

Maybe I'm being over cautious but I think the buggers have a penchant for my odours!

but to find those trees you have to into the wilds and unmowed areas. military nets are designed to tie off inside a basha giving you a defined space. you can buy bivvy poles now which are quite light and compact allowing you to pitch like a tent.

[Tangled Metal]

Are you hiking or cycling? If hiking in the hills trekking poles might be helpful. If not your thing then replace the trekking poles with something like msr tarp poles. Or backpacking light UK website sell some lightweight tarp poles too. Also tamarack outdoors sell them.

Midges? Avoid Scottish Highlands after about the first week IMHO. Before then you might get lucky with midges. An experienced scot I met had a rather zen approach. He used to say if you swipe away your first midge of the year then you'll get plagued by them all midge season like they all know. Says it worked for him and he hasn't swiped away a midge for years and they don't bother him anymore.

Tarp use and midges. Not been a problem when I've done it in the Lakes for years. Even Scottish Highlands have never been an issue (never go there after first week in June). You can get very lightweight midge tents that go over your head suspended from the tarp. American online retailers (cottage industry manufacturers of tarps mostly) tend to do good ones.

A rather wet camp in borrowdale resulted in midges sheltering in the apex of my tarp. Not a problem I went to the pub then plastered some nordic anti biting insect stuff on my bare skin. Based on pine resin iirc and made me smell of campfires but worked. I think it's Wilma's nordic summer something or other. Works well. In lakes I once sat inside a tent covered in midges. I wrote my name using autan repellant to clear the letters I wrote of midges.

The common issue with both camping spots was low down, recent heavy rains and no breeze. Personally camp a little higher up such as near the many Lakeland tarns where there's a breeze and you'll get less midge issues.

Give it a go. Worst thing that could happen is a bad midge night and you find it's not for you. Use a cheaper tarp such as dd hammocks one. Cheap trekking poles to save money in case it doesn't suit you. You can always strap them to your sack rather than use them for walking.

[freiston]

Are you hiking or cycling? If hiking in the hills trekking poles might be helpful. If not your thing then replace the trekking poles with something like msr tarp poles.

A bicycle held upright with guy-ropes could be used to form a shelter with a tarp.

[crazydave789]

Are you hiking or cycling? If hiking in the hills trekking poles might be helpful. If not your thing then replace the trekking poles with something like msr tarp poles.

A bicycle held upright with guy-ropes could be used to form a shelter with a tarp.

and it helps with security.

someone used to make a tent based on that idea. I wonder what happened to it?

[NATURAL ANKLING]

Hi,
When a new idea is heavier than a tent its not practical.
I like my bike but don't want to sleep so close as to kiss the drive train.

Edited-
You only need one bad midge encounter to convert to a full mesh enclosure.

[whoof]

Whilst I usually put my tarp between two trees in an A frame style I have put it up as a lean to attached to a hedge or even one of those large round that bails. Never had any midge or mosquito problems in South West England or South Wales.

[Tangled Metal]

I've had bad midge encounters with tents. I've yet to find a safe way to use a stove in a tent. I know it's possible with hanging it but tbh who's going to do that in the UK? You're going to encounter midges with tents too.

The trick is to camp away from midges. If not then bear in mind the time it took me to pitch a simple single skin tent and get on was all the time needed to get 40+ midge bites on one leg. I stopped counting at 43 and didn't even start anywhere else.

Since then I've learnt about midges and how to avoid them. Better tactic than trying to seal yourself away from them IMHO. Also allows for a £65 tarp that weighs less than the lightest tent to be used. How much are those cuben fibre terra nova ultra laser tents these days?

[meic]

Better tactic than trying to seal yourself away from them IMHO.

I prefer to have both options open than to choose between them.

[Tangled Metal]

And the fun clapping game getting those stray midges that still get inside the tent.

Seriously though, pitch to avoid midges and with or without a tent you'll get a better camp. It's almost always nicer to sit outside your shelter relaxing than hunched in a tent sealed away from hordes of midges. Unless you're the sort to keep moving until night and just eat then sleep of course. Done that too.