US style hot weather tents

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PhilD28
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Re: US style hot weather tents

Postby PhilD28 » 14 Mar 2019, 10:17am

andrew_s wrote:
mercalia wrote:but where would you get cotton tent from these days?

The classic Vango Force 10 is still available
https://www.blacksofgreenock.co.uk/tent ... ImQQCKeS01


Great tents that last for years, However mine was still too hot in southern Med climates and not a patch on the Big Agnes for either weight or function in those conditions, Force 10 = 7kg vs Big Agnes Copper hotel 3 = 2kg !!

I've had too many tents over the years, I just wear them out (I live out of one for 3 months a year) and search for something better and there's never been greater choice than now.

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horizon
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Re: US style hot weather tents

Postby horizon » 14 Mar 2019, 11:26am

PhilD28 wrote:
and there's never been greater choice than now.


There's a huge choice but IMV within very limited parameters: plastic, green, UV vulnerable. An environmentally friendly tent (no plastic micro fibres), cotton, in a colour of your choice, recyclable, not made in China* might be harder to find. At the moment, making tents is cheaper and easier than ever but disposing of them harder than it has ever been. The really interesting developments in tents nowadays are by companies that rescue and repair tents. The campsite owner that I spoke to last year was almost in despair after a particularly busy weekend left him with a huge pile of discarded cheap plastic tents (some still standing in the field).

* There is some choice there. AFAIK Hilleberg are made in Estonia.
I have two doctors, my left leg and my right leg. (G. M. Trevelyan)
PS I always wondered why the YHA HQ was called Trevelyan House. :)

PhilD28
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Re: US style hot weather tents

Postby PhilD28 » 14 Mar 2019, 1:29pm

Yes those are all valid and worthy points, but good luck in selling a 7kg tent that sucks up overnight condensation and takes hours to dry out compared to a 2kg tent that doesn't, to a solo cycle tourist.

I still have my Vango Force 10 and I did use it for touring on the bike many years ago, I wouldn't want to now. I rarely drive, and cycle everywhere I can(absolutely everywhere for 3 months of the year) and limit my use of plastics whenever possible, sometimes I have to take a balanced view on what's possible. Carrying a 7kg tent isn't any longer possible for extensive tours for my 67 year old legs.

In any case the OP was really interested in tents specifically for hot southern med humid climates, having used a Force 10 in those conditions I can confirm they are less than ideal compared to the others discussed.

Bmblbzzz
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Re: US style hot weather tents

Postby Bmblbzzz » 14 Mar 2019, 2:15pm

horizon wrote:The campsite owner that I spoke to last year was almost in despair after a particularly busy weekend left him with a huge pile of discarded cheap plastic tents (some still standing in the field).


He could give them to charity or flog them off very cheaply on site. Presumably big festivals have arrangements with charities and recyclers (not just for tents, there must be clothes, camping equipment, cameras and phones, along with the bottles and packaging and stuff).

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horizon
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Re: US style hot weather tents

Postby horizon » 14 Mar 2019, 2:17pm

PhilD28 wrote:Yes those are all valid and worthy points, but good luck in selling a 7kg tent that sucks up overnight condensation and takes hours to dry out compared to a 2kg tent that doesn't, to a solo cycle tourist.

I still have my Vango Force 10 and I did use it for touring on the bike many years ago, I wouldn't want to now. I rarely drive, and cycle everywhere I can(absolutely everywhere for 3 months of the year) and limit my use of plastics whenever possible, sometimes I have to take a balanced view on what's possible. Carrying a 7kg tent isn't any longer possible for extensive tours for my 67 year old legs.

In any case the OP was really interested in tents specifically for hot southern med humid climates, having used a Force 10 in those conditions I can confirm they are less than ideal compared to the others discussed.


PhilD28: the Force Ten wasn't my suggestion but someone else's - it is the opposite of what the OP requires! (My own Force Ten Mark 2 weighs in at 4.5 kg but is no longer available and in any case is not suitable.)

So back to the needs of the OP. I'm suggesting a 2 kg single-skin, lightweight cotton tent with all the advantages of modern design and extras (recyclable lightweight plastic pegging points for example). And all the advantages of cotton - that's the arguable bit. But is one made and available? No. Might one be in the future? Yes, possibly, as the plastic tide is reversed.
I have two doctors, my left leg and my right leg. (G. M. Trevelyan)
PS I always wondered why the YHA HQ was called Trevelyan House. :)

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horizon
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Re: US style hot weather tents

Postby horizon » 14 Mar 2019, 2:20pm

Bmblbzzz wrote:
horizon wrote:The campsite owner that I spoke to last year was almost in despair after a particularly busy weekend left him with a huge pile of discarded cheap plastic tents (some still standing in the field).


He could give them to charity or flog them off very cheaply on site. Presumably big festivals have arrangements with charities and recyclers (not just for tents, there must be clothes, camping equipment, cameras and phones, along with the bottles and packaging and stuff).


https://www.camplight.co.uk/
I have two doctors, my left leg and my right leg. (G. M. Trevelyan)
PS I always wondered why the YHA HQ was called Trevelyan House. :)

Bmblbzzz
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Re: US style hot weather tents

Postby Bmblbzzz » 14 Mar 2019, 3:30pm

horizon wrote:
Bmblbzzz wrote:
horizon wrote:The campsite owner that I spoke to last year was almost in despair after a particularly busy weekend left him with a huge pile of discarded cheap plastic tents (some still standing in the field).


He could give them to charity or flog them off very cheaply on site. Presumably big festivals have arrangements with charities and recyclers (not just for tents, there must be clothes, camping equipment, cameras and phones, along with the bottles and packaging and stuff).


https://www.camplight.co.uk/

Good find, thanks! Unfortunately scarce on detail of how they fix and restore tents... but I do like the tetrapac-shack!

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horizon
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Re: US style hot weather tents

Postby horizon » 15 Mar 2019, 11:04am

Here's another link from Patagonia. If they can do it for rainwear, maybe someone else could do it for tents:

https://eu.patagonia.com/gb/en/shop/men ... IE5VTEw%3D

By the way, I hadn't mentioned organic cotton in my post above - it's something to think about.
I have two doctors, my left leg and my right leg. (G. M. Trevelyan)
PS I always wondered why the YHA HQ was called Trevelyan House. :)

PH
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Re: US style hot weather tents

Postby PH » 15 Mar 2019, 1:17pm

Unless you’re counting every gram, there’s little to be lost in choosing a tent that can preform well in both situations. I’be been on tours where my tent has all the mesh opened up and the fly raised one night and everything closed the next.

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horizon
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Re: US style hot weather tents

Postby horizon » 15 Mar 2019, 1:52pm

PH wrote:Unless you’re counting every gram, there’s little to be lost in choosing a tent that can preform well in both situations. I’be been on tours where my tent has all the mesh opened up and the fly raised one night and everything closed the next.


I also wouldn't be so specfic about the role(s) for my tent (apart from cycling = low weight). On a cycle trip through the Puy de Dome I remember almost freezing temperatures in July at higher levels - then it was down to the heat of the coast. However, the OP is being specific and wants the right tent for the job (and maybe save weight too). I've never been too warm in a tent - I thought that was the idea (i.e. it isn't a building).
I have two doctors, my left leg and my right leg. (G. M. Trevelyan)
PS I always wondered why the YHA HQ was called Trevelyan House. :)

willem jongman
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Re: US style hot weather tents

Postby willem jongman » 15 Mar 2019, 5:54pm

This is indeed for a hot weather tent. We have our Hilleberg Nammatj 3gt and it is excellent in northern weather (which is what we will keep it for), but less than ideal down south, even with all mesh vents fully opened. I just ordered an MSR Zoic 3, and will report later in the year, once we have used it in the Tuscan summer. We had to postpone our planned trip to similarly hot Albania until next year because I have to be in Rome for a day for work this summer, so we shall drive to Florence and then do a roundtrip to Rome by bike. On the way out and back again we will have to pitch the tent for one night in northern Switzerland, and that will indeed be interesting: can we keep it warm enough? We will probably take some warm sweaters and leave those in the car when we set off on our bikes.

willem jongman
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Re: US style hot weather tents

Postby willem jongman » 16 Mar 2019, 1:08pm

For those interested in classic cotton tents, Tatteljee in Amsterdam still make them to order: https://www.tatteljee.nl/nl/tenten/erdm ... /voorwoord A double walled solo tent weighs 2650 grams. A similar tent for two weighs 4880 grams. In short, these tents are heavier, but not impossibly so. They are expensive, however (Hilleberg territory).
Another - cheaper - make is Esvo, but nearly all their cotton tents are more suitable for car camping: https://www.esvocampingshop.com/nl/esvo ... en-tenten/ They also have single wall tents, but those are significantly heavier than the double walled ones: https://www.esvocampingshop.com/nl/esvo ... amidetent/

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horizon
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Re: US style hot weather tents

Postby horizon » 16 Mar 2019, 2:46pm

Thanks for that WJ. I did explore Esvo last year before settling on a Robens. Cycle campers must have endured heavier weights in the days before Robert Saunders but I couldn't make any current cotton tent work. I was also put off the Esvo Eskimo as the inner is a synthetic/cotton mix (the outer is 100% cotton AFAIK). This is the reverse of a Force Ten (nylon outer/cotton innner) so I'm not sure what the logic is here.

There's a gap in the market here but it's a tiny gap and it's for wealthy clients.
I have two doctors, my left leg and my right leg. (G. M. Trevelyan)
PS I always wondered why the YHA HQ was called Trevelyan House. :)

willem jongman
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Re: US style hot weather tents

Postby willem jongman » 17 Mar 2019, 11:25am

Yes lightweight cotton tents are expensive (but they always were, at least in the Netherlands). The other side of that coin is that they last much longer.
I bought a Carl Denig Pluto Plus in I think 1974. It was a lovely tent, but pretty cosy. See here for a picture from their 1985 catalogue, and notice the price of 430 euro in 1985: http://home.kpn.nl/hmeijs/NTT/CDPlutoPlus.htm In 2019 prices that would be about 750 euro. The current price of its nearest Tatteljee equivalent is just over 1000 euro: https://www.tatteljee.nl/nl/tenten/erdm ... idt/oester Therefore, the price of such tents has gone up a bit more than inflation, which is not surprising given the high labour component in its production cost and the fact it is now a special order product.

MrsHJ
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Re: US style hot weather tents

Postby MrsHJ » 29 Mar 2019, 10:26pm

Bmblbzzz wrote:Are all the Big Agnes tents of that style? A friend has used her Big Agnes (not sure which model, sorry) in UK and Northern Europe in summer, including inner only on at least one occasion, and is extremely pleased.

I did think this might be about the "black out" style tents, which I think are mostly a US thing but also available in Europe (I think Decathlon do one if you wanted to try it cheaply). These have an inner which is treated in some way to block out all light and infrared, so the inner stays cool but without the convective and radiative cooling of a mesh inner. They also mean when you wake up in the middle of the night, it's pitch black.


I like the sound of blackout tents. Some blooming campsites are like being in a high security prison and there’s nowhere to escape the lights.

I use an MSR hubba hubba. It’s ok but I’m not as happy with it as I thought I would be. I like the head heights and the double porches, bit of an issue with condensation drops on occasion and a bit fiddly to put up. Looking at picking up a super lightweight one man tent whilst in the states this late spring/early summer.