(Robert) Saunders Spacepacker vs upgraded(lighter) Saunders Base-Camp tent

[SA_SA_SA]

The Saunders Spacepacker was always often represented as the ideal cyclecamping tent (for 1-2 persons ):

this made me dream of one at the time so a few years ago I bought a Bergaus Peak 3.1 in a sale as it is reminiscent of the Spacepacker (although one sleeps in line with pole(better) and its truncated-ness means less bell-space)----

this made me wonder if, given that the Spacepacker inner was perpendicular to the pole thus meaning no extra headroom advantage over the transverse ridge Base-Camp model, did it have any low-level camping advantage over the simper Base-camp (assuming the base-camp materials were updated to equalise the weights)?
Perhaps faster easier pitching?

Would a Base camp of almost comparable weight (eg 2kg and a little bit?) have been popular.


https://web.archive.org/web/20090125040520/http://robertsaunders.co.uk/pages/frame.html

Tents with curves seem to need more tension and take longer to pitch (my previous tent was a sloping ridge): eg a quick shelter for lunch in rain? Straight vertical poles perhaps more robust? For walkers the ridge allows trekking poles as tent poles.

[SA_SA_SA]

I seem to be getting quite good at posts that get no replies....
It seems a reasonable question though...

[Bmblbzzz]

I don't know any of the three models you talk about, but simply observe that by modern standards, 2kg for a 2-person tent, while not exactly heavy, is certainly not that light.

[pjclinch]

As a Spacepacker owner I'd say the most obvious plus-point of the hoop is that the poles come down to the ground at the outside edge of each porch, rather than right in the middle of the inner door. This makes it easier to get in and out and faff about with stuff in the porch (away from low level I'd guess it's stronger in a real blow, and a bit easier to pitch in uncooperative weather, but that's not what you asked).

But the Basecamp was a sound design and If you want an updated version then various trekking pole supported models fit the bill nicely. The Trekkertent Drift and the upcoming Hilleberg Anaris, for example. I'm thinking along those lines myself for a spacious and very light solo tent, much as I like the Spacepacker.

Pete.

[pwa]

I have a lightly used Spacepacker in the attic. Nice materials and very handy double entry with storage areas. But for a tall bloke a bit short, leaving inner fabric inches from your nose. And the outer leaked like a sieve from the central seam when new. Apparently they didn't feel it was their job to make it watertight. I had to do that.

[pjclinch]

I have a lightly used Spacepacker in the attic. Nice materials and very handy double entry with storage areas. But for a tall bloke a bit short, leaving inner fabric inches from your nose. And the outer leaked like a sieve from the central seam when new. Apparently they didn't feel it was their job to make it watertight. I had to do that.

Saunders were one of the pioneers of silicone elastomer coatings and you couldn't tape the seams. Bob's seaming (and it was Robert Saunders making them in his house, not a team in a factory) was somewhat variable so sometimes you had to goop them. So you spent 10 minutes gooping the seams with seam sealer and got a tent that was several times stronger as well as considerably lighter than your alternatives for years (lasted longer too). I figured that was worth 10 minutes of my time.

Pete.

[pwa]

I have a lightly used Spacepacker in the attic. Nice materials and very handy double entry with storage areas. But for a tall bloke a bit short, leaving inner fabric inches from your nose. And the outer leaked like a sieve from the central seam when new. Apparently they didn't feel it was their job to make it watertight. I had to do that.

Saunders were one of the pioneers of silicone elastomer coatings and you couldn't tape the seams. Bob's seaming (and it was Robert Saunders making them in his house, not a team in a factory) was somewhat variable so sometimes you had to goop them. So you spent 10 minutes gooping the seams with seam sealer and got a tent that was several times stronger as well as considerably lighter than your alternatives for years (lasted longer too). I figured that was worth 10 minutes of my time.

Pete.

It wasn't a problem after "gooping", but it is something you needed to be aware of before setting off into the back of beyond. It took a couple of hours with the thing spread over furniture in my conservatory, and I only declared it "done" after a trial with a hose pipe in the garden.

[pjclinch]

It wasn't a problem after "gooping", but it is something you needed to be aware of before setting off into the back of beyond. It took a couple of hours with the thing spread over furniture in my conservatory, and I only declared it "done" after a trial with a hose pipe in the garden.

A Saunders tent was a fairly specialised item, so I guess there was an assumption that a dealer would point this out. Not necessarily a fair assumption, I'll grant you! Supporting documentation sometimes reflected the cottage-industry nature of the operation.

If you need to seal a seam in future, it's generally much easier with the tent pitched. Aside from being easier to get at, it stretches the seam so the holes will be at their biggest to receive the sealer. Plus you're all ready for testing as soon as it's dry.

Pete.

[pwa]

It wasn't a problem after "gooping", but it is something you needed to be aware of before setting off into the back of beyond. It took a couple of hours with the thing spread over furniture in my conservatory, and I only declared it "done" after a trial with a hose pipe in the garden.

A Saunders tent was a fairly specialised item, so I guess there was an assumption that a dealer would point this out. Not necessarily a fair assumption, I'll grant you! Supporting documentation sometimes reflected the cottage-industry nature of the operation.

If you need to seal a seam in future, it's generally much easier with the tent pitched. Aside from being easier to get at, it stretches the seam so the holes will be at their biggest to receive the sealer. Plus you're all ready for testing as soon as it's dry.

Pete.

I stretched it out in the conservatory and did maybe 50cm at one time. It was effective.

The other issue with that tent was that no matter how I refined the pitching, the lower zip edges of the inner sag perilously close to the ground, leaving little room for confidence that an overnight deluge could not see a trickle of surface water getting in to where it is least welcome. I may one day get the sewing kit out and do something about that.

It has the potential to be a very nice lightish tent, if not for someone as tall as me.

[PDQ Mobile]

My Saunders tent expoded (there's no other description) in a hoolie of a November gale by the shores of Loch Duich.
The stitching blew out all around the pole and I spent two hours hand out of the fly roughly repairing it.
I always carry needle and thread.

The Saunders tent was never trusted again though and I bought an Ultimate Tramp 2. Fantastic tent, only the groundsheet was a tad thin.
It stood up to everything Continental cycling, a sodden backbacking week in Knoydart!,full backpacking Alpine crossings and I still have it.

[pwa]

My Saunders tent expoded (there's no other description) in a hoolie of a November gale by the shores of Loch Duich.
The stitching blew out all around the pole and I spent two hours hand out of the fly roughly repairing it.
I always carry needle and thread.

The Saunders tent was never trusted again though and I bought an Ultimate Tramp 2. Fantastic tent, only the groundsheet was a tad thin.
It stood up to everything Continental cycling, a sodden backbacking week in Knoydart!,full backpacking Alpine crossings and I still have it.

It has occurred to me that if I ever get round to writing off an old tent (which I do tend to hang on to) I could cut up the inner to end up with a floor to use beneath a newer tent as a footing.

[LinusR]

I have a Saunders Jet Packer. I bought it from the man himself in Chigwell, Essex back in 1998. He and his daughter showed me around their small warehouse and let me set up the Jet Packer on their lawn to check it for size before I bought it. Bob was a real enthusiast and a real salesman. He tried to sell me lots of other stuff but I resisted the temptation. Once I'd decided to buy the tent he gave me a load of spares for free and instructions on repair, etc. He told me not to attempt to tape the seams as the cotton fibres would swell in the rain and "naturally" seal the tent from the elements.

I was always careful to hang it up to dry thoroughly before storing it after a camping trip. It never leaked. The last time I used it was this summer. And it is still as good as new. The only problem is me. It is a very small, lightweight tent (1.75kg). I'm 6 foot 1 and now that I'm a lot older I find it a bit cramped and getting in and out is a bit of a struggle and I cannot sit upright in it, although I never used to be able to.

[PDQ Mobile]

It has occurred to me that if I ever get round to writing off an old tent (which I do tend to hang on to) I could cut up the inner to end up with a floor to use beneath a newer tent as a footing.

I always use an emergency bivvy bag- usually one of those bright orange ones. They make double and single sizes.
They are dirt cheap, fold well, and are quite strong. They make a solid waterproof double layer under the groundsheet and extend a little into the "porch" for extra useful protected ground.
And of course are around for their intended purpose!!
Usually put Karrimat(s) on top of said orange bag and under tent fly.

[SA_SA_SA]

As a Spacepacker owner I'd say the most obvious plus-point of the hoop is that the poles come down to the ground at the outside edge of each porch, rather than right in the middle of the inner door. This makes it easier to get in and out and faff about with stuff in the porch.....But the Basecamp was a sound design ... updated version ... Trekkertent Drift....

Thanks.
I used an upright pole in an (inner-less) Ultimate HoboFan (Cotton Inner version of a Tramp) and found it OK so I presumed it would be no problem in a transverse ridge and in a hoop the extra space over a sleeping head that comes from aligning inner tent inline with hoop seemed a more obvious advantage to me, at least as an option . What ever way you align the hoop it doesn't obstruct inner exit the way an upright pole in a ridge does.