How light can you go?

Specifically for cycle touring subjects & questions
Post Reply
User avatar
horizon
Posts: 11275
Joined: 9 Jan 2007, 11:24am
Location: Cornwall

Re: How light can you go?

Post by horizon »

foxyrider wrote:
Comfort of course is relative, i've been camping for best part of three score years, i'm used to sleeping directly on the ground so my Neo Air is luxury ... If i want 4* comforts i'll not be camping, part of the experience is the simplicity and lack of stuff you need to carry.



I think a big part of the experience! The best bit is achieving a real level of comfort through craft and skill, despite the simplicity and lack of stuff. I'm happy to carry as much as I can on a bicycle (around 25 kg) but even that is constrained eventually by the limits of being on a bike. That amount however really does provide human warmth and comfort. I respect others' desires to keep it light for both cycling reasons and to keep it uncomplicated while camping. However I find it funny that we argue over 10 kg while someone rolls up to the campsite with a 2.5 ton mobile home!
When the pestilence strikes from the East, go far and breathe the cold air deeply. Ignore the sage, stay not indoors. Ho Ri Zon 12th Century Chinese philosopher
nirakaro
Posts: 1575
Joined: 22 Dec 2007, 2:01am

Re: How light can you go?

Post by nirakaro »

horizon wrote: I find it funny that we argue over 10 kg

Ha! If I'm not careful I start arguing - with myself - over ten grams, let alone 10kg!
Jdsk
Posts: 24478
Joined: 5 Mar 2019, 5:42pm

Re: How light can you go?

Post by Jdsk »

KTHSullivan wrote:I am not and have never been an advocate for sawing the handles of toothbrushes etc for in there lies madness.

My precise threshold is to saw them off for walking but not for cycling. Half-mad?

: - )

Jonathan
User avatar
horizon
Posts: 11275
Joined: 9 Jan 2007, 11:24am
Location: Cornwall

Re: How light can you go?

Post by horizon »

Jdsk wrote:My precise threshold is to saw them off for walking but not for cycling. Half-mad?


I turned to cycle camping from backpacking because I knew that on a bike I could carry enough to be warm and comfortable. I reckon that everything a walker does to reduce weight by the gram is completely justified while every cyclist should allow themselves a bit of slack - a couple of kg really doesn't matter - IMV it's the whole idea of a bicycle!
When the pestilence strikes from the East, go far and breathe the cold air deeply. Ignore the sage, stay not indoors. Ho Ri Zon 12th Century Chinese philosopher
User avatar
pjclinch
Posts: 5457
Joined: 29 Oct 2007, 2:32pm
Location: Dundee, Scotland
Contact:

Re: How light can you go?

Post by pjclinch »

horizon wrote:
Jdsk wrote:My precise threshold is to saw them off for walking but not for cycling. Half-mad?


I turned to cycle camping from backpacking because I knew that on a bike I could carry enough to be warm and comfortable. I reckon that everything a walker does to reduce weight by the gram is completely justified while every cyclist should allow themselves a bit of slack - a couple of kg really doesn't matter - IMV it's the whole idea of a bicycle!


Indeed. I've used a 20Kg pack for a snow-holing ski tour in Norway. Getting a bike with a big load up a big hill is hard going, but even standing still with a 20Kg pack on is work.

Pete.
Often seen riding a bike around Dundee...
KTHSullivan
Posts: 587
Joined: 4 Aug 2017, 1:15pm
Location: Wind Swept Lincolnshire

Re: How light can you go?

Post by KTHSullivan »

horizon wrote:
Jdsk wrote:My precise threshold is to saw them off for walking but not for cycling. Half-mad?


I turned to cycle camping from backpacking because I knew that on a bike I could carry enough to be warm and comfortable. I reckon that everything a walker does to reduce weight by the gram is completely justified while every cyclist should allow themselves a bit of slack - a couple of kg really doesn't matter - IMV it's the whole idea of a bicycle!


We went from backpacking to cycle touring/ bike packing as our knees could no longer suffer the hammer of the downhills walking with a pack. The bike packing still allows us to get into the hills/mountains without having cartilages like razor blades at the end of a weeks walking. Old age according to my grandfather "does not come by itself".
Just remember, when you’re over the hill, you begin to pick up speed. :lol:
willem jongman
Posts: 2750
Joined: 7 Jan 2008, 4:16pm

Re: How light can you go?

Post by willem jongman »

I am similarly not that young anymore, and have therefore reduced my luggage weight. I agree that as a cyclist the perfect compromise between the comfort of what you take and the comfort of not taking it is a bit different from when you are backpacking, but even so I think a light weight is also attractive when you are cycling. So yes, I take a slightly larger tent (1.8 kg incl footprint), a decent cookset (Trangia 27 HA UL) to cook real meals, a lexan wine cup plus wine, and of course, as a cyclist I have both cycling clothing and something for around the tent, plus some tools and spare tubes. Beyond that, I think the similarities are greater than the differences.
User avatar
horizon
Posts: 11275
Joined: 9 Jan 2007, 11:24am
Location: Cornwall

Re: How light can you go?

Post by horizon »

I think there must be a sweet spot even if people's preferences vary. A lot depends of course on mileage, climate and terrain and what your personal needs are in terms of comfort. But a bicycle is bicycle and must be ridden, a human being has physical limits and camping is intended to provide shelter, warmth and sustenance.

So I would say that the sweet spot given today's technology is 15 kg. That's light enough to allow for good cycling over a distance with some hills and heavy enough to get a good night's sleep and some hot food.

On my trip across France last summer I took 15 kg and it was perfect. On my later trip across eastern and southern England I took 25 kg. But boy was I comfortable! It's just that I wouldn't recommend pushing a total weight of 40 kg up some of the hills around St Alban's :shock: .
When the pestilence strikes from the East, go far and breathe the cold air deeply. Ignore the sage, stay not indoors. Ho Ri Zon 12th Century Chinese philosopher
glucas
Posts: 216
Joined: 11 Mar 2021, 10:17am

Re: How light can you go?

Post by glucas »

horizon wrote:I think there must be a sweet spot even if people's preferences vary. A lot depends of course on mileage, climate and terrain and what your personal needs are in terms of comfort. But a bicycle is bicycle and must be ridden, a human being has physical limits and camping is intended to provide shelter, warmth and sustenance.

So I would say that the sweet spot given today's technology is 15 kg. That's light enough to allow for good cycling over a distance with some hills and heavy enough to get a good night's sleep and some hot food.

On my trip across France last summer I took 15 kg and it was perfect. On my later trip across eastern and southern England I took 25 kg. But boy was I comfortable! It's just that I wouldn't recommend pushing a total weight of 40 kg up some of the hills around St Alban's :shock: .


15kg - is that the total, including the bike? Or excluding. If excluding, how heavy is your bike?

Graham
User avatar
horizon
Posts: 11275
Joined: 9 Jan 2007, 11:24am
Location: Cornwall

Re: How light can you go?

Post by horizon »

glucas wrote:
15kg - is that the total, including the bike? Or excluding. If excluding, how heavy is your bike?

Graham



:lol: I wish. :D

As I start to go up to 25 kg, the vicious circle of more weight on the bike meaning a heavier bike kicks in. The bike is about 15 kg. That means I can carry that load along rutted tracks to campsites and wherever. That is about 40 kg all up. I haven't weighed it to the ounce but it is pretty correct.

I think 15 kg on a lighter bike (say 25 kg all up) is a better option for most people. And of course you can go much lower, certainly on the load if not the bike. 15 kg all up (bike + load) must surely be possible. But it wouldn't be for me.
When the pestilence strikes from the East, go far and breathe the cold air deeply. Ignore the sage, stay not indoors. Ho Ri Zon 12th Century Chinese philosopher
User avatar
foxyrider
Posts: 6042
Joined: 29 Aug 2011, 10:25am
Location: Sheffield, South Yorkshire

Re: How light can you go?

Post by foxyrider »

horizon wrote:
glucas wrote:
15kg - is that the total, including the bike? Or excluding. If excluding, how heavy is your bike?

Graham



:lol: I wish. :D

As I start to go up to 25 kg, the vicious circle of more weight on the bike meaning a heavier bike kicks in. The bike is about 15 kg. That means I can carry that load along rutted tracks to campsites and wherever. That is about 40 kg all up. I haven't weighed it to the ounce but it is pretty correct.

I think 15 kg on a lighter bike (say 25 kg all up) is a better option for most people. And of course you can go much lower, certainly on the load if not the bike. 15 kg all up (bike + load) must surely be possible. But it wouldn't be for me.


I did a trip through the Alps in 2016 with a set up that came in @ 15kg. 7.5kg carbon race bike with a similar load of luggage/kit. I was pretty comfortable and even ended up on some trails - the catch? well a £5k bike and i stayed in hotels/b&b's but it is doable.

In my saner moments i tour on my 9.5kg Airnimal or 10.5kg Focus, all up weight inc tent etc @ 25kg - i know this as thats just under my usual luggage allowance for flying!
Convention? what's that then?
Airnimal Chameleon touring, Orbit Pro hack, Orbit Photon audax, Focus Mares AX tour, Peugeot Carbon sportive, Owen Blower vintage race - all running Tulio's finest!
glucas
Posts: 216
Joined: 11 Mar 2021, 10:17am

Re: How light can you go?

Post by glucas »

foxyrider wrote:
horizon wrote:
glucas wrote:
15kg - is that the total, including the bike? Or excluding. If excluding, how heavy is your bike?

Graham



:lol: I wish. :D

As I start to go up to 25 kg, the vicious circle of more weight on the bike meaning a heavier bike kicks in. The bike is about 15 kg. That means I can carry that load along rutted tracks to campsites and wherever. That is about 40 kg all up. I haven't weighed it to the ounce but it is pretty correct.

I think 15 kg on a lighter bike (say 25 kg all up) is a better option for most people. And of course you can go much lower, certainly on the load if not the bike. 15 kg all up (bike + load) must surely be possible. But it wouldn't be for me.


I did a trip through the Alps in 2016 with a set up that came in @ 15kg. 7.5kg carbon race bike with a similar load of luggage/kit. I was pretty comfortable and even ended up on some trails - the catch? well a £5k bike and i stayed in hotels/b&b's but it is doable.

In my saner moments i tour on my 9.5kg Airnimal or 10.5kg Focus, all up weight inc tent etc @ 25kg - i know this as thats just under my usual luggage allowance for flying!


Thanks both, for the input. That gives me a sense of perspective again following some of the earlier contributions. I have seen some nutter on Youtube - I think a round the world endurance cyclist with a huge beard who travels extremely light - around 13k - total setup, including bike - Trek Modane?. He takes half a toothbrush and rolled up bubble rap as his sleep system and has the world's lightest tent.!

Graham
hamster
Posts: 4128
Joined: 2 Feb 2007, 12:42pm

Re: How light can you go?

Post by hamster »

glucas wrote:Thanks both, for the input. That gives me a sense of perspective again following some of the earlier contributions. I have seen some nutter on Youtube - I think a round the world endurance cyclist with a huge beard who travels extremely light - around 13k - total setup, including bike - Trek Modane?. He takes half a toothbrush and rolled up bubble rap as his sleep system and has the world's lightest tent.!


To save weight he takes no stove and minimal spare clothing. So he ends up shivering eating cold food? Not my idea of fun.

In the end take enough to be tolerably comfortable. I'll use rolled up spare clothes as a pillow, but always take a stove. It's worth thinking about reducing weight but:
a) don't obsess about it (obsessive gearheads who argue on forums look away now)
b) it's meant to be fun
c) it's not a competition
d) there is no universal right answer.
Last edited by hamster on 31 Mar 2021, 12:54pm, edited 1 time in total.
glucas
Posts: 216
Joined: 11 Mar 2021, 10:17am

Re: How light can you go?

Post by glucas »

Yes, I think he was a bit of a pub/credit card tourer! I am on the fence for my planned north sea scotland highlands trip in July/August. Will probably be disowned on here for saying this, but it's a nice warm bed or probably 5 degrees overnight temperatures in a tent. I'll probably take the tent for EV6 or EV15!

Graham
KTHSullivan
Posts: 587
Joined: 4 Aug 2017, 1:15pm
Location: Wind Swept Lincolnshire

Re: How light can you go?

Post by KTHSullivan »

hamster wrote:
glucas wrote:Thanks both, for the input. That gives me a sense of perspective again following some of the earlier contributions. I have seen some nutter on Youtube - I think a round the world endurance cyclist with a huge beard who travels extremely light - around 13k - total setup, including bike - Trek Modane?. He takes half a toothbrush and rolled up bubble rap as his sleep system and has the world's lightest tent.!


To save weight he takes no stove and minimal spare clothing. So he ends up shivering eating cold food? Not my idea of fun.

In the end take eought to be tolerably comfortable. I'll use rolled up spare clothes as a pillow, but always take a stove. It's worth thinking about reducing weight but:
a) don't obsess about it (obsessive gearheads who argue on forums look away now)
b) it's meant to be fun
c) it's not a competition
d) there is no universal right answer.


+1
Just remember, when you’re over the hill, you begin to pick up speed. :lol:
Post Reply