The, used to be, CTC magazine.

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bigjim
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Re: The, used to be, CTC magazine.

Postby bigjim » 4 Oct 2016, 4:17pm

Si wrote:
So lets delete the MTB touring


No let's not. Just because someone uses a different bike to you I don't think it a good reason to delete them....it just perpetuates the myth(?) that the CTC is elitist.


Here we go even the moderator wants to have a pop even though he has taken the wording out of context. I meant take it out of the touring count, as it was not even touring. But can't resist can you? You could have took it that way but you chose to go on the offensive. Have we met? You seem to think you know me, or what bike I use? Obviously not very well, as an MTB is one of my fleet. Oh, which person or persons is "them"?

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Philip Benstead
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Re: The, used to be, CTC magazine.

Postby Philip Benstead » 4 Oct 2016, 4:31pm

I think there a confusion on the definition of touring.
I think some believe to mean article about the joy of cycling in the country side and things you see the people you 0meeting and the relationship between you and the bike and the environment.
Using that definition, I found 6 pages of touring including photographs.
Philip Benstead | Life Member Former CTC Councillor/Trustee
Organizing events and representing cyclist in southeast since 1988
Bikeability Instructor/Mechanic

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bigjim
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Re: The, used to be, CTC magazine.

Postby bigjim » 4 Oct 2016, 4:38pm

Philip Benstead wrote:I think there a confusion on the definition of touring.
I think some believe to mean article about the joy of cycling in the country side and things you see the people you 0meeting and the relationship between you and the bike and the environment.
Using that definition, I found 6 pages of touring including photographs.

So changing the definition of touring and you find 6 pages out of 82 pages. Hmmm. Plus you had to change the definition to do that. You'd make a good politician Philip. :)

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Philip Benstead
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Re: The, used to be, CTC magazine.

Postby Philip Benstead » 4 Oct 2016, 4:42pm

bigjim wrote:
Philip Benstead wrote:I think there a confusion on the definition of touring.
I think some believe to mean article about the joy of cycling in the country side and things you see the people you 0meeting and the relationship between you and the bike and the environment.
Using that definition, I found 6 pages of touring including photographs.

So changing the definition of touring and you find 6 pages out of 82 pages. Hmmm. Plus you had to change the definition to do that. You'd make a good politician Philip. :)


What is your definition of touring.
Philip Benstead | Life Member Former CTC Councillor/Trustee
Organizing events and representing cyclist in southeast since 1988
Bikeability Instructor/Mechanic

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Si
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Re: The, used to be, CTC magazine.

Postby Si » 4 Oct 2016, 4:45pm

bigjim wrote:
Si wrote:
So lets delete the MTB touring


No let's not. Just because someone uses a different bike to you I don't think it a good reason to delete them....it just perpetuates the myth(?) that the CTC is elitist.


Here we go even the moderator wants to have a pop even though he has taken the wording out of context. I meant take it out of the touring count, as it was not even touring. But can't resist can you? You could have took it that way but you chose to go on the offensive. Have we met? You seem to think you know me, or what bike I use? Obviously not very well, as an MTB is one of my fleet. Oh, which person or persons is "them"?


I'm sorry if my post has you upset, wasn't meant to - I was using the generalised "you". "them" isn't a who, it's a what - it's the articles you don't want in the mag. But I stand my the fact that just because someone is using an MTB and touring off road doesn't mean it isn't touring. Also I didn't take the wording out of context - you clearly don't want MTBing (whether it's touring or not) in the mag and hence, as the mag should represent the club, CUK, which I think is quite unreasonable. Hey, but why don't we go to the other extreme and remove anything that doesn't involve riding from your own front door ('cos if it's motor assisted it can hardly be described as real touring), or has you staying in hotels or hostels, rather than proper cycle-camping.....if we really want to get back to the roots of touring? Obviously I don't seriously mean this but it does demonstrate that as soon as you start saying what is and isn't touring you start to belittle someone's efforts.

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Re: The, used to be, CTC magazine.

Postby loch eck steve » 4 Oct 2016, 4:50pm

blackbike wrote:The magazine is a bit like junk mail from any other charity now.

Could'nt agree more , so glad i'm no longer a member .

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bigjim
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Re: The, used to be, CTC magazine.

Postby bigjim » 4 Oct 2016, 4:54pm

Philip Benstead wrote:
bigjim wrote:
Philip Benstead wrote:I think there a confusion on the definition of touring.
I think some believe to mean article about the joy of cycling in the country side and things you see the people you 0meeting and the relationship between you and the bike and the environment.
Using that definition, I found 6 pages of touring including photographs.

So changing the definition of touring and you find 6 pages out of 82 pages. Hmmm. Plus you had to change the definition to do that. You'd make a good politician Philip. :)


What is your definition of touring.

Setting out on your bike with at least an overnights worth of luggage. You can experience the joys of the countryside and meet new people on any bicycle ride. Which is what I do on many Sundays with the CTC. It is an enjoyable bike ride which is fine and good but I can't see it as touring.
I can see with the name change that they are now focusing on a completely different audience and I can also see it is no longer a touring club or magazine. I wonder what percentage of CUK [terrible name, IMO] members are casual, day, MTB, road bike etc riders? Looking at the huge amount of glossy marketing it must be in the majority. Still the world moves on and anacronisms like myself must bow out before we are trampled underfoot. But I like to express my dissapointment. :)

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bigjim
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Re: The, used to be, CTC magazine.

Postby bigjim » 4 Oct 2016, 5:06pm

Also I didn't take the wording out of context - you clearly don't want MTBing (whether it's touring or not) in the mag and hence, as the mag should represent the club

You did take it out of context because you are completely wrong.
I did not say "I don't want MTBing, touring or not. If those MTBs had been equipped with some luggage and headed out for an overnight then it would be fine but they were just riding around trails for a TV programme. You like a few others on here fall into the trap of personal attacks. Rather than stating your own opinion. So you don't know me, you clearly don't know what I was thinking. I'll happily listen to your opinion and respect that. Get personal and I will come back at you. As a Moderator you should know better and if you wish to attack me, even though once again, you do not even know me, do it via PM and not on a public forum. I should not have to be asking adults to behave in a decent manner.

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Philip Benstead
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Re: The, used to be, CTC magazine.

Postby Philip Benstead » 4 Oct 2016, 5:42pm

I think there a confusion on the definition of touring upon mature reflection I have fine-tuned a definition of touring
Article about Cycle Touring: conveys the joy of cycling in the rural or urban environment and things and people you see and meet and reflect upon their relationship with you and the bike with thought provoking discourse upon the contemporize scene or on the past and the developments in society and the environment.
Of course such art article can and may be illustrated with photographs some even is monochrome to evoke the contemporary atmosphere or even a sketch. But a good word smith does not require such visual clues the word is their canvas.

Of course such writers would have to be in the league of such as Patrick leigh fermor https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Patrick_Leigh_Fermor
Or some of the below
http://matadornetwork.com/notebook/worl ... ting-well/

But would the average ctc members welcome such articles in a cycling magazine?
Philip Benstead | Life Member Former CTC Councillor/Trustee
Organizing events and representing cyclist in southeast since 1988
Bikeability Instructor/Mechanic

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Re: The, used to be, CTC magazine.

Postby PH » 4 Oct 2016, 6:09pm

Philip Benstead wrote:the average ctc members

There is no such thing, some people thinking there is could well be the root of a lot of the problems.

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Philip Benstead
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Re: The, used to be, CTC magazine.

Postby Philip Benstead » 4 Oct 2016, 6:15pm

PH wrote:
Philip Benstead wrote:the average ctc members

There is no such thing, some people thinking there is could well be the root of a lot of the problems.
let say the majority then
Philip Benstead | Life Member Former CTC Councillor/Trustee
Organizing events and representing cyclist in southeast since 1988
Bikeability Instructor/Mechanic

thirdcrank
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Re: The, used to be, CTC magazine.

Postby thirdcrank » 4 Oct 2016, 7:46pm

bigjim

It's something that's not worth fretting about.

In the normal course of events, if you subscribe to a mag or rag and you find it's no longer to your liking, you can stop buying it. In general, print media seem to be in terminal decline as more people do just that.

That option's not available with the CTC mag unless you also want to kick the CTC into touch, so your influence is minimal. It's subject to different market forces.

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Re: The, used to be, CTC magazine.

Postby RickH » 4 Oct 2016, 8:37pm

thirdcrank wrote:bigjim

It's something that's not worth fretting about.

In the normal course of events, if you subscribe to a mag or rag and you find it's no longer to your liking, you can stop buying it. In general, print media seem to be in terminal decline as more people do just that.

That option's not available with the CTC mag unless you also want to kick the CTC into touch, so your influence is minimal. It's subject to different market forces.

I believe some folk have managed to get them to stop sending the magazine without leaving, so that could be an option if you feel that strongly about the mag but don't want to cease your membership.

Personally I still like Cycle. I've only skimmed through the latest copy & thought it looked OK. I may well take it to read tomorrow as I'll be spending a fair bit of time on trains.

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Re: The, used to be, CTC magazine.

Postby bigjim » 4 Oct 2016, 8:43pm

ikhjk
Last edited by bigjim on 4 Oct 2016, 8:46pm, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: The, used to be, CTC magazine.

Postby bigjim » 4 Oct 2016, 8:45pm

thirdcrank wrote:bigjim

It's something that's not worth fretting about.

In the normal course of events, if you subscribe to a mag or rag and you find it's no longer to your liking, you can stop buying it. In general, print media seem to be in terminal decline as more people do just that.

That option's not available with the CTC mag unless you also want to kick the CTC into touch, so your influence is minimal. It's subject to different market forces.

I'm not fretting and I am well aware the my influence is minimal. Thanks for pointing that out.
I was initially just stating my displeasure about a product in the marketplace that I pay for with an expectation that I may find something that actuall interests a touring cyclist such as myself. This organisation no longer fulfils those expections and as a customer I will leave and take my unappreciated custom elsewhere.
I'm more concerned that some posters on here vigorously defend the publication, stating that it is full of touring articles, rather than just facing up and admit that it's focus lies elsewhere. As you pointed out, re market forces.
One does wonder what the robust defenders agenda is?
Cheers for the reply. I shall move on.