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Re: When will P Tuohy Leave?

Posted: 27 Dec 2019, 8:28pm
by PH
mjr wrote:70,000 members in 2009

And I think about half of that a decade before.

I was going to write a longer answer, but previous discussions with you about CTC/Cycling UK have left us further entrenched rather than enlightened and I expect we both have better things to do.

Re: When will P Tuohy Leave?

Posted: 27 Dec 2019, 8:35pm
by RickH
mjr wrote:... especially the great danger to non-sports cycling for all which is BC?

Arguably they do more for inexperienced cyclists than Cycling UK through the Let's Ride (formerly Sky Ride) programme. Are there many (any) member groups that regularly organise rides of less than 15 miles, sometimes less than 10? No 3 rides & you have to join up either.

Re: When will P Tuohy Leave?

Posted: 27 Dec 2019, 8:54pm
by PH
RickH wrote:
mjr wrote:... especially the great danger to non-sports cycling for all which is BC?

Arguably they do more for inexperienced cyclists than Cycling UK through the Let's Ride (formerly Sky Ride) programme. Are there many (any) member groups that regularly organise rides of less than 15 miles, sometimes less than 10? No 3 rides & you have to join up either.

My member group does, then it can organise some of those rides as events open to all, then it can offer three months free introductory membership, then you can pay the subs by the month rather than in an annual lump sum. The reason you have to join CUK is the insurance, if you're on a BC ride that doesn't require membership, you're unlikely to be insured either.
Most of the BC's Lets Ride program is just a listing of other clubs rides, with the rides themselves having nothing to do with BC, I list some of our CTC rides on there. As such they can be very variable, and there's no telling the ability of the organisers. Their big success is the Breeze Groups, something Cycling UK could and should have done.
I'm a member of both, I'd rather see more co operation and less rivalry, I don't consider either to be without their faults, though I consider them both to do some good.

Re: When will P Tuohy Leave?

Posted: 27 Dec 2019, 9:11pm
by gaz
PH wrote:I'd rather see more co operation and less rivalry, I don't consider either to be without their faults, though I consider them both to do some good.

+1.

Re: When will P Tuohy Leave?

Posted: 27 Dec 2019, 10:05pm
by Tinpotflowers
gaz wrote:
PH wrote:I'd rather see more co operation and less rivalry, I don't consider either to be without their faults, though I consider them both to do some good.

+1.

Why should BC cooperate, they are doing just fine.

Re: When will P Tuohy Leave?

Posted: 27 Dec 2019, 10:12pm
by RickH
Tinpotflowers wrote:
gaz wrote:
PH wrote:I'd rather see more co operation and less rivalry, I don't consider either to be without their faults, though I consider them both to do some good.

+1.

Why should BC cooperate, they are doing just fine.

Because they recognise the benefits of cooperation? On their Campaigning page
We're working with our fellow active travel organisations to campaign for change.

Re: When will P Tuohy Leave?

Posted: 28 Dec 2019, 8:22am
by Tinpotflowers
RickH wrote:
Tinpotflowers wrote:
gaz wrote:+1.

Why should BC cooperate, they are doing just fine.

Because they recognise the benefits of cooperation? On their Campaigning page
We're working with our fellow active travel organisations to campaign for change.



But why are people joining BC and not CUK?

Re: When will P Tuohy Leave?

Posted: 28 Dec 2019, 8:54am
by millimole
Devil's advocate for a moment :
Why does CTC / CUK need any more than a small core number of members.?
If CUK are all about getting new people on bikes and advocacy for those riding bikes, then the only members it needs are the small number who do training and lead beginners rides, and the limited numbers of committed activists. The rest of us - the chaff who just ride - are just irrelevant.
I would guess the subscription income is minimal compared to the potential from grants, and the subs are there to prop up the grant application process.
A pure focus on member numbers is probably a focus on something that CTC/CUK no longer is interested in.
End of devils advocacy mode!

Re: When will P Tuohy Leave?

Posted: 28 Dec 2019, 9:02am
by Cyril Haearn
The motor organisations have millions of supporters/members
I am ashamed to admit I was a member of one such, but only for the recovery service when my vehicle conked out

Re: When will P Tuohy Leave?

Posted: 28 Dec 2019, 9:52am
by Mick F
Tinpotflowers wrote:But why are people joining BC and not CUK?
It's a better name for one thing.

People can understand the simplicity of the name "British Cycling".
"Cycling UK" doesn't sound snappy and it's not a good name for the organisation at all IMO.

If they were to combine and join forces, the name BC would be the one they would use.

Re: When will P Tuohy Leave?

Posted: 28 Dec 2019, 9:55am
by Oldjohnw
CUK's legal help seems worth the membership.

Re: When will P Tuohy Leave?

Posted: 28 Dec 2019, 10:05am
by Paulatic
Oldjohnw wrote:CUK's legal help seems worth the membership.

I have my reservations about that John. A no win no fee firm who anyone could approach not just CUK members.
A company who will help you keep your licence in drink/ drugs driving offence https://www.slatergordon.co.uk/driving- ... olicitors/
I personally know of cases S&G said there was no case and https://www.cyclelawscotland.co.uk/ took on those cases and won compensation. Cycle Law Scotland will always be my number one go to.

Re: When will P Tuohy Leave?

Posted: 28 Dec 2019, 10:09am
by Mick F
Oldjohnw wrote:CUK's legal help seems worth the membership.
Exactly.
That's why I'm a member.

BC don't do it, and they don't give a discount for unwaged/OAP like CUK do.

Plus, they are pro-helmet and any organised rides under their banner insist on a helmet too. I wanted to do a ride at the Eden Project last summer, but they insisted on a helmet, so I told them where to stick their rules and their ride.

If I wear a helmet or not, it's got nothing to do with anyone but myself.

Re: When will P Tuohy Leave?

Posted: 28 Dec 2019, 10:12am
by Oldjohnw
Paulatic wrote:
Oldjohnw wrote:CUK's legal help seems worth the membership.

I have my reservations about that John. A no win no fee firm who anyone could approach not just CUK members.
A company who will help you keep your licence in drink/ drugs driving offence https://www.slatergordon.co.uk/driving- ... olicitors/
I personally know of cases S&G said there was no case and https://www.cyclelawscotland.co.uk/ took on those cases and won compensation. Cycle Law Scotland will always be my number one go to.


I'm not quite in Scotland! Your reservations are apt and noted- thanks.

Re: When will P Tuohy Leave?

Posted: 28 Dec 2019, 10:14am
by Oldjohnw
Mick F wrote:
Oldjohnw wrote:CUK's legal help seems worth the membership.
Exactly.
That's why I'm a member.

BC don't do it, and they don't give a discount for unwaged/OAP like CUK do.

Plus, they are pro-helmet and any organised rides under their banner insist on a helmet too. I wanted to do a ride at the Eden Project last summer, but they insisted on a helmet, so I told them where to stick their rules and their ride.

If I wear a helmet or not, it's got nothing to do with anyone but myself.


I don't do group rides so helmet to be or not be is my unpressured choice - if you don't count my wife!

Agree about the useful old person discount.