We remember all cyclists

Boring_Username
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We remember all cyclists

Postby Boring_Username » 9 Nov 2018, 4:05pm

From today's newsletter

We remember all cyclists

Dear xxx

At 11am on Sunday the country will be holding a minute's silence to remember all those killed in action. We’ll be thinking of the 100 of our members who died in the First World War and the many other cyclists who were killed at the Somme and elsewhere a century ago.


Misjudged, I feel.

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mjr
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Re: We remember all cyclists

Postby mjr » 9 Nov 2018, 4:07pm

Just because most people will be observing 2 minutes silence, or for some other reason?
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Re: We remember all cyclists

Postby Bez » 9 Nov 2018, 4:11pm

I think the point is it’s a bit “they deserve our thoughts because they were Cyclists”. (Were the people killed while driving tanks Motorists and thus less worth Cyclists’ thoughts on Sunday?)

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Re: We remember all cyclists

Postby Boring_Username » 9 Nov 2018, 4:13pm

Bez wrote:I think the point is it’s a bit “they deserve our thoughts because they were Cyclists”. (Were the people killed while driving tanks Motorists and thus less worth Cyclists’ thoughts on Sunday?)


Quite.

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Si
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Re: We remember all cyclists

Postby Si » 9 Nov 2018, 5:03pm

Well I guess it just refers to the camaraderie of cycling. Just like in a particular town or village you might make an especial effort to remember those from that town or village but that doesn't mean you don't value people from other locations. Or people from a particular regiment might remember those from their regiment even if it was 100 years ago - doesn't mean they are disrespecting other regiments.

I would be inclined to just remember and be grateful to all those people in the war rather than picking apart the detail and risk moving focus away from what we owe them to an argument about the syntax of the message.

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Re: We remember all cyclists

Postby Cunobelin » 9 Nov 2018, 5:30pm

I am equally Guilty... I am choosing to go to a quiet Ceremony that celebrates those lost to the Royal Naval Medical Branch. That is because of a common identity and membership.

Does it mean that I am wrong?

There are those who will be remembering families, or their Colleagues, their WorkPlace, their profession..... are they wrong?

I can see nothing wrong with a Group remembering those that their group lost.

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Re: We remember all cyclists

Postby mjr » 9 Nov 2018, 5:32pm

Sheesh. It's not like it's saying not to remember others if you want. It's just saying who they'll be thinking of especially, while remembering all.

People here object to this. Meanwhile, Remembrance Sunday on facebook seems to be sponsored by the BNP... :-(
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Re: We remember all cyclists

Postby Bez » 9 Nov 2018, 6:57pm

Cunobelin wrote:I am choosing to go to a quiet Ceremony that celebrates those lost to the Royal Naval Medical Branch. That is because of a common identity and membership.


Personally I think that’s completely different, because it’s pertinent.

Choosing to single out a small number for special mention purely because we like to pedal our way between a few cafes at the weekend seems bizarre to me.

But that’s just me. Different strokes and all that: I’m not objecting, I just don’t empathise with the thinking behind it. But then I find “cyclist” as an identity bizarre in itself anyway. And I don’t read Facebook either :)

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Re: We remember all cyclists

Postby reohn2 » 9 Nov 2018, 8:46pm

Boring_Username wrote:
Bez wrote:I think the point is it’s a bit “they deserve our thoughts because they were Cyclists”. (Were the people killed while driving tanks Motorists and thus less worth Cyclists’ thoughts on Sunday?)


Quite.

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Cunobelin
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Re: We remember all cyclists

Postby Cunobelin » 10 Nov 2018, 11:44am

I am now depressed by the number of people choosing to make this same heinous and inappropriate choice to remember groups they belonged to....

Southampton are selfishly unveiling a plaque for the members of the club who lost their lives....... Should All the other FA teams, Cricket teams and Rugby teams object

Portsmouth is setting up memorials for those who died from that Street



St Albans have been demonstrating this appalling lack of misjudgement since 1920! Should other streets in St Albans or other Hertfordshire villages and towns be up in arms ?

Thousands of people will be heading to events that are selfishly centred on monuments for local people only

People are entitled to remember how they wish, and if a Group wishes to remember its own members then that should be accepted, not condemned

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Re: We remember all cyclists

Postby Bez » 10 Nov 2018, 12:00pm

Again, I don’t think anyone’s condemning it, just questioning it.

And again, just as a service connection is a very different type of connection, so is a local one: families often remain in the same locality, and those localities will have been built and influenced by the people who lost their lives.

It’s well known that humans respond very differently to the number and identifiability of people they are guided to care about (which is why when charities these days ask for your money they often give great prominence to individuals in need, and less to the overall scale of the cause). So it’s perfectly understandable that people focus on small groups.

It’s just that being ”a cyclist” seems a very arbitrary connection. I personally can’t grasp why the fact that I ride a bicycle should be a thing that connects me to a number of individuals who have their lives. To be blunt, as someone who has a great fondness not only for bicycles but also for sausage rolls, it seems broadly similar to suggesting that I focus my debt of gratitude on all those who quite liked sausage rolls.

TL;DR: it’s not the focus on a subset of those who gave their lives that I find odd, but the tenuous nature of this particular link by which some people determine that subset. YMMV.

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Re: We remember all cyclists

Postby Cunobelin » 10 Nov 2018, 1:55pm

Will we also be questioning the 98th Meridien
Event next May..... it has exactly the same aim and from the webpage on this year’s event......

This is the 97th Cyclists' Memorial Service remembering cyclists from all nations and faiths who lost their lives in World War One, World War Two and successive conflicts since



Clubs and groups of cyclists from across the West Midlands come every year and all are welcome.



Perhaps a new thread discussing whether the 98 th year should be questioned?

Especially as this is exactly the agenda being questioned
Last edited by Cunobelin on 10 Nov 2018, 2:06pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Cunobelin
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Re: We remember all cyclists

Postby Cunobelin » 10 Nov 2018, 2:00pm

Bez wrote:Again, I don’t think anyone’s condemning it, just questioning it.

And again, just as a service connection is a very different type of connection, so is a local one: families often remain in the same locality, and those localities will have been built and influenced by the people who lost their lives.

It’s well known that humans respond very differently to the number and identifiability of people they are guided to care about (which is why when charities these days ask for your money they often give great prominence to individuals in need, and less to the overall scale of the cause). So it’s perfectly understandable that people focus on small groups.

It’s just that being ”a cyclist” seems a very arbitrary connection. I personally can’t grasp why the fact that I ride a bicycle should be a thing that connects me to a number of individuals who have their lives. To be blunt, as someone who has a great fondness not only for bicycles but also for sausage rolls, it seems broadly similar to suggesting that I focus my debt of gratitude on all those who quite liked sausage rolls.

TL;DR: it’s not the focus on a subset of those who gave their lives that I find odd, but the tenuous nature of this particular link by which some people determine that subset. YMMV.


This is what I cannot understand... it has nothing to do with being a cyclist.
With so many groups, regiments, ships , factories, companies, villages (ad Infinitum) it is specific...
We are an organisation which is recognising the sacrifice of “100 FELLOW MEMBERS OF THIS ORGANISATION”

Those members may have driven cars, busses, tanks, airships, planes, ships...or been one of the many cyclist battalions...the common factor and the one being remembered is that they were members of the CTC

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Re: We remember all cyclists

Postby Bez » 10 Nov 2018, 2:19pm

It was more the “the many other cyclists who were killed” that I found tenuous and odd. But anyway, this is a storm in a teacup…

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Re: We remember all cyclists

Postby AndyK » 10 Nov 2018, 3:00pm

Bez wrote:It was more the “the many other cyclists who were killed” that I found tenuous and odd. But anyway, this is a storm in a teacup…

Again this reflects the Meriden Cyclists' Memorial and the associated annual service. The original dedication on the memorial reads, "To the lasting memory of those Cyclists who died in the Great War 1914-1919" (i.e. not just CTC members).

If you read this excellent article - http://www.anfieldbc.co.uk/meriden.pdf - you'll find that the debates going on in this thread were rehearsed 99 years ago! (Obviously the forum ran a lot more slowly in those days and all posts were subject to heavy moderation.)

While I too find the concept of a memorial to followers of a particular pastime a bit odd, well... we weren't there. They saw things differently then and I guess we should respect that - especially on the centenary of the Armistice. I think it's appropriate for Cycleclips to continue that tradition.

The typo does annoy me, though - clearly it should have been "hundreds", not "100".