Cycling UK Interim CEO

PH
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Re: Cycling UK Interim CEO

Postby PH » 21 Apr 2020, 12:49pm

reohn2 wrote:This is what happens when a club owned and run by it's members is turned into a so called "charity" and run as a business and it's members become donors.

Do you have any evidence that the two things are in any way related, or is it just another case that you don't like the charity status so attribute everything else you don't like to it?
I think it's deeply disrespectful to the trustees, those I've met share the same interests and aims as I do as a member. I'm more involved at a local level than national, that's where the touring stuff happens, as far as I'm aware that's where the vast majority has always happened. The relationship between MG's and NO could be better, my experience is that in some ways it is better than it was a decade ago and in no respect is it worse.
For the record - I voted against the merger, I saw no reason for there not to be two independent groups working together. But I long got over it and accept we are where we are.

roubaixtuesday
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Re: Cycling UK Interim CEO

Postby roubaixtuesday » 21 Apr 2020, 1:11pm

reohn2 wrote:
roubaixtuesday wrote:
reohn2 wrote:I'm objecting to a cycling club being stolen from under the noses of it's membership and turned into a business masquerading as a "charity".
I realise it's a contentious issue for some,but I can't see what it's achieved anymore than when it was member owned and run,for all the over inflated salaries being paid to it's top executives toeing a government line with a threat of losing their salaries if they don't!
There's also been much money spent on rebranding and repackaging.
It used to be a CYCLIST'S TOURING CLUB it's not that anymore and is the worse for it IMHO.
YVMV mine won't,it lost my membership when it was hijacked and became what it never was before.


Sure, you preferred how it was in the past.

But it isn't like that now, like it or not.

So what's your specific objection to the advert for an interim CEO? It's not at all clear to me.

The amount of money being wasted on salaries for no appreciable gain for cycling,especially touring cycling and that IMHO the club was stolen from it's members.


OK, so your objection is that this is being advertised at above market rates? Is that correct?

reohn2
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Re: Cycling UK Interim CEO

Postby reohn2 » 21 Apr 2020, 1:24pm

roubaixtuesday wrote:
reohn2 wrote:
roubaixtuesday wrote:
Sure, you preferred how it was in the past.

But it isn't like that now, like it or not.

So what's your specific objection to the advert for an interim CEO? It's not at all clear to me.

The amount of money being wasted on salaries for no appreciable gain for cycling,especially touring cycling and that IMHO the club was stolen from it's members.


OK, so your objection is that this is being advertised at above market rates? Is that correct?

I'm pointing out that when the CTC was a club it didn't need such a high salaried CEO and that I can't see any improvement as a charity.I think I've made my position clear enough.
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reohn2
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Re: Cycling UK Interim CEO

Postby reohn2 » 21 Apr 2020, 1:35pm

PH wrote:
reohn2 wrote:This is what happens when a club owned and run by it's members is turned into a so called "charity" and run as a business and it's members become donors.

Do you have any evidence that the two things are in any way related, or is it just another case that you don't like the charity status so attribute everything else you don't like to it?

In what way related?
I'm pointing out that despite the high salaried CEO and perhaps others,I see no improvement in the CTC/CUK from when it was a club


I think it's deeply disrespectful to the trustees, those I've met share the same interests and aims as I do as a member. I'm more involved at a local level than national, that's where the touring stuff happens, as far as I'm aware that's where the vast majority has always happened. The relationship between MG's and NO could be better, my experience is that in some ways it is better than it was a decade ago and in no respect is it worse.
For the record - I voted against the merger, I saw no reason for there not to be two independent groups working together. But I long got over it and accept we are where we are.

I got over it when I left but I still believe the club was stolen and if I could see a real improvement for the high salaried CEO and charitable status I'd rejoin but I can't and so won't,I'm merely putting an opinion forward,that the CTC is no better now than when it was a club,plus if it makes too many negative noises in the government's direction about it's cycling policy it runs the risk of having it's charitable status removed.
That position makes it's campaigning position limited and as such IMO has been bought by that charitable status.
That as an exmember is my opinion,I don't think I'm alone in that.
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Cyril Haearn
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Re: Cycling UK Interim CEO

Postby Cyril Haearn » 21 Apr 2020, 1:39pm

How much did head honchos get back then? Are they really paid much more now in real terms?
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PH
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Re: Cycling UK Interim CEO

Postby PH » 21 Apr 2020, 1:49pm

reohn2 wrote:I got over it when I left but I still believe the club was stolen and if I could see a real improvement for the high salaried CEO

It would be better IMO if your opinion was based of fact rather than emotion. The accounts going back to 2005 are on the website if it would aid you in doing so.

roubaixtuesday
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Re: Cycling UK Interim CEO

Postby roubaixtuesday » 21 Apr 2020, 1:51pm

reohn2 wrote:
roubaixtuesday wrote:
reohn2 wrote:The amount of money being wasted on salaries for no appreciable gain for cycling,especially touring cycling and that IMHO the club was stolen from it's members.


OK, so your objection is that this is being advertised at above market rates? Is that correct?

I'm pointing out that when the CTC was a club it didn't need such a high salaried CEO and that I can't see any improvement as a charity.I think I've made my position clear enough.


Sure, I understand that, but now it isn't a club, do you think they're doing something wrong? I don't understand your position.

Oldjohnw
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Re: Cycling UK Interim CEO

Postby Oldjohnw » 21 Apr 2020, 2:08pm

I very much doubt that government can remove charitable status.

I have no view on this discussion since I am a recent member.
Last edited by Oldjohnw on 21 Apr 2020, 5:49pm, edited 1 time in total.
John

reohn2
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Re: Cycling UK Interim CEO

Postby reohn2 » 21 Apr 2020, 2:11pm

PH wrote:
reohn2 wrote:I got over it when I left but I still believe the club was stolen and if I could see a real improvement for the high salaried CEO

It would be better IMO if your opinion was based of fact rather than emotion. The accounts going back to 2005 are on the website if it would aid you in doing so.

Just looked at the accounts for 2017/18,perhaps I missed it or I'm a bit thick,but I can't see any mention of staff salaries.
Last edited by reohn2 on 21 Apr 2020, 2:18pm, edited 1 time in total.
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reohn2
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Re: Cycling UK Interim CEO

Postby reohn2 » 21 Apr 2020, 2:17pm

roubaixtuesday wrote:
reohn2 wrote:
roubaixtuesday wrote:
OK, so your objection is that this is being advertised at above market rates? Is that correct?

I'm pointing out that when the CTC was a club it didn't need such a high salaried CEO and that I can't see any improvement as a charity.I think I've made my position clear enough.


Sure, I understand that, but now it isn't a club, do you think they're doing something wrong? I don't understand your position.

My position is as stated.IMO what was once a club was changed into a charity,something that it never intended being,I know you won't agree and say times have changed,but it paved the way for salaried CEO's on £90k per annum with no appreciable gain for it's member with much money spent on rebranding and relaunches that were frankly a flop.
That is my gripe!
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PH
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Re: Cycling UK Interim CEO

Postby PH » 21 Apr 2020, 2:36pm

reohn2 wrote:it paved the way for salaried CEO's on £90k per annum with no appreciable gain for it's member with much money spent on rebranding and relaunches that were frankly a flop.

But you've made a comparison that is not based on fact.
Is a bigger percentage of the income going into staffing costs? Is a higher proportion of my membership subs? Is less being spent on member benefits?
All of this information is contained in the accounts, it isn't a matter of opinion it's a matter of fact.

reohn2
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Re: Cycling UK Interim CEO

Postby reohn2 » 21 Apr 2020, 2:42pm

What I'll do is retain my (unproven) opinion exit the thread and let you all get on with it.
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roubaixtuesday
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Re: Cycling UK Interim CEO

Postby roubaixtuesday » 21 Apr 2020, 3:00pm

reohn2 wrote:
roubaixtuesday wrote:
reohn2 wrote:I'm pointing out that when the CTC was a club it didn't need such a high salaried CEO and that I can't see any improvement as a charity.I think I've made my position clear enough.


Sure, I understand that, but now it isn't a club, do you think they're doing something wrong? I don't understand your position.

My position is as stated.IMO what was once a club was changed into a charity,something that it never intended being,I know you won't agree and say times have changed,but it paved the way for salaried CEO's on £90k per annum with no appreciable gain for it's member with much money spent on rebranding and relaunches that were frankly a flop.
That is my gripe!


It's a gripe which doesn't seem to have any particular connection to this advert!

I've no idea what the going rate for not-for-profit CEOs is, but £90k to run an organisation with 100 employees and an aspiration to influence govt doesn't seem totally out of kilter to me. Whether it's designated a club or a charity doesn't seem particularly relevant to me to the remuneration.

reohn2
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Re: Cycling UK Interim CEO

Postby reohn2 » 21 Apr 2020, 3:12pm

roubaixtuesday wrote:It's a gripe which doesn't seem to have any particular connection to this advert!

It does to me

I've no idea what the going rate for not-for-profit CEOs is, but £90k to run an organisation with 100 employees and an aspiration to influence govt doesn't seem totally out of kilter to me. Whether it's designated a club or a charity doesn't seem particularly relevant to me to the remuneration

It didn't influence the government of the day before and it doesn't now,or if it does I'm completely unaware of it in my neck of the woods.
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backnotes
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Re: Cycling UK Interim CEO

Postby backnotes » 21 Apr 2020, 5:34pm

reohn2 wrote:Just looked at the accounts for 2017/18,perhaps I missed it or I'm a bit thick,but I can't see any mention of staff salaries.


https://www.cyclinguk.org/sites/default ... _pages.pdf

Page 70 has the total salary costs for all staff, and a breakdown according to job function, and page 71 covers salaries of staff who earn more than £60k.