The Tour (TDF) Live action/results. SPOILERS!!

[Si]

I guess that it depends on who the riders are. Wiggo and Frome showed, in the vuelta, that they are prepared to sacrifice themselves for each other. Others haven't been this enamoured of team work (Lemond-Hinault for example, who if they were not head and shoulders above the competition could have done some real damage with their in fighting).

It was also interesting to hear the commentators speculating on Nibali and Evans working together. In the days of Mig or Armstrong this probably wouldn't have happened much as everyone else had decided to fight for 2nd place. But with an unproven commodity like Wiggo, who knows?

[thirdcrank]

... who knows?

Nobody knows, but it's better to have two riders in the top three while pondering it.

There have been teams with two leaders, each heading a separate faction - especially in the days of national teams when there were competing commercial interests. The Sky team does seem to have arrived in Liège with a unanimous commitment to taking Wiggins to the Champs Elysées in yellow. (Not all the same personnel, of course, but remember the total team commitment that helped Cavendish to the rainbow jersey.)

Wiggins' morale must be raised by knowing he has a strong team and that effect must increase as the going gets tougher. There's no wind resistance benefit from being on a wheel up a big hill, it's all pacemaking ie psychological. There's also an element of "my gang's bigger than your gang." The main role of the team is to keep the pace so high that sudden attacks are difficult, if not impossible, or if a specialist climber does get away, then they are soon reeled back in. This is why the specialist climber is a dying breed in terms of riding for the overall win. The next role, and let's hope it doesn't come to this is to help the leader get back or at least minimise time loss if they have a bad patch or a mechanical.

I suppose that all I'm really saying is that in a disciplined team, the leader doesn't need to worry about his team mates: that's for the other teams. If anybody not currently in the top three wants a podium place, they've got to dislodge Froome first and they won't manage that by attacking Wiggins with Sky having the tactical option of putting Froome on their back wheel. I also fancy that the morale of the whole team is lifted if they are considered to be team mates rather than simply servants. (Some top riders in the past were known for sending domestiques on silly errands just to emphasis their leadership of the team.)

Let's also remember that both Wiggins and Froome can look forward to the final TT if they need to recover time and this factor must be worrying the others. Finally, if things should come to the worst, when it comes to GC contenders, we've got one to spare.

[Si]

I shouldn't bank too much on the final TT - if Evans has the yellow on then we could expect the jersey to do it's magic and give him an extra burst of speed. Likewise, if Wiggo has lost the yellow then it means he's probably taken a pasting along the way somewhere...will he have recovered? In the vuelta he did go off the boil a bit towards the end, but then he approached that race with a whole different build up. On the other hand, if his tank is still OK by the last TT, we could see fireworks.....he might even have a bit left to help the early part of the lead out for Cav on the champs the day after (should Cav not have wandered of to go prepare for some club race in That London)!

[thirdcrank]

I hope I'm not banking on anything in that sense. I'm trying to be analytical. There was a time when the greater part of the field was made up of decent riders but not potential winners. Lone breaks by the big names were common and gaps in the order of 15 minutes were no big deal. There is now strength in depth with riders drawn from all over the place, keeping average speeds high and the gaps down.

Apart from all that, so long as divided loyalties don't pull the team apart, would there be anything wrong with a Froome win? If somebody had told me at any time in the last fifty-odd years that a GB rider would win the 2012 TdF I for one would not have been worrying who it was going to be. And as you say - it's by no means guaranteed that a GB rider will win in 2012: it's just that the prospects look a lot better than they do for some of the other teams.

(And keep your fingers crossed.)
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PS

edit to add an example of what I mean: in this week's Sunday Telegraph, Brendan gallagher wrote

...Chris Froome took the stage honours on the first serious climb of the tour and Bradley Wiggins tucked in just behind him to move effortlessly into the yellow jersey. (My emphasis.)

Effortlessly? Normally I'd have been jumping up and down in annoyance at the use of the word, but frankly dear, I couldn't give a damn. I was jumping up and down with excitement. I'll leave the other 19 (?) directeurs sportifs to worry about things like that. We are riding high. Let's enjoy it. Whatever else anybody may say about cycling commentators, we haven't got a Mark Lawrenson impersonator.

[Si]

would there be anything wrong with a Froome win?

Well, if our Aussie-Belguim englishman can't win then I'm all for our Kenyan englishman

...just like I supported our Manx englishman last year, and our Maltese-Scotish englishman before that!

[thirdcrank]

I did once have an angry exchange of correspondence with the ultra-smug gets at the BBC (Grandstand or Sportsview) when the programmed coverage of the Pro Worlds Road Championship was pulled so they could show Greg Whatsisname playing in an early round of some tennis championship. (Of course, they don't tell you till the end of the programme so that you don't switch over to something else. Their reply did point out that it was inevitable, once Rusedski (sp?) got through. They didn't mention that in the programming. )

I did point out that there was as much likelihood of success for a flag-of-convenience Olympic bronze medal cyclist (ie Max Sciandri) as a flag-of convenience tennis player, but the BBC has powerful transmitters and rubbish receivers.

[reohn2]

There's been a certain amount of negative talk about the problems of having two riders at the top of the GC. It strikes me as a big asset since if anybody significant manages to get away from Wiggins, it would be pointless to make much effort with Froome sitting on their wheel.

It might be argued that in riding to a great second place in the TT, Froome was wasting energy that might be needed later in the race but with a rest day today, I think a bit of crushing domination of the TT by Sky will have left most of the others with some thinking to do. So far, Sky riders have won one sprint, one finish at the top of a sharp climb and a TT. They've been wearing the team classification yellow helmets most of the time, the polka dot jersey for one day and now they have the yellow jersey with two riders in the top three.

Although it's widely described as "two weeks to go" and the big mountain stages are still to come, half the race has been ridden and Sky seems to have it by the scruff of the neck.

I'd say that's a pretty fair assesment of things as they stand

I suppose that all I'm really saying is that in a disciplined team, the leader doesn't need to worry about his team mates: that's for the other teams. If anybody not currently in the top three wants a podium place, they've got to dislodge Froome first and they won't manage that by attacking Wiggins with Sky having the tactical option of putting Froome on their back wheel. I also fancy that the morale of the whole team is lifted if they are considered to be team mates rather than simply servants

.
I don't think there's a better true team in the race TBH.

Anything can happen in bike racing but let's enjoy the current success.
(But let's keep our fingers crossed )

It's never won until Paris and there's quite a bit of tarmac to go under the wheels until then so yes,lets hope for no nasty surprises and consiquent team mistakes like last year.

[reohn2]

TOMMY,TOMMY,TOMMY!
The many face pulls of Thomas Voechler.
Today was the winners face
Chapeau Tommy.
Thanks!

[Si]

Yer man Nibali, he sounds a bit of a whinger (maybe that's what it takes to be champ?) - "mommy, mommy, Bradley looked at me!" .

[reohn2]

Yer man Nibali, he sounds a bit of a whinger (maybe that's what it takes to be champ?) - "mommy, mommy, Bradley looked at me!" .

Nibali:-
"Wiggins looked at me at the finish and I really did not like the way he did it. He also gestured with his hand in a rude way."

I wonder if it was the Archer's salute he got upset about?

Gamesmanship on both sides.
IMO the descent wasn't long enough to gain any really time and with another climb albeit not a big one he was bound to be reeled in.

We were riding the same roads just a few weeks ago .
The descent from the Col-de-la-Lebe into Artemare is a beauty and if it hadn't been for the complaints from the stoker dept we could have safely been doing 60mph without problem on table top tarmac and lovely sweeping hairpins,as it was I had to be content with 40mph!

[thirdcrank]

I thought Phil and Friends made a lot more out of the Nibali attack (the breakaway that is, not the whingeing about respect) tan it justified. Part of that might have been caused by the footage concentrating on the main breakway with Voeckler, but at one point they were saying Nibali was ithing 20 seconds of getting across when the on-screen display was showing that he only had 20 seconds on the yellow jersey group. That was the crushing effect of a team able to maintain a prolonged tempo. Evans saved his energy. The commentary referred more than once to all the stars of the tour being in there, when in reality the race was spread all over the place, so the definition of a star is somebody who can stay with Sky. (Wordplay in there somewhere.)

Michael Rogers puncture showed what can happen, and if he had not managed to control his bike it might have been worse. Had it been Wiggins who punctured, it would have gone mad (and afterwards we'd have had all the post mortems about the etiquette of attacking a rider who has a puncture etc. As it was, he didn't so that's all speculation.

We are already getting to the point where riders outside the top few are looking to protect what they've achieved eg yesterday Radio Shack began riding on the front, presumably with an eye to retaining the Team classification.

I find Boardman intersting to listen to, but he does seem to be tending towards the doom and gloom. I'm beginning to notice a resemblance to mark Lawrenson - perhaps it's something in the atmoshphere around Liverpool - or eating all that seaweed. (You dancin'? ....)

Nibali is just being set up to sell more newspapers.

[Edwards]

So Evans can not hack it ans Nibali got could not get away. Nice thing with him and Brad at the finish.

[Cherwell]

I know David Millar is a controversial character, but I cheered when he won to-day’s stage.

[thirdcrank]

I'll be watching the recording later on, so I'll speculate that the commentators on the various channels mentioned that today is the 45th anniversary of the death of Tom Simpson. Building on the pioneering efforts of riders such as Brian Robinson and Tom, we have come a long way. Four stage wins already, top two spots on GC, and one of the team is wearing the rainbow jersey, last won by a British rider (Tom Simpson again) in 1965.

Anything can happen but it's a situation to be enjoyed.

[Si]

I know David Millar is a controversial character, but I cheered when he won to-day’s stage.

Me too. I've always liked him, OK, yes he disappointed over the drugs thing, but call me easily taken in if you like however I believed his account of it being an almost one off thing, and that he's not only been clean since but has campaigned to help others stay clean. In my view anyone can make a mistake - it's what you do after that counts. Very classy rider.

various channels mentioned that today is the 45th anniversary of the death of Tom Simpson

Yes, but unfortunately when I heard them mentioning it it was to do with drugs .