It's all in the name - Cyclists' TOURING club

Discussion of the re-branding of CTC as Cycling UK.
Steady rider
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Re: It's all in the name - Cyclists' TOURING club

Postby Steady rider » 7 Mar 2016, 10:29am

1.7 The objects for which the Club is established (the Objects) are to:
........1.7.1 promote community participation in healthy recreation by promoting the amateur sport of
cycling, cycle touring and associated amateur sports;
........1.7.2 preserve and protect the health and safety of the public by encouraging and facilitating cycling
and the safety of cyclists;
........1.7.3 advance education by whatever means the trustees think fit, including the provision of cycling,
training and educational activities related to cycling;
........1.7.4 promote the conservation and protection of the environment.



The problem comes in when the wishes of the membership are in conflict with the interests of the charity
.

The objects of the charity/club do not include self promotion or changes to the name to make it more appealing. It is in the interests of the charity that the club functions without undue conflict. The name change is nothing directly to do with the objects, it is speculation if a new brand would be of benefit or not or if replaced with some other brand in x years.

Psamathe
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Re: It's all in the name - Cyclists' TOURING club

Postby Psamathe » 7 Mar 2016, 10:34am

TonyR wrote:
Psamathe wrote:But my interpretation would be that it is still and Article and thus must be followed until such time as it is removed. And you cant really change the regs retrospectively because they become "awkward" when you want to do something (enough) members disagree with.

So I'd have thought that as it was in effect when the petition was delivered, it must be followed.

My interpretation anyway.


You are probably right which is why the CC has recommended that Council take legal advice and carefully document where members have forced them to diverge from the interests of the Charity as determined by Council. In that way the legal liability for any losses is likely to be attributed to the members not Council

At the moment the members have not forced the organisation to diverge from the interests of the charity. All the petition has done is to force a vote of the membership. We would have to wait for the outcome of that vote to determine if any "forcing" has been done.

And the "interests of the charity" can become very vague. Members provide income. Alienating the membership and acting contrary to their wishes could be described as "not being in the interests of the charity". So there might even be an argument that the current organisation has not been acting in the interests of the charity by not consulting the membership. Things could be argued both ways and I suspect there would be contributory factors on both "sides".

Ian

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Re: It's all in the name - Cyclists' TOURING club

Postby Steady rider » 7 Mar 2016, 12:20pm

11.5 All decisions arrived at by a poll of the whole Club shall bind the Club and the Council for six months.


This could be viewed as a safeguard, if Council has made a decision that a vote of the whole club thinks is invalid, the Council cannot act on it for 6 months, leaving time to review the decision. Without this safeguard any decision may go forward without a mechanism that would force a review and time to fully review. it could be viewed as not incompatible with the overall aims and objects of a cycling club and charity.

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Re: It's all in the name - Cyclists' TOURING club

Postby Velocio » 7 Mar 2016, 5:09pm

Because of my loyalty to our Club, I received my retro letter, envelope and Souvenir Gazette today wonderfully espousing 'The Cyclists' Touring Club' ...from Jon Snow ...and supported by our Queen ...with not a mention of the silly nonsense of a change of name of our Club. In fact the letter, mainly about leaving a Will to the CTC, and the Gazette seemed to be extolling the virtues of the 'CTC' historically, presently and in the future. Perhaps no-one has told Mr Snow, HRH, or others involved in this latest promotion of the changes planned either!!! :)
Last edited by Velocio on 7 Mar 2016, 6:42pm, edited 1 time in total.
...ever cycle ...ever CTC

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Re: It's all in the name - Cyclists' TOURING club

Postby Steady rider » 7 Mar 2016, 6:02pm

I also received a copy, a good effort by the CTC or the person who compiled it, it needs a web site link.

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Re: It's all in the name - Cyclists' TOURING club

Postby Whimwham7 » 7 Mar 2016, 7:55pm

Velocio wrote:Because of my loyalty to our Club, I received my retro letter, envelope and Souvenir Gazette today wonderfully espousing 'The Cyclists' Touring Club' ...from Jon Snow ...and supported by our Queen ...with not a mention of the silly nonsense of a change of name of our Club. In fact the letter, mainly about leaving a Will to the CTC, and the Gazette seemed to be extolling the virtues of the 'CTC' historically, presently and in the future. Perhaps no-one has told Mr Snow, HRH, or others involved in this latest promotion of the changes planned either!!! :)


Well I have just posted off my response to this begging letter. On the back of the form, J Snow asked for comments. These are mine -

Set against the background of the unrest among members resulting from the bodged (partial) “re-branding” of CTC to “Cycling UK”, I find this begging letter mail-shot extremely distasteful.

Many thoughts sprang to mind as I read the retro styled presentation; the use of the winged wheel on supposedly aged paper; the so called “Gazette” with 19th century font and styling; the promise of a winged wheel badge if I sign up; all seemingly designed to foster a sense of connection with the past. This, at a time when Council are seeking to foist on the members a new identity with a new logo, name and motto.

Bearing in mind the Chair of Council’s concern as to how much a ballot of members concerning the re-branding will cost, I wondered how much this mail-shot has cost. Postage alone to 67,000 members (my household received two identical, individually stamped copies) would total £36,180, on top of the design and printing costs. I, of course don’t know whether all members were targeted, or only those of us of more mature years who are likely to “pop our clogs” in the near future; which would be a somewhat macabre misuse of our personal data.

Since it is only some four years since the CTC was re-branded as “the national cycling charity” (which makes us sound as if CTC is a charity looking after dementia ridden old cyclists) yet another change of style and logo seems a total waste of members’ subscriptions. For that reason alone I not only decline your invitation to bequeath my money to the CTC (or Cycling UK), but I am now questioning whether I wish to be associated any longer with such a muddled (dis)organisation.

Kindly pass on these comments to the Chair of Council and to the Chief Executive.

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gaz
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Re: It's all in the name - Cyclists' TOURING club

Postby gaz » 7 Mar 2016, 8:02pm

Posts on thread suggest the rebrand may be the end of our heritage and the Winged Wheel - Cries of "you are abandoning our heritage".

CTC sends a mailing demonstrating the continued use of our heritage and the Winged Wheel - Cries of "how dare you use our heritage".

Damned if they don't, damned if they do :mrgreen: .
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Barred1
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Re: It's all in the name - Cyclists' TOURING club

Postby Barred1 » 7 Mar 2016, 8:12pm

gaz wrote:Posts on thread suggest the rebrand may be the end of our heritage and the Winged Wheel - Cries of "you are abandoning our heritage".

CTC sends a mailing demonstrating the continued use of our heritage and the Winged Wheel - Cries of "how dare you use our heritage".

Damned if they don't, damned if they do :mrgreen: .


I really can't agree with your last sentence - it just shows the lack of co-ordination, desperation and a total lack of professionalism emanating from "whatever it's called today" at Guildford.

For any organisation the brand must be consistent - by that I mean the corporate brand (before someone goes back to the post about Unilever having n "brands" - they are product brands ... that's different)

Is it the wheel, the wobbly bike, or the kid in Year 3's drawing that's the brand?

B1
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Regulator
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Re: It's all in the name - Cyclists' TOURING club

Postby Regulator » 8 Mar 2016, 9:14am

gaz wrote:Posts on thread suggest the rebrand may be the end of our heritage and the Winged Wheel - Cries of "you are abandoning our heritage".

CTC sends a mailing demonstrating the continued use of our heritage and the Winged Wheel - Cries of "how dare you use our heritage".

Damned if they don't, damned if they do :mrgreen: .



Hey gaz...

How about posting something that Head Office hasn't fed you?

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Re: It's all in the name - Cyclists' TOURING club

Postby Vorpal » 8 Mar 2016, 9:25am

Steady rider wrote:The objects of the charity/club do not include self promotion or changes to the name to make it more appealing. It is in the interests of the charity that the club functions without undue conflict. The name change is nothing directly to do with the objects, it is speculation if a new brand would be of benefit or not or if replaced with some other brand in x years.

Not self-promotion, but I think that significant reason for re-branding is that it will help the CTC achieve it's goals as a charity, or at least that's the idea.
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honesty
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Re: It's all in the name - Cyclists' TOURING club

Postby honesty » 8 Mar 2016, 9:28am

Regulator wrote:
gaz wrote:Posts on thread suggest the rebrand may be the end of our heritage and the Winged Wheel - Cries of "you are abandoning our heritage".

CTC sends a mailing demonstrating the continued use of our heritage and the Winged Wheel - Cries of "how dare you use our heritage".

Damned if they don't, damned if they do :mrgreen: .



Hey gaz...

How about posting something that Head Office hasn't fed you?


Explain how making a bit of a jokey sum up of two concurrent situation is information fed from head office? Seems a rather weird leap there.

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Re: It's all in the name - Cyclists' TOURING club

Postby meic » 8 Mar 2016, 9:59am

Gaz always gives honest reliable information often carefully researched and referenced. The fact that he is arguing for the wrong cause :mrgreen: doesnt change that one bit.
Even if he was getting fed info from NO, I would trust him to vet it more stringently than I even could.
Unlike other posters from that side who are creating "the most favourable construction that can not be dis-proven"
Yma o Hyd

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Graham
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Re: It's all in the name - Cyclists' TOURING club

Postby Graham » 8 Mar 2016, 10:01am

Many Thanks to Gaz for his forensic efforts to build up a picture of what went on in the course of events.

i.e. Bringing to our attention documents that have apparently only ever been read by a tiny number of people and even saving us from having to plough through them in their entirety.

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Si
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Re: It's all in the name - Cyclists' TOURING club

Postby Si » 8 Mar 2016, 1:15pm

Yes indeed, we should remember that just because someone may not agree with our views it does not necessarily mean that they are the anti-Christ and being fed information from whichever side of the debate they are on.

Surely our own positions would appear a little more believable if we were to post reasoned (and polite) rebuffs of what our opposites have said rather than merely making insinuations and totally unsubstantiated accusations ?

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Re: It's all in the name - Cyclists' TOURING club

Postby Whimwham7 » 8 Mar 2016, 3:25pm

Barred1 wrote:
gaz wrote:Posts on thread suggest the rebrand may be the end of our heritage and the Winged Wheel - Cries of "you are abandoning our heritage".

CTC sends a mailing demonstrating the continued use of our heritage and the Winged Wheel - Cries of "how dare you use our heritage".

Damned if they don't, damned if they do :mrgreen: .


I really can't agree with your last sentence - it just shows the lack of co-ordination, desperation and a total lack of professionalism emanating from "whatever it's called today" at Guildford.

For any organisation the brand must be consistent - by that I mean the corporate brand (before someone goes back to the post about Unilever having n "brands" - they are product brands ... that's different)

Is it the wheel, the wobbly bike, or the kid in Year 3's drawing that's the brand?

B1


Having gone through several re-brandings with my former employers, due to mergers, takeovers etc., I know from experience that re-branding has to be an ALL or NOTHING process. Either keep what you have, or totally change everything. It also has to be done positively, and be something that conveys confidence to the staff and customers.

Council seem to want to have their cake and eat it, i.e. retain the winged wheel and all the history and tradition, and the funny bike logo, whilst at the same time adding yet another new logo and a new name. It simply reeks to me of a recipe for confusion, both to members and to those who the club wishes to influence.

I believe that this whole matter needs to go back to the beginning and start again.

W