Nutrition on a long ride

[TheNissanMan]

Thanks again for the feedback, in terms of the too much water mentioned earlier for the sake of an extra water bottle I thought it would be better to have too much and be balanced than not enough lol

[crazydave789]

just remember that you can only digest a litre of fluid an hour, the rest is just flushed through.

simple easy foods, peanut butter and jam or marmalade and cheese butties with fig rolls or chorley cakes was good enough for pro riders up until a few years ago. you need to feel that you have eaten something while satisfying slow carbs, quick carbs and protein. bananas too. home made flapjack with jam in the middle is a nice snack.

the food you eat is not for now but the next day so you don't feel wasted, don't get hungry so eat every hour at least along with a full bottle of fluids. don't wait to get thirsty either especially if you are sweating buckets.

dilute sweet fizzy drinks like coke or fanta with the same amount of water and it becomes digestible rather than dehydrating, avoid energy drinks like red bull and monster.

[NATURAL ANKLING]

Hi,
I think its about 800 ml an hour max, but I won't argue over a small detail.

A bottle an hour when its hot or your hot / warm, even in cold weather, we all perspire.
Eat every hour or top up more often with less.
You only have enough carbs in your blood and liver for about 3 hrs max at a good pace.
Even if you drink and eat half rations it will be better than none at all.

On my typical training rides of 2.5 - 3hrs I drink two bottles (carry three and sometimes drink all 3), I am some 1 kg lighter post ride, so I have lost 2- 2.5 kgs in fluid.

Of course its down to effort, you will need a lot less with less effort.
And fat burn will kick in to with low heart rate.

On the OP's ride of 54 miles if you manage to drink say 400 mls an hour and stuff a banana or two, some cereal bars and a mars bar down you won't go far wrong.

[Vorpal]

I rode a leisurely 60ish miles on Tuesday afternoon.

I ate:
-normal breakfast (coffee, porridge, eggs, and a little fruit)
-moderate lunch of salad, bread, cheese and pudding (raspberries and brownies)
-an orange before I set out at 14:30
-after about 70 minutes (I'm not sure the distance), I stopped for an ice cream (it was hot) and a little break
-I got to my ferry (24ish miles) at 16:45
-on the ferry I ate one cheese sandwich, another orange, a pastry and a coffee
-I'm not sure how long the ferry was; under an hour including loading and unloading
-at 20:00, I had a smoothie and a banana and rested while my phone charged

I got home around 23:15. I was carrying luggage that included a laptop computer, phone, change of clothes (including a jumper & spare socks and stuff), sun cream, hair brush, notes from the conference I went to, lock, tools, spare inner tube, chargers, toothbrush & toothpaste, etc. I didn't weigh it, but it wasn't light. I stopped to take some photos, look at views, pet cats, and charge my phone.

I also started with about 1.25 litres of water, refilled .75 litres on the ferry, and had about .4 litres left when I got home, so that's about 1.6 litres over 9 and a bit hours, of which I guess 7 or so was spent cycling (as opposed to taking photos, looking at views, petting cats, eating ice cream, etc.). I don't use a computer, so I'm not sure exactly how many miles (there were a couple of missed turns and that sort of thing) or exactly how much time was spent in actual cycling.

[crazydave789]

Hi,
I think its about 800 ml an hour max, but I won't argue over a small detail.

not arguing just a point of interest

the figures I was taught as an army medic and survival instructor was 1l a hour ingested orally which is where water parades came from, depending upon the subject it is probably less in a lot of cases but would provide a small surplus to prevent kidney stones and constipation. you can do it faster rectally if you have to rehydrate in a hurry without an IV set or if it is too cold/too much fluid loss. rectal infusion is the second fastest way to rehydrate. not so comfortable in the saddle though.

I used to teach this to troops as using something like a camelbak you can pop any type of water up there which could be vital with a heatstroke casualty. take the bite valve off first though

[PhilD28]

Can I offer an alternative opinion.

Myself and a group of cycling club friends (6 of us) ages between 60 and 70 have been riding together since school days. We meet up 3 times a week and ride about 60 miles, we all ride most other days too. Apart from breakfast where some like a fry up others some form of cereal, none of us eat on a four hour ride such as this, just drink plain water from either one or two bottles we each carry, then home for a nice lunch.

We thought this was normal, but from the comments here it doesn't seem to be apart from Mick F who seems to have a similar regime. Maybe it's the fact that we have ridden like this for so many years and are adapted, I'm not sure, as i say I thought this was normal. We do sometimes stop for a coffee but mostly not, we did all used to race in our younger days and some still ride vets events, most of us do long summer camping tours.

Anyway, good luck with your ride, I'm sure you will be fine whatever you choose to eat and drink, willpower can make up for a lot of deficiencies. BTW I often do my 60 milers in a fasted state (twice a week) and find no change in performance, but again I've fasted a couple of days a week for years so my body is adapted to burn fat very well and am not suggesting you try it.

There's a lot of research going on about exercising while the body is in ketosis and I have friends who ride Audaxes like this with no ill effects, possibly worth considering in the future.

[NATURAL ANKLING]

Hi,
And we all did that for years, and I still do today, I just would not give that as advice, who would.

If you are experienced and fit enough then much is possible, but if you are on a mission to go far and fast then you will need to eat like a horse

[PhilD28]

Hi,
I made the point very clearly, I wasn't advising him to do the ride without food, more making the point that the ride isn't actually that far and that there are alternative ways to ride without gobbling up large amounts of food that the body may not need....once used to it. I was aware he had recieved plenty of opinions on how to fuel for his ride but few about alternative ways.

I have spent a lifetime going far, and during the early part pretty fast too as an ex decent level (national) road racer/time trialist.

I think I'll give up offering opinions on this forum, it seems that a small number of people wish to hold a monopoly on what is the right way to do things, as if one way is the only way and aren't open minded to alternative views.

[ANTONISH]

I've been reading this with a mounting sense of disbelief - at last PhilD28 comes along with some common sense - I probably couldn't keep up with his group - I'm a bit senior to them though.
This is a 50 mile bike ride - if you have a decent breakfast and carry a bottle of water ( possibly with some electrolytes) and a couple of cereal bars you should have no problem.
I've never ridden the London - Brighton event - friends who have generally didn't enjoy being in a large group of people with little idea of group riding.
I would be more worried about people riding erratically, suddenly stopping in front of me and of course potholes when forward vision is limited.
I'm off on a 45 mile hilly ride today ( with a bottle of drink and a couple of cereal bars ).

[TheNissanMan]

It’s interesting reading this post and the thoughts/ideas behind them.

One thing from reading through is that It’s fantastic that you guys can ride and travel those distances without batting an eye lid, unfortunately as mentioned in the OP, I am not fit, I am not used to cycling long distances and although a number of comments in this post highlight that 50 miles isn’t that far, for someone who has never ridden that distance and does see it as a challenge rather than a leisurely ride it is viewed as something completely different hence the question being asked...

The feedback and assistance through some of these posts has been reassuring and invaluable whereas others seem to be based on a fit, experienced rider....

[Vorpal]

Someone who isn't used to cycling so far is likely to need a little more food and water than what is normal either for them, or for someone who is used to it.

[Vorpal]

I've been thinking about this thread, and would like to make a couple of points.

1) no one has said that there's a *right* way to do this, or even implied, and several people have suggested that the OP should eat what they want, and not worry about it.

2) implying that 50 miles isn't anything special and doesn't require thought about nutrition is a bit unfair to someone for whom 50 miles is a challenge, and that kind of attitude can definitely be off-putting for beginners.

Everyone is different and needs to approach these things in the way that best suits them and their needs.

[NATURAL ANKLING]

Hi,

Hi,
I made the point very clearly, I wasn't advising him to do the ride without food, more making the point that the ride isn't actually that far and that there are alternative ways to ride without gobbling up large amounts of food that the body may not need....once used to it. I was aware he had recieved plenty of opinions on how to fuel for his ride but few about alternative ways.

I have spent a lifetime going far, and during the early part pretty fast too as an ex decent level (national) road racer/time trialist.

I think I'll give up offering opinions on this forum, it seems that a small number of people wish to hold a monopoly on what is the right way to do things, as if one way is the only way and aren't open minded to alternative views.

I wasn't directing that comment at you, and sorry if you think it was.

But every time we get posts from less experienced / first time cyclist, there is a lot of what people can do and not what's best advise.
Stand by your opinions and don't give up because of what others say or imply here.

I have never competed at all on a bike so take my comments about nutrition etc as a complete amateur.

[pjclinch]

I tend to chug along at a rate where I think I generate water while metabolising fuel (same when I'm hillwalking). Don't drink much and find myself stopping a fair bit to pee, and the pee is very pale (having said that, if I'm pushing hard and/or it's hot I'll drink a fair bit). I'm much on board with the idea that your body will probably tell you when you need a drink, and don't go out of your way to drink a lot just because you've read somewhere that you need to drink a lot.

For food, I'm an habitual grazer because I like food rather than need it (I have to work pretty hard to keep my weight at a sensible value, if I ate any time I felt like it I'd look like a blimp). So on a long ride I'll have a few things to eat, but more because cake than because I'm running out of fuel. It's probably more of a psychological boost than a calorific one, I can do without it if I don't have it. Another point about optional food is it gives you excuse to take a break, which can be a useful psychological tool if you're pushing yourself further than you're used to. And you don't have to eat it just because it's there.
Reinforcing that we're all different, my wife needs to carb up little and often or she just... stops. As long as she keeps fuelling she's generally faster and more capable than me, but I'm much more flexible in how and when I take on fuel.

Former world champ & Olympic medalist Emma Pooley was doing an online Q&A a few years ago and as she appears to be a bit of a baker I asked what she liked for long rides. She suggested a modified flapjack recipe with shredded apple and condensed milk rather than the usual butter/sugar mix, so while not quite as nice they're not nearly as heavy and I've found them very good for little & often nibbles on a long ride.

Dr. Pooley's Breezy Flapjacks:
One 300 ml tin of condensed milk
300g of oats
2 large (or 3 medium or 4 small) apples peeled and grated
handful of raisins/sultanas

Mix it all up, spread on to a greaseproof lined baking tray, bake in a cool oven (gas 1/140C/120C-fan) for 45-60 mins.

[slowster]

For the OP it is not the case that the distance 'isn't actually that far'. It should not be that difficult for any of us to appreciate that what might be easy for a fit, experienced cyclist might be a big challenge for an unfit, novice cyclist.

It's all relative. One rider might be able to ride 50 miles without eating anything; someone else might be able to ride 80. Moreover, the speed/intensity at which you ride is also probably going to influence how soon you need to eat, so at a higher intensity you might need to eat much sooner.

In his very first post the OP said he weighed 18 stone last year, and reduced that to 14+ stone before stopping cycling in the winter. Transporting that amount of extra bodyweight on a 50 mile bike ride is going to take a lot more energy. Moreover, because that weight is being carried on the body in the form of fat, it will be more detrimental to performance than the same weight on the bike in panniers (it will probably make the body's metabolism less efficient, increase sweating because of the extra 'insulation' on the body, and will increase pressure on the body's contact points - especially at the saddle).

When I started riding again after a lay off of many years and being very unfit, after a 25 mile ride I was very hungry and needed to eat something - preferably sweet - as soon as I finished. After a couple of months of regular riding, I realised that I was no longer hungry when I got back. I presume that my body had adapted both to become more efficient (using fewer calories to cycle the same distance) and to use more of my own body fat as the fuel source.

For the OP, the ride will be a huge achievement. However, what really matters is that he keeps on riding, because it will get progressively easier and he will get fitter and lose weight without even trying. Riding L2B will be the hardest part.