Homeopathy, does it work?

Does homeopathy work?

Poll ended at 13 Jul 2019, 9:10am

Yes!
5
9%
Tend to yes
2
3%
No!
49
84%
Tend to no
1
2%
Worth a try if normal treatment fails
1
2%
Don't know yet
0
No votes
 
Total votes: 58

softlips
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Re: Homeopathy, does it work?

Postby softlips » 7 Jun 2019, 10:53am

Cugel wrote:An alarming tale of scatter-brains in the good ole USA taking their freedoms to think stupid things to dangerous places, eagerly exploited by homeopaths of the type avid for dollars:

https://www.theguardian.com/society/201 ... ure-autism

The interesting thing is that these homeopaths (who probably just stuck on that label as a handy alternative-medicine emblem) claim their quackery can not only cure things like measles and autism but actually prevent them. As far as I know, standard-version homeopathy makes no claims to prevention, only cure.

But .... could the placebo effect work in a curative way? Does, for instance, taking an omega3 oil capsule each day have no direct physical effect but nevertheless manage a psychological effect, in keeping the swallower healthy?

Cugel


Omega 3 capsules have been found to have no effect unfortunately - cardiovasculary at least. The benefits of a diet high in Omega 3 are not replicated with Omega 3 supplements.

althebike
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Re: Homeopathy, does it work?

Postby althebike » 7 Jun 2019, 12:05pm

I have hardly ever had a successful visit to my GP . His doctorate is in medicine , and this usually either make my condition worse or creates other effects which then need treatment. Two years ago I had sepsis and had very prompt and effective treatment , and that is about the only time things worked out as planned. I go to a homeopath, not very often, but when something is not clearing up on its own , I go and the treatment to date works in days, my wife uses the same homeopath and has about as much success as I do with GPs, so the jury is out on this one. I do not care if it is a placebo effect or genuine while it works, it has to be better than going somewhere that does not work , but different treatments work for different people.Doctors and pharmaceutical companies demand the right to be the authority on health, and this is written into law.This has many safeguards because the chemical medicines should be tested and safe, and Doctors trained to a consistent and high standard.( in medicine,not necessarily health) This is not so with other health remedies and so ,however long something has been around and regardless of how effective it can be, there are legal constraints on what it can claim to do.

brynpoeth
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Re: Homeopathy, does it work?

Postby brynpoeth » 8 Jun 2019, 7:34am

horizon wrote:I was riding along today and reflecting about this thread. This is what came to mind:

Let's assume that someone is moved by a piece of music and feels better as a result. You won't find any molecules of music. And it would be almost impossible to prove (even if you wanted to) that the music actually caused an improvement in health. But if the poll was Music: does it work?, we may have had different answers but no more solid proof.

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ANTONISH
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Re: Homeopathy, does it work?

Postby ANTONISH » 8 Jun 2019, 8:54am

althebike wrote:I have hardly ever had a successful visit to my GP . His doctorate is in medicine , and this usually either make my condition worse or creates other effects which then need treatment. Two years ago I had sepsis and had very prompt and effective treatment , and that is about the only time things worked out as planned.

Just as well you went the conventional route for your sepsis - I don't know if homeopaths could deal with that.

I go to a homeopath, not very often, but when something is not clearing up on its own , I go and the treatment to date works in days, my wife uses the same homeopath and has about as much success as I do with GPs, so the jury is out on this one. I do not care if it is a placebo effect or genuine while it works, it has to be better than going somewhere that does not work , but different treatments work for different people.Doctors and pharmaceutical companies demand the right to be the authority on health, and this is written into law.This has many safeguards because the chemical medicines should be tested and safe, and Doctors trained to a consistent and high standard.( in medicine,not necessarily health) This is not so with other health remedies and so ,however long something has been around and regardless of how effective it can be, there are legal constraints on what it can claim to do.

"chemical medicines" ? - aren't some of the homeopathic substances chemicals?
The alternative practioners can make claims about the efficacy of their treatment provided it's been demonstrated in clinical trials.

Mike Sales
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Re: Homeopathy, does it work?

Postby Mike Sales » 8 Jun 2019, 9:05am

ANTONISH wrote:"chemical medicines" ? - aren't some of the homeopathic substances chemicals?


They are all chemicals, and probably entirely water.

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horizon
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Re: Homeopathy, does it work?

Postby horizon » 8 Jun 2019, 9:50am

ANTONISH wrote:"chemical medicines" ? - aren't some of the homeopathic substances chemicals?


Nearly all homeopathic "remedies" start off as physical substances (not all do, by the way). They are then diluted until nothing of substance remains, apart from the water they were diluted in. It is worth bearing in mind that the original substance would have been one that might cause the symptoms reported by the patient. That is what makes it homeopathic - like cures like (homo = like, pathy = disease). The little white pills containing nothing get the attention but the real controversy should really be about using a "medicine" that runs completely counter to Western medical thought: modern pharmaceutical drugs aim to halt or reduce symptoms while homeopathy exacerbates the symptoms in order to promote healing (that's the idea, anyway).
I have two doctors, my left leg and my right leg. (G. M. Trevelyan)
PS I always wondered why the YHA HQ was called Trevelyan House. :)

reohn2
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Re: Homeopathy, does it work?

Postby reohn2 » 8 Jun 2019, 10:03am

Working on the Homeopathy 'principle' the water we drink should contain enough 'tinctures' to heal us of almost anything we're ailing of :wink:
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Mike Sales
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Re: Homeopathy, does it work?

Postby Mike Sales » 8 Jun 2019, 10:12am

reohn2 wrote:Working on the Homeopathy 'principle' the water we drink should contain enough 'tinctures' to heal us of almost anything we're ailing of :wink:


It has to be shaken properly as well. You must not forget the succussion.

In homeopathy, homeopathic dilution is a process in which a substance is diluted with alcohol or distilled water and then vigorously shaken in a process called "succussion". Insoluble solids, such as quartz and oyster shell, are diluted by grinding them with lactose. The founder of homeopathy, Samuel Hahnemann believed that the process of succussion activated the "vital energy" of the diluted substance, and that successive dilutions increased the "potency" of the preparation.

reohn2
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Re: Homeopathy, does it work?

Postby reohn2 » 8 Jun 2019, 10:17am

Mike Sales wrote:
reohn2 wrote:Working on the Homeopathy 'principle' the water we drink should contain enough 'tinctures' to heal us of almost anything we're ailing of :wink:


It has to be shaken properly as well. You must not forget the succussion.

In homeopathy, homeopathic dilution is a process in which a substance is diluted with alcohol or distilled water and then vigorously shaken in a process called "succussion". Insoluble solids, such as quartz and oyster shell, are diluted by grinding them with lactose. The founder of homeopathy, Samuel Hahnemann believed that the process of succussion activated the "vital energy" of the diluted substance, and that successive dilutions increased the "potency" of the preparation.

Just off to the beach for some Oyster shells and I'll call at the pub on the way back :)
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Mike Sales
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Re: Homeopathy, does it work?

Postby Mike Sales » 8 Jun 2019, 10:24am

reohn2 wrote:Just off to the beach for some Oyster shells and I'll call at the pub on the way back :)


One wonders what maladies oyster shells or quartz are said to be good for. What are the symptoms they mimic?

reohn2
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Re: Homeopathy, does it work?

Postby reohn2 » 8 Jun 2019, 10:27am

Mike Sales wrote:
reohn2 wrote:Just off to the beach for some Oyster shells and I'll call at the pub on the way back :)


One wonders what maladies oyster shells or quartz are said to be good for. What are the symptoms they mimic?

Pearls of wisdom maybe?
Last edited by reohn2 on 8 Jun 2019, 10:45am, edited 1 time in total.
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horizon
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Re: Homeopathy, does it work?

Postby horizon » 8 Jun 2019, 10:44am

Mike Sales wrote:One wonders what maladies oyster shells or quartz are said to be good for. What are the symptoms they mimic?


Oyster shells are used as a source of calcium carbonate (I don't know why this particular source was chosen). AFAIK it is used for a range of conditions related to the body's absorption and use of calcium carbonate (e.g. in relation to bones and teeth).

The benefits of calcium. Your body needs calcium to build and maintain strong bones. Your heart, muscles and nerves also need calcium to function properly. Some studies suggest that calcium, along with vitamin D, may have benefits beyond bone health: perhaps protecting against cancer, diabetes and high blood pressure.


That's a quote from the more conventional Mayo Clinic website.
I have two doctors, my left leg and my right leg. (G. M. Trevelyan)
PS I always wondered why the YHA HQ was called Trevelyan House. :)

Mike Sales
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Re: Homeopathy, does it work?

Postby Mike Sales » 8 Jun 2019, 10:54am

horizon wrote:
Mike Sales wrote:One wonders what maladies oyster shells or quartz are said to be good for. What are the symptoms they mimic?


Oyster shells are used as a source of calcium carbonate (I don't know why this particular source was chosen). AFAIK it is used for a range of conditions related to the body's absorption and use of calcium carbonate (e.g. in relation to bones and teeth).

The benefits of calcium. Your body needs calcium to build and maintain strong bones. Your heart, muscles and nerves also need calcium to function properly. Some studies suggest that calcium, along with vitamin D, may have benefits beyond bone health: perhaps protecting against cancer, diabetes and high blood pressure.


That's a quote from the more conventional Mayo Clinic website.



That is what oyster shells are used for in conventional, evidenced medicine. That is not how homeopathy is said to work. Homeopathic remedies are chosen on the basis that they mimic the symptoms of a problem, and then are diluted and shaken. Presumably homeopaths believe that shells and stones, undiluted, would produce the symptoms of some malady. I wonder what symptoms, which maladies?

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Audax67
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Re: Homeopathy, does it work?

Postby Audax67 » 8 Jun 2019, 10:56am

Falling off rocks?
Have we got time for another cuppa?

Mike Sales
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Re: Homeopathy, does it work?

Postby Mike Sales » 8 Jun 2019, 10:59am

Audax67 wrote:Falling off rocks?


Onto a shell beach?