Holdsworth frame builders

[Euskadi]

Does anyone have any information on Holdsworth frame builders (names and years of work)? I have the following list of names and info mainly from Hilary Stone + Norman Kilgariff + Classic Lightweights websites

Frame builders
Jack Capeling
Bill Rann
Bill Harlow
Sid Bishop
Reg Collard
Chas Roberts
Tommy Quick
Alec Bird

What peaked my interest was a mention that the 'B' on frame no. B 9017 (La Quelda from 1948) was likely made by Sid Bishop.

I also came across a frame on eBay recently stamped TO (according to seller) no.11310. It has an awful paint job covering original decals, but head badge looks to place it round 1953 (as does frame no. as far as I can make out). Can't make out model from pics, but if the initials do indicate a custom job then it might explain some anomalies on lugs). I wondered whether the TO was actually a TQ for Tommy Quick, but I have no idea when he first started working at Holdsworth, only that it was likely he was there by 1961. Tommy's initials are usually listed as TCQ anyhow.

If there is any info anyone can add on names and years they worked at Holdsworth that would be fantastic.
Thanks

[Brucey]

FWIW I have a later (70's?) Holdsworth (serial number in the 40000s) and there is no letter stamp on the BB that I can see.

This subject is very interesting to me and I would be interested to find out more myself, I think you have done well so far!

cheers

[Euskadi]

Cheers! Have also been collecting Holdsworth frame numbers. Would be interested to know your Holdsworth model + exact frame number and year of purchase if known. The earliest Holdsworth '40000' frame number I have (so far) from the 1970s is a Holdsworth (prob Mistral) no.40611, which is dated 1972 or 1973. But it is in that category where the owner selling the bike thought it was one of those two years, so not given that was when the bike was made. I suspect it is newer. For instance in this case I also have a frame reasonably accurately dated to 1972 that has frame number 35555

I've collected close on 40 frame numbers, with varying degrees of accuracy around the dates!

[Brucey]

OK, this frame came to me 'in a bit of a state', built up with some rubbish components and the wrong, paint, wrong fork etc (amongst other things). The frame number is in the 427xx series. Because there were no original parts remaining, I have no clue as to its date except that by frame number (and perhaps seatstay bridge design) it ought to be '70s rather than '60s.

It has wrap-round seat stays (5/8" dia at the top), a pressed steel seat lug, no boss in the (straight) seatstay bridge, long pattern campag racing dropouts (no mudguard eyes), single point lugs (with about 1" long points), 4-o'clock cable stops (with no strain relief) on the top tube, no lever bosses (just a stop), a half chromed rear end, clearance for 27s or sprints and (originally) no bottle bosses, but did have a gear tunnel on the top of the BB shell (I stupidly cut it off, and now of course I'm thinking about replacing it... ). The bare frame accepts a 27.2mm seat pin, weighs about 4lb 6oz, and is built around 73/73 (judging by eye).

Quite a lot of the details remind me very much of a '70s era Roy Thame frame I also have. I confess I have made no special attempt to identify which model Holdsworth I have, or the exact year, maybe you can tell me!

BTW the Roy Thame frames open up another area of query; I think that they were basically built in the same way by the same blokes as built Holdsworths around that time, but have a different series of frame numbers. My Roy Thame is 75xxx which I have assumed means it was built in 1975, (although I have no idea if that is really the case or not).

cheers

[cycloret]

If you are collecting Holdsworth frame numbers, my Mistral's frame number is 045643, it's a 25.5" frame in spruce green. I kept the label, it says Holdsworthy and Assembly no.101794. I believe it to uses 531 butted Reynolds tubing which from a website catalogue I found, suggests it was made around 1982, by 1983 the catalogue give 531ST being used.

I bought it with insurance money after my Evan's sourced Dawes Galaxy was stolen around 1982 and commuted to work on it for about 8 years before I bought a Cannondale. My Mistral was repainted in the 1990s by Bob Jackson's and I rode a C2C on it in 2011.

Edit:On the label before the frame number is hand written what looks like C32. I am not sure what this means but the seat post is 32mm. Also hand written is the Colour: SPRUCIE

[Euskadi]

OK, this frame came to me 'in a bit of a state', built up with some rubbish components and the wrong, paint, wrong fork etc (amongst other things). The frame number is in the 427xx series. Because there were no original parts remaining, I have no clue as to its date except that by frame number (and perhaps seatstay bridge design) it ought to be '70s rather than '60s.

I do not have a 427xxx frame number in my book, but it is probably between 1974-1975

It has wrap-round seat stays (5/8" dia at the top), a pressed steel seat lug, no boss in the (straight) seatstay bridge, long pattern campag racing dropouts (no mudguard eyes), single point lugs (with about 1" long points), 4-o'clock cable stops (with no strain relief) on the top tube, no lever bosses (just a stop), a half chromed rear end, clearance for 27s or sprints and (originally) no bottle bosses, but did have a gear tunnel on the top of the BB shell (I stupidly cut it off, and now of course I'm thinking about replacing it... ). The bare frame accepts a 27.2mm seat pin, weighs about 4lb 6oz, and is built around 73/73 (judging by eye).

You'll need to post a pic or send a link, not easy to determine otherwise! Could be one of the models listed below before the Putney shop stopped making models. Send us pics!

Quite a lot of the details remind me very much of a '70s era Roy Thame frame I also have. I confess I have made no special attempt to identify which model Holdsworth I have, or the exact year, maybe you can tell me!

Here's a quote from Roy Thame from the Kilgariff website
Probably between Mar and Sep 1975, the shop stopped making Holdsworths, so the Strada, Italia, Pista, Cronometro, Cronometro Ultralight and Competizione models were no longer 'Holdsworth', they wore Roy Thame decals. "For the 1975 Harrogate show we introduced the Campionissimo range, these replace the Strada etc". (RT)


BTW the Roy Thame frames open up another area of query; I think that they were basically built in the same way by the same blokes as built Holdsworths around that time, but have a different series of frame numbers. My Roy Thame is 75xxx which I have assumed means it was built in 1975, (although I have no idea if that is really the case or not).

That fits with the quote from RT above

cheers

[Euskadi]

If you are collecting Holdsworth frame numbers, my Mistral's frame number is 045643, it's a 25.5" frame in spruce green. I kept the label, it says Holdsworthy and Assembly no.101794. I believe it to uses 531 butted Reynolds tubing which from a website catalogue I found, suggests it was made around 1982, by 1983 the catalogue give 531ST being used.

I bought it with insurance money after my Evan's sourced Dawes Galaxy was stolen around 1982 and commuted to work on it for about 8 years before I bought a Cannondale. My Mistral was repainted in the 1990s by Bob Jackson's and I rode a C2C on it in 2011.

Edit:On the label before the frame number is hand written what looks like C32. I am not sure what this means but the seat post is 32mm. Also hand written is the Colour: SPRUCIE

Cheers for this! Yep I would say frame is from '81-'82. I have an unidentified Holdsworth frame no.046086 and the date is given as 1982. The C32 does suggest a frame maker's transfer, but I have no knowledge about it. Thanks for info.

Nothing against the Galaxy (that was my bike growing up), but am sure the Mistral was an upgrade! Congrats on the C2C.

[Brucey]

Euskadi, thanks for that, I'll post pics of my frame when I get the chance!

cheers

[Andy Par]

Hi Euskadi, I also have a Holdsworth Record with the same frame number (35555) that you mentioned in your earlier post. I aquired it in June this year. Is it the same bike and if so how did you manage to accurately date the frame.

[sidolis]

Hi all - I am trying to identify a Holdsworth frame I have that I suspected was Holdsworth in decal only... but this thread is very interesting in terms of who it might have been that made it who was related to Holdsworth. The serial is "A 14270" which is not in the list of Holdsworth serials I've found online, but could it be by one of the builders here... if B was Sid Bishop then who was A?

I've also been pointed toward Roy Thame due to the detailing/lugs etc... but yet to discover any reliable info on his serials...?

Any tips gratefully received, I've posted pictures of the frame here on retrobike: http://www.retrobike.co.uk/forum/viewto ... 5#p2989685