Park Tool Chain Whip

[Redvee]

Nobody has mentioned the Decathlon 'chain whip'. It's different in that it locates over the smallest sprocket, 11-14t, and has a hole for the lockring tool.

[Gattonero]

Nobody has mentioned the Decathlon 'chain whip'. It's different in that it locates over the smallest sprocket, 11-14t, and has a hole for the lockring tool.

15, 16 and 17t sprockets are very common on track fixed gear bikes. This tool is not useful for that, plus would create a pressure point only on a couple of points, ok for cassettes but not good on stubborn sprockets.

[markfh]

Whilst respecting Gattonero's opinion I have a Decathlon 'chain whip' as well as a traditional chain whip and it is now my "tool of choice" for removing cassettes as I have found it far easier to keep it in position than a traditional chain whip. I also find it easier to get leverage between the 'whip' and the handle of the cassette lock ring tool.

[Brucey]

there are lots of tools that are good enough for cassette removal, but removing fixed gear sprockets and disassembling freewheels is a different matter entirely.

So don't buy a cheap chain whip and expect to remove fixed gear sprockets with it, and come to that, don't expect to have an easy time removing fully-tightened cassette lockrings, either. Plenty of folk claim to have no problem with the latter; well they can work loose in service anyway (moreso if they were never tight to start with) and very often they are not fully tightened to begin with.

cheers

[Mick F]

My home made ones used to undo freewheel sprockets ok. Never tied a fixed cog, but I bet it would have worked.

My Suntour 6sp freewheel assembly was removed from the hub by holding the two-dog tool in the vice and turning the wheel. It usually came off with a loud crack.

Then one chainwhip was mounted horizontally in the vice really really tight and the freewheel assembly rested on it with the largest sprocket engaged in the whip. The second one was wrapped round the smallest sprocket so it was horizontal and then with a heave - or usually a large hammer - the smallest sprocket was unscrewed, then the next, then the next, and so on. The largest one or two (or three?) were on splines.

Still use one of them nowadays. The other is still around sitting in a drawer if and when required.

[drossall]

there are lots of tools that are good enough for cassette removal, but removing fixed gear sprockets and disassembling freewheels is a different matter entirely.

Length for one thing. The cheap, bendy whip I talked about was typical length. The one I borrowed from my son in law was significantly longer than most so, not only did it get the sprocket off without even slightly flexing, I didn't even have to try hard. And the new one is longer still. I'm really hoping to get a nice, stuck sprocket soon

[Gattonero]

My home made ones used to undo freewheel sprockets ok. Never tied a fixed cog, but I bet it would have worked.

My Suntour 6sp freewheel assembly was removed from the hub by holding the two-dog tool in the vice and turning the wheel. It usually came off with a loud crack.

Then one chainwhip was mounted horizontally in the vice really really tight and the freewheel assembly rested on it with the largest sprocket engaged in the whip. The second one was wrapped round the smallest sprocket so it was horizontal and then with a heave - or usually a large hammer - the smallest sprocket was unscrewed, then the next, then the next, and so on. The largest one or two (or three?) were on splines.

Still use one of them nowadays. The other is still around sitting in a drawer if and when required.

I always prefer to lock the freewheel tool with the skewer, sitting on the wheel and using the right spanner with the additional leverage of and old Cannondale down-tube as 70cm extension. One hand one the wheel, the other hand in the tube facing forward. Yes, it may look weird, but it works.

For removing the sprockets in freewheels, I most often keep the two chain-whips in a "nutcracker" position, very good purchase.

[roger]

Still have the pipes and whip I used to use for Suntour blocks but find several good uses for the Copperslip that rendered them unnecessary.

Roger.

[Brucey]

IME, if you find it easy to remove freewheels, and/or easy to remove threaded sprockets from them using short chainwhips, you simply have not been pedalling hard enough. It doesn't matter what lubricant or anti-seize you use, if you pedal hard enough everything becomes incredibly difficult to remove.

I made some chain whips which were about 18" long, and they were not really long enough.

I note with interest that the threaded driver in a Rohloff hub uses a six-start thread; the idea is that the sprocket won't become unfeasibly tight. It doesn't always work; recently when removing a well-used sprocket from such a hub, I still needed to use the full length of a Park Tool chain whip, and when it finally released, I was pulling so hard I nearly fell over.

cheers

[Annoying Twit]

there are lots of tools that are good enough for cassette removal, but removing fixed gear sprockets and disassembling freewheels is a different matter entirely.

So don't buy a cheap chain whip and expect to remove fixed gear sprockets with it, and come to that, don't expect to have an easy time removing fully-tightened cassette lockrings, either. Plenty of folk claim to have no problem with the latter; well they can work loose in service anyway (moreso if they were never tight to start with) and very often they are not fully tightened to begin with.

cheers

Damn. I need to remove a fixed sprocket, and as of yet have no chain-whip at all.

Would it be possible to fix the sprocket in a vice and rotate the wheel around it? Without damaging the vice? I don't mind if I sacrifice the fixed cog as I never use it and will only replace for use in case of freewheel failure while away from home. (I have had a freewheel fail once.)

The only reason that I need to remove the sprocket is to rebuild the wheel with new spokes. It is a large flange (I believe) Joytech single speed flip flop hub, but I'm guessing that it will be impossible to rebuild the wheel without removing the freewheel plus fixed cog. Please correct me if I'm wrong.

The lockring came off slightly worryingly easily.

[Mick F]

Would it be possible to fix the sprocket in a vice and rotate the wheel around it?

That's what I'd do providing the sprocket tooth-count is even.

You don't want two teeth on one jaw of the vice and only one on the other.
Maybe if that's the case, you could use a couple of suitable bolts to fit either side of the single tooth to provide grip.

............ and use gloves. If you do manage to undo it, it could go with a bang.

[Annoying Twit]

Would it be possible to fix the sprocket in a vice and rotate the wheel around it?

That's what I'd do providing the sprocket tooth-count is even.

You don't want two teeth on one jaw of the vice and only one on the other.
Maybe if that's the case, you could use a couple of suitable bolts to fit either side of the single tooth to provide grip.

............ and use gloves. If you do manage to undo it, it could go with a bang.

It's a 14T, so even number of teeth. This is a good point, thanks. I'm now going to institute a policy of sticking to fixed sprockets with even numbers of teeth, even if I don't actually use them.

Thanks very much. I'll remember the bolt trick as well. I've left it with WD40 soaking in at the moment and I'll do that again a day before I give it a go.

[Gattonero]

...
Damn. I need to remove a fixed sprocket, and as of yet have no chain-whip at all.

Would it be possible to fix the sprocket in a vice and rotate the wheel around it? Without damaging the vice? I don't mind if I sacrifice the fixed cog as I never use it and will only replace for use in case of freewheel failure while away from home. (I have had a freewheel fail once.)

The only reason that I need to remove the sprocket is to rebuild the wheel with new spokes. It is a large flange (I believe) Joytech single speed flip flop hub, but I'm guessing that it will be impossible to rebuild the wheel without removing the freewheel plus fixed cog. Please correct me if I'm wrong.

The lockring came off slightly worryingly easily.

If the sprocket is going in the bin, you have a vice and an angle-grinder then cut two flats in the sprocket and clamp it this way in the vice.
Just make sure you stay away from the thread, so I'd advise to measure the OD where the sprocket threads into the hub, and mark two parallel lines with that distance increased by 5mm or somewhat more (just for peace of mind).
Mind you, it needs a strong vice.

[Annoying Twit]

If the sprocket is going in the bin, you have a vice and an angle-grinder then cut two flats in the sprocket and clamp it this way in the vice.
Just make sure you stay away from the thread, so I'd advise to measure the OD where the sprocket threads into the hub, and mark two parallel lines with that distance increased by 5mm or somewhat more (just for peace of mind).
Mind you, it needs a strong vice.

Thanks. I have access to a massive vice.

It wouldn't matter too much if I wrecked the threads as the wheel would then be freewheel only. I know how to remove a freewheel destructively if I need to (I hope not); nail punch to remove lock-ring, then put the body of the freewheel in the vice and turn wheel.

I plan for this wheel to become a spare wheel, which would mostly be used in case of unexpected punctures in the morning.

Returning to the topic of this thread, I will need a chain whip at some point. I'm concerned as to the quality of the chain whip I'll need. Are there any cheaper alternatives to the Park Tool which are still good quality but (noting Brucey's comment) are still good for fixed gear sprockets? I note the recommendations of the Tacx and the YC506. How do they work for single speeds?

And even then, there are multiple chain-whips from Park Tools. Confused? You will be.

EDIT: This person has some sort of quick-release cog that just comes off once the lock-ring is removed. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Cx0k_5Sco8

EDIT: Oh, a method of removing the cog without a chainwhip and without a vice: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5qIVEpyelP0 They leave the wheel on the bike, sort of bunch up the chain, and then use the entire bike as a chainwhip.

[Mick F]

EDIT: Oh, a method of removing the cog without a chainwhip and without a vice: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5qIVEpyelP0 They leave the wheel on the bike, sort of bunch up the chain, and then use the entire bike as a chainwhip.

That's clever.
I wonder if it could be simplified by not removing the chain from the chainwheel and instead positively stopping the cranks from turning. Spanner across the chainstays in front of the wheel?