Moulton TSR rear pivot

[rjb]

Tecalamit grease guns were made in Plymouth. You may be able to find a used one locally

Out of interest does the steel tube locate in the ears? If it does then it implies that when assembled you will always have some slack. You could reduce that by shortening the tube in a lathe but this risks pulling the ears closer which may distort them when you tighten the through bolt, or by adding a thin spacer. As the lateral loads are small I would have thought a penny washer drilled out to the diameter of the tube could be used. Just a thought, but as I have not seen it in the flesh this may not be practical.
Good luck.

[deliquium]

Mine's worn too

Only detectable after removing the rear wheel and square taper chainset, laying the frame down on the expose bottom bracket spindle and wiggling the back end whilst leaning on the BB. At least 3mm of movement at the rear drop outs. And yes the pivot bolt was checked beforehand and extremely tight.

Upon dismantling was surprised the left hand bush pulled out from the frame by hand The right hand bush needed a drift and several taps with a hammer.

The grease I applied at ~5000 miles was in evidence = lesson No.1 Do NOT wait until such mileage to carry out maintenance AND check for wear much much sooner and regularly

[Brucey]

3mm movement at the dropouts presumably corresponds with only about 0.1mm free play each side in a narrow bushing.

It may be necessary to bond a loose bushing into the housing with epoxy resin. Bushings may have 0.05mm clearance when new, depending on the tolerances of the parts. If so, I'd suggest that the best way of getting a play-free rear end may be to ream in situ and have a centre sleeve precision made to suit.

cheers

[Mick F]

Mine's worn too

Oh dear.
We're in the same boat.
Hopefully, my new bushes that should arrive tomorrow will be accurately made. Both of my originals were very tight. As you have a loose one, it must mean that the tolerances of the bushes and/or the housings are not good enough.

Given that our TSRs are similar ages and mileages - one wonders what the effective differences are?

You spin and MickF doesn't?

Under power up a hill, I don't honk, but "spin" I suppose, especially as the bottom gears are quite low.

I have noticed that going up hills, my cadence is higher than on the flat. I was watching my shadow in the morning sunshine up a hill the other day, and it surprised me how my cadence looked high-ish.

Brucey:
Comments noted regarding the grease gun situation.

I have a feeling the old grease gun I have has the seals in the nozzle rather tired. I "acquired" the gun, so I really don't know much about its usage and history. I'll dig it out shortly and have a look at it to see what make it is.
It was used by me for years greasing my Minis front and rear suspensions.

Out of interest does the steel tube locate in the ears?

No.
The steel tube is a nice fit between the ears of the rear triangle.

I found a long bolt and suitable washers earlier, and was able to re-fit the old bosses by compression. By starting the fit by hand to align them square on with the steel sleeve inside, I was able to screw them in with simplicity using two 14mm spanners. I then had to knock them out again of course.

[Mick F]

I'm going into Screwfix on my way to buy a new grease gun. Hopefully a brand new unit may have more umph as the one I have now must be 30+ years old.
https://www.screwfix.com/p/hilka-pro-cr ... /4744r#_=p

it will probably do the job at least once but it looks a bit cheap and cheerful to me. It may also be a complete PITA to use, because it appears not have the (very necessary IME) full complement of bleed screws.

I'd far sooner have a 30 year old Wanner than that, any day of the week....there is a reason why a used Wanner is still more expensive than a new grease gun from screwfix....

Just had a good look at mine and gave it a good clean too.

Any comments about it?
Can you buy new connectors? Not really sure if mine is worn or not. How can you tell?

It's a "Colley" and made in Japan.

[Brucey]

it also looks like it lacks bleed screws in the right places; I have added bleed screws to guns like that.

If you load and pump grease through the gun, and it comes out quietly, the same amount each stroke, without being full of bubbles, you can be reasonably sure that the grease gun is bled OK. However if the grease exits the gun with bubbles and/or a kind of 'wet fart' noise it is full of air and won't pump well under pressure; it doesn't have to be that bad before each stroke of the gun merely compresses the air bubbles in the grease within the delivery tube, without pumping any through a pressure restriction like a grease nipple.

cheers

[deliquium]

I wonder if these are the bushes?

Oil Filled Bronze Flanged Bush

Presumably the bush is going to be the wear item? Perhaps the stainless steel sleeve and bolt could be re-usable?

The Moulton kit* from Fudges is £48 + £7.99 postage or £42 inc postage from Cyclesense.

* 1 x sleeve + 1 x bolt + 2 x bushes + 2 x Nord-lock washers

[Mick F]

Those Simply Bearings bushes could well be the ones.
Well done for finding them!
The washers are neither here nor there, as any washer would do so long as the bolt was tight. Mine had two on the bolt head side, and goodness knows why.

I measured the steel sleeve as I said up thread. It's worn about half a thou-ish on the end portions compared to the centre portion. Brucey suggests that if the dropouts move 3mm, it means that the play in the bushes must be about 0.1mm ................... which is about half a thou.
Therefore, IMHO, the sleeve needs renewing too.
I didn't measure the error, but guessed at 3mm. Dunno if I was being optimistic or pessimistic.

Brucey:
Thanks again for the grease gun advice. I'll re-fill with new grease tomorrow and check it out. Maybe buy a new pot of grease as the one I have now is half empty ............ or is it half full?

[barrym]

Regarding grease guns, I bought a huge tractor scale one from my local agricultural supplies shop. It uses pre-filled cartridges which eliminates the problem with air in the filling process. It is limited to the choice of greases, but the one I chose seems ok. It's a bit unwieldy but certainly has plenty of umph with a 10" or so lever and a 40mm or so piston.

I only use it for my garden tractor where I squirt until I blow the seals! Reminds of an old joke..... another day maybe.

I'm a trendy consumer. Just look at my Swift 2 Plus using hovercraft full of eels.

[PDQ Mobile]

Mick, looking at your grease gun new ends are available, probsbly from a good motor factors or maybe Bearing Man.
It might however be possible to replace the entire tube with a new screw on flexible one, new nozzle included.
A very handy bit of kit for those hard to get at ones.

[barrym]

Something else just occurred. If memory serves, shouldn't plain bushes intended for grease have grooves? Which suggests a plain bush like this might be happier with oil. Years ago I had a lovely little brass oil pump that had a grease nipple end. I think originally part of a cycle toolkit from the '30s or thereabouts.

[Brucey]

Those Simply Bearings bushes could well be the ones.

they were the ones I was thinking of when I mentioned that they were likely to be a standard product. IIRC I posted a similar link on a Moulton website some time ago. Being sintered/porous they do not need grooves.

...I measured the steel sleeve as I said up thread. It's worn about half a thou-ish on the end portions compared to the centre portion. Brucey suggests that if the dropouts move 3mm, it means that the play in the bushes must be about 0.1mm ................... which is about half a thou.

0.1mm = ~0.004" i.e. four thou

BTW there is a knack to filling grease guns from tubs such that there is no air in the grease gun reservoir.

cheers

[PDQ Mobile]

they were the ones I was thinking of when I mentioned that they were likely to be a standard product. IIRC I posted a similar link on a Moulton website some time ago. Being sintered/porous they do not need grooves.

Given the rapid wear problems described on here perhaps they do?
Or are they just to soft?

[Brucey]

Given the rapid wear problems described on here perhaps they do?
Or are they just to soft?

wear is a very tricksy thing. Said bushes last for a very long time under light loads (without additional lubrication even) if they are simply kept clean, and have adequate wear performance under higher loads if

1) they are fitted properly (so there is the right clearance, and the load is spread over the bushing correctly)
2) they are lubricated properly (i.e copiously with a grease that contains the right kind of lubricants e.g. solid lubricants)
3) the bushing is kept free from contamination.

I suspect that cases of premature wear can be associated with a lack of one or more of the above.

BTW Delrin bushes are much 'softer' and yet manage to last pretty well in many applications that are not so different.

cheers

[PDQ Mobile]

It's not much mileage though?
What do you think about my needle roller idea?
Standard parts. Some sort of simple seal. Grease gets squeezed thru and carries dirt/ water with it?