Marin Nicasio RC - Could I replace flat bars with drops?

[John_S]

Hi All,

I'm not necessarily going to change my current bike for my riding, which is almost all commuting, but if I did the Marin Nicasio RC would be a bike that I would consider.

However I currently prefer riding a drop bar bike and this is a flat bar bike. Now my preconception is that flat bar bikes and drop bar bikes often have different geometry and simply changing from flat bars to drops or vice versa isn't necessarily going to work perfectly because your are going to change the contact points on the bike and change various things such as reach & stack. But unless I'm reading their website incorrectly Marin make a drop bar version of the bike, the Marin Nicasio, and then a flat bar version, the Nicasio RC, and the frame/geometry are the same apart from the flat bar bike having sliding rear dropouts to accommodate the internal gear hub.

https://www.marinbikes.com/gb/bikes/family/nicasio

Now you could say I should just buy the Nicasio drop bar bike but as a commuter I would prefer having an internal gear hub bike. Therefore if I wanted both a bike with an internal gear hub and drop bars given that the frame geometry of both bikes is the same could you change the Nicasio RC flat bar version of this bike to a drop bar bike without too many issues.

I guess that in addition to the handlebars you'd need to do things such as:-

* change the brakes because I'm assuming that the Shimano BR-M315 Hydraulic Disc brakes wouldn't work with a drop bar bike. So you'd need some new disc brakes and brake levers;
* get a bar end gear shifter.

Also when considering this bike I wasn't sure about all of the mounting points for extras such as mudguards. This bike comes with mudguards so there are obviously mounting points available but I wasn't sure about the positioning of these compared to other bikes with the type of Tange/Soma/IRD style sliding dropouts which I thought sometimes have mounting points on/off the dropouts.

Thanks for any thoughts on this because I think that a bike with an IGH makes a good commuter and so the Nicasio RC is appealing but I just prefer a drop bar bike at the moment for my commute.

John

[horizon]

Unless I've missed something both bikes have the same geometry. Thorn would say this is crazy as drops would require a shorter top tube/reach than the curved bars. But I'll let others comment on this.

[pwa]

Unless I've missed something both bikes have the same geometry. Thorn would say this is crazy as drops would require a shorter top tube/reach than the curved bars. But I'll let others comment on this.

That is the most fundamental problem. If the frame fits with the relatively short reach of flat bars it isn't going to fit with the longer reach of drop bars. The latter make you reach further.

[John_S]

Hi Horizon & PWA,

Thanks for your messages.

If Marin are selling the same bike with same geometry but one having drops and the other flat bars are they doing their customers a bit of a disservice or is it not a problem as long as you make sure before you buy that the respective model fits?

Or in the scenario that I've described you'd make sure that the you did your sizing according to the drop bar bike even though I'd buy the flat bar one with a view to converting to drops.

However an issue that I foresee with this is that without being able to try the bike in a LBS if you use the Marin website to gauge the reach & stack that works for you the Marin geometry chart states that the Nicasio drop bar version and also the Nicasio RC flat bar version have exactly the same reach & stack as each other. However with the different bars surely this can't be the case or am I wrong?

Thanks,

John

[mercalia]

. . . . maybe they include surgery in the price

[amediasatex]

the Marin geometry chart states that the Nicasio drop bar version and also the Nicasio RC flat bar version have exactly the same reach & stack as each other. However with the different bars surely this can't be the case or am I wrong?

It can be the case as reach and stack are frame measurements, and do not include bar position, int he same way they don't include saddle position. The fact that they are the same is good news for your plans...

That is the most fundamental problem. If the frame fits with the relatively short reach of flat bars it isn't going to fit with the longer reach of drop bars. The latter make you reach further.

I think what they have done is use this effect intentionally...

The Nicasio drop bar model is setup and intended as a drop bar road/commuter style bike and configured for a racier position.

The RC model using flat/swept bars will obviously (for the same frame size) result in a shorter reach, but that's exactly what they're aiming for on that bike as it is positioned as more upright, bigger tire hybrid/commuter with a less racy position.

This kind of thing is not uncommon and can work well, I've reconfigured drop bar bikes to swept and flat bar use before when I want to re-purpose them into a more upright setup. It's important to consider the shortening effect but with the caveat of 'all else being equal' ie: if you want the same kind of position and ride, and have the same intended use in mind then swapping bars would require a longer or shorter frame accordingly. But if you want to fundamentally change the fit and intended use of the bike then you can exploit that very difference to your advantage, I think that's what Marin are up to here.

The other angle is that when recommending a size they might suggest the size up for the flat bar bike for the same person for example, at height X then you 'fit' the 50cm Drop bar bike, or the 52cm flat bar bike.

Anyway, back to OP, the geometry charts appear identical so I'd say it's a go-er, size yourself based on fitting the drop bar configuration, then buy the IGH flat bar version and get fettling, should be a nice project with a good outcome.

[horizon]

AFAICS the top tube lengths are geared primarily to the drop barred bikes. Generally AFAIK straight bars would attract longer top tubes but Marin seem to have gone the other way and offered a very upright ride for anyone who wants it. It's an interesting take on it.

BTW I haven't trawled through lots of comparison figures but this was my impression.

[djnotts]

the Marin geometry chart states that the Nicasio drop bar version and also the Nicasio RC flat bar version have exactly the same reach & stack as each other. However with the different bars surely this can't be the case or am I wrong?

It can be the case as reach and stack are frame measurements, and do not include bar position, int he same way they don't include saddle position. The fact that they are the same is good news for your plans...

That is the most fundamental problem. If the frame fits with the relatively short reach of flat bars it isn't going to fit with the longer reach of drop bars. The latter make you reach further.

I think what they have done is use this effect intentionally...

....

Could not be put better. I've swopped lots flats to drops and vice versa. Maybe a stem/bar tuning - length, riser flats, whatever. How much does length actually change when builders DO alter according to 'bars? An inch maybe? Neiother here nor there. And as for Thorn's ( "any number of spacers rather thabn use a long(er) head tube") design "philosophy" ....no comment is safest.

[horizon]

Could not be put better. I've swopped lots flats to drops and vice versa. Maybe a stem/bar tuning - length, riser flats, whatever. How much does length actually change when builders DO alter according to 'bars? An inch maybe? Neiother here nor there. And as for Thorn's ( "any number of spacers rather than use a long(er) head tube") design "philosophy" ....no comment is safest.

You may well be right (and I for one would be very happy with a shorter top tube design). However, the general consensus out there AFAIK is to use longer top tubes for straight bars so if Marin are doing something different then that is interesting.

To be fair to Thorn, they do a very long (18 cm) head tube on their mid-size tourer.

[Brucey]

it sounds like your plan might be OK provided the reach is going to fit you.

On the subject of shifters, you may be able to save a few quid by re-using the flat bar shifter, by mounting it on a special bracket eg under the stem. I did this



https://forum.cyclinguk.org/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=115182

cheers