Hi All,
Please accept my apologies if this post ends up duplicating other posts! Before posting this I did search and I found plenty of posts about Alfine hubs but I couldn't easily find one with advice for a novice about doing your own maintenance on the hub.
I have a 2014 Genesis Day One with the Shimano Alfine 8 Internal Gear Hub. I must admit that I'm not very technically minded or proficient and I'm a complete novice when it comes to trying to undertake maintenance on an IGH.
In the past I've just taken this bike to a few different LBS for service & maintenance when it needs it. Whilst I regularly clean the bike and I've done things in the past such as changing brakes blocks and other similar basic tasks for anything more I've always used a bike shop.
However after repeating problems with my Alfine 8 including slipping gears and currently as a result of this issue I only use one gear.
https://forum.cyclinguk.org/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=117828&hilit=alfine+cassette+joint
https://forum.cyclinguk.org/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=121731&p=1230418&hilit=shimano+alfine+8#p1230418
Anyway because of my issues continuing I'm going to have a go at some maintenance myself. Therefore I've now just started taking the bike apart and I'm going to take this opportunity to try (with the element on being try) to do some maintenance on the hub at the same time as some other jobs. The other jobs include replacing worn bar tape and tyres. I'm also going to check the brakes and see if anything such as the pads need replacing.
Back to the Alfine hub and I have a new Jagwire gear cable that I'll be using when I get to the point of rebuilding. However at the moment I'm wondering just where to start with undertaking a service of the hub? Firstly can I actually do a service without removing the hub from the wheel? If it's at all possible I'd rather not have to remove the hub from the wheel because I've never built a wheel before (a skill I'd like to learn one day but one thing at a time) and so I'd have to take it to a LBS to remove the hub and get the wheel rebuilt.
Now I've seen that there are IGH oil kits and do I need to get one of these?
At the moment I'm just wondering where to start and if I can undertake a service without having to remove the hub from the wheel?
If anyone has any pointers/tips/ideas or can point me in the direction of any videos that will be great.
Thanks for any help which will be much appreciated!
John
Shimano Alfine 8 home maintenance - where to start?
Shimano Alfine 8 home maintenance - where to start?
Last edited by John_S on 28 Oct 2018, 5:38pm, edited 1 time in total.
Re: Shimano Alfine 8 home maitenence - where to start?
Caveat: I've not got an Alfine 8 Internal Gear Hub. I've an AW, an SRF3 and a Nexus 3 and I never did the official service method on the Nexus.
You can't do a service without removing the hub inner from the wheel, but you don't need to rebuild the wheel because the hub shell will remain in place.
There are IGH oil kits for Shimano hubs and you need to get one of those if you are following Shimano's advice rather than Brucey's semi-fluid grease (SFG) plan. I follow Brucey and it seems to work for me in this country so far (maybe 2 or 3 years so far).
Start by reading http://www.sheldonbrown.com/nexus8.shtml and as many of the links as you can tolerate, then search youtube for shimano nexus 8 rebuild or servicing videos. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8x8PrqTeBCY is one. There are videos on there criticising the oil dunk approach, but as I understand it, the basic idea of the official Shimano service method is to take the innards out, clean out the old lubricant, dry it, then dunk it in the expensive oil bath, grease the bearings and refit the innards.
You can't do a service without removing the hub inner from the wheel, but you don't need to rebuild the wheel because the hub shell will remain in place.
There are IGH oil kits for Shimano hubs and you need to get one of those if you are following Shimano's advice rather than Brucey's semi-fluid grease (SFG) plan. I follow Brucey and it seems to work for me in this country so far (maybe 2 or 3 years so far).
Start by reading http://www.sheldonbrown.com/nexus8.shtml and as many of the links as you can tolerate, then search youtube for shimano nexus 8 rebuild or servicing videos. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8x8PrqTeBCY is one. There are videos on there criticising the oil dunk approach, but as I understand it, the basic idea of the official Shimano service method is to take the innards out, clean out the old lubricant, dry it, then dunk it in the expensive oil bath, grease the bearings and refit the innards.
MJR, mostly pedalling 3-speed roadsters. KL+West Norfolk BUG incl social easy rides http://www.klwnbug.co.uk
All the above is CC-By-SA and no other implied copyright license to Cycle magazine.
All the above is CC-By-SA and no other implied copyright license to Cycle magazine.
-
alexnharvey
- Posts: 1924
- Joined: 10 Jan 2014, 8:39am
Re: Shimano Alfine 8 home maitenence - where to start?
Can you service a regular hub?
You definitely don't need to remove the hub from the wheel. As mjr says, you remove the innards from the hub after taking off the sprocket, gear shift device (Cassette joint) and outer black cover.
I found the servicing to be not that difficult following the advice given here and various online pictorial guides and videos, but my experience is many years of bike DIY and a little volunteering in a community bike workshop. Apart from cone spanners I don't think you don't need any specialist tools.
I currently use a mix of gear oil and grease to lubricate my nexus 8 hub. I'll either switch to semi-fluid grease at the next change, or I might use up the remaining gear oil-grease mix. My hub was free and had seen water damage before I got it. You might have a different view on lubrication if you paid for it.
You definitely don't need to remove the hub from the wheel. As mjr says, you remove the innards from the hub after taking off the sprocket, gear shift device (Cassette joint) and outer black cover.
I found the servicing to be not that difficult following the advice given here and various online pictorial guides and videos, but my experience is many years of bike DIY and a little volunteering in a community bike workshop. Apart from cone spanners I don't think you don't need any specialist tools.
I currently use a mix of gear oil and grease to lubricate my nexus 8 hub. I'll either switch to semi-fluid grease at the next change, or I might use up the remaining gear oil-grease mix. My hub was free and had seen water damage before I got it. You might have a different view on lubrication if you paid for it.
Re: Shimano Alfine 8 home maitenence - where to start?
John_S I believe from a p]revious conversations you are in Suffolk.
http://www.bicycledoctor.gbr.fm/ is mr IG hubs he is in Ipswich. That unless you really do want to do it yourself. However if you do want to do it yourself use the service manual from http://www.shimano.com.
Tips
take pictures at each stage and lay things out[list=][/list] in the order you take them off .You should be alright.
IS the 8 an oil bath or do you need grease. I would imagine Brucey will be along to give the tech details.
http://www.bicycledoctor.gbr.fm/ is mr IG hubs he is in Ipswich. That unless you really do want to do it yourself. However if you do want to do it yourself use the service manual from http://www.shimano.com.
Tips
take pictures at each stage and lay things out[list=][/list] in the order you take them off .You should be alright.
IS the 8 an oil bath or do you need grease. I would imagine Brucey will be along to give the tech details.
Last edited by NUKe on 7 Jun 2018, 8:19pm, edited 2 times in total.
NUKe
_____________________________________
_____________________________________
Re: Shimano Alfine 8 home maitenence - where to start?
the A8 hub comes with grease in and shimano's (rubbish) maintenance scheme is to 'refresh' the grease with oil from time to time. The problem is that the grease gets displaced from where it is needed and it isn't at all mobile within the hub. This means that local conditions can vary wildly within the hub.
IME if winter weather gets into the hub, some parts can be completely banjaxed and nearby parts can still be coated in Mr Shimano's pretty white grease. In other cases the white grease turns to something that is more like the consistency of cheese (mature cheddar) and needless to say this is not a very good lubricant.
If you want to do one simple thing then
a) clamp the RHS axle in a bench vice
b) remove the disc if disc brakes are fitted
c) remove the LHS cone
d) add about 25-40cc of gear oil
e) reassemble
This ought to keep the innards sweet if you do it once a year or so. If the seals are knackered, the hub will leak a little oil afterwards, and you really need to use SFG. If you add ~50cc SFG to a hub that has already been oiled, the hub ought to last a very long time before further attention is required. Don't add SFG to a hub that only contains dried shimano grease; the resultant mixture won't necessarily be mobile inside the hub.
However if your hub is only working reliably in one gear then you have
1) a cable fault or
2) a mistimed cassette joint or
3) an internal fault of some kind.
Really you should aim to address these possibilities one at a time, else you might fix it and not know what you did that was important.
cheers
IME if winter weather gets into the hub, some parts can be completely banjaxed and nearby parts can still be coated in Mr Shimano's pretty white grease. In other cases the white grease turns to something that is more like the consistency of cheese (mature cheddar) and needless to say this is not a very good lubricant.
If you want to do one simple thing then
a) clamp the RHS axle in a bench vice
b) remove the disc if disc brakes are fitted
c) remove the LHS cone
d) add about 25-40cc of gear oil
e) reassemble
This ought to keep the innards sweet if you do it once a year or so. If the seals are knackered, the hub will leak a little oil afterwards, and you really need to use SFG. If you add ~50cc SFG to a hub that has already been oiled, the hub ought to last a very long time before further attention is required. Don't add SFG to a hub that only contains dried shimano grease; the resultant mixture won't necessarily be mobile inside the hub.
However if your hub is only working reliably in one gear then you have
1) a cable fault or
2) a mistimed cassette joint or
3) an internal fault of some kind.
Really you should aim to address these possibilities one at a time, else you might fix it and not know what you did that was important.
cheers
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~Brucey~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~Brucey~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Re: Shimano Alfine 8 home maitenence - where to start?
Hi All,
Many thanks for all of the tips and advice which is much appreciated and I'll make a start on reading & viewing before diving straight in to work on it. Also maybe I should have said but my hub is the Shimano Alfine 8 SG-S501.
Hi mjr,
Thanks for your message and I'm pleased to hear that I don't have to rebuild the wheel which is a big relief! I'll read through the Sheldon Brown pages and take a look at the video.
Hi alexnharvey,
I've never really tackled anything other replacing certain basic parts when they wear out & need it such as brake pads and cables. I once had an axle snap on a bike with a screw on freewheel and when replacing the axle I did clean out and regrease that hub but I've only done it the once. Normally for most things I take it to a LBS but I thought that this time I'd try and learn a new skill and tackle a job myself. I'm glad to hear that you found the job not too difficult and the easier the better as far as I'm hoping for.
Hi NUKe,
I'm not far away but over the border in Norfolk. Thanks for the tip and for pointing me in the direction of someone who is an expert in IGHs and if I get really stuck that link may come in handy! That's a good tip about taking photos all the way so that I can see what I've done and hopefully how to put it back together at the end.
Hi Brucey,
Many thanks for the step by step plan to follow and I'll work through that. I don't have a bench vice but my father in law does so I might pop over there.
Regarding my current hub fault my plan is to replace the gear cable but to be honest after use all through autumn, winter and spring the bike could do with a bit of all round TLC. Therefore I thought rather than just replace the gear cable and carry on I'd try and service the bike at the same time. At the moment I've taken off the mudguards, dynamo lights, pannier rack, wheels, pedals and bar tape. My plan is to give the frame a good clean, touch up any chips, turn the frame upside down to let any moisture drain out after which I'll spray some frame treatment inside and I also need to treat a bit of rust at the top of the forks where the mudguard was secured.
At the same time I thought that I should also service the hub but I didn't have a clue where to start and so the advice above is much appreciated and very helpful.
Thanks everyone!
John
Many thanks for all of the tips and advice which is much appreciated and I'll make a start on reading & viewing before diving straight in to work on it. Also maybe I should have said but my hub is the Shimano Alfine 8 SG-S501.
Hi mjr,
Thanks for your message and I'm pleased to hear that I don't have to rebuild the wheel which is a big relief! I'll read through the Sheldon Brown pages and take a look at the video.
Hi alexnharvey,
I've never really tackled anything other replacing certain basic parts when they wear out & need it such as brake pads and cables. I once had an axle snap on a bike with a screw on freewheel and when replacing the axle I did clean out and regrease that hub but I've only done it the once. Normally for most things I take it to a LBS but I thought that this time I'd try and learn a new skill and tackle a job myself. I'm glad to hear that you found the job not too difficult and the easier the better as far as I'm hoping for.
Hi NUKe,
I'm not far away but over the border in Norfolk. Thanks for the tip and for pointing me in the direction of someone who is an expert in IGHs and if I get really stuck that link may come in handy! That's a good tip about taking photos all the way so that I can see what I've done and hopefully how to put it back together at the end.
Hi Brucey,
Many thanks for the step by step plan to follow and I'll work through that. I don't have a bench vice but my father in law does so I might pop over there.
Regarding my current hub fault my plan is to replace the gear cable but to be honest after use all through autumn, winter and spring the bike could do with a bit of all round TLC. Therefore I thought rather than just replace the gear cable and carry on I'd try and service the bike at the same time. At the moment I've taken off the mudguards, dynamo lights, pannier rack, wheels, pedals and bar tape. My plan is to give the frame a good clean, touch up any chips, turn the frame upside down to let any moisture drain out after which I'll spray some frame treatment inside and I also need to treat a bit of rust at the top of the forks where the mudguard was secured.
At the same time I thought that I should also service the hub but I didn't have a clue where to start and so the advice above is much appreciated and very helpful.
Thanks everyone!
John
-
alexnharvey
- Posts: 1924
- Joined: 10 Jan 2014, 8:39am
Re: Shimano Alfine 8 home maitenence - where to start?
John, are you familiar with adjusting the gear indexing by lining up the yellow marks on the cassette joint when in gear 4? Here's a pictorial guide https://aseasyasridingabike.wordpress.c ... -hub-gear/ (same system on nexus and alfine).
I wonder if adjusting this setting will allow you to use the full range of gears. The hubs are very sensitive to any gear cable problems. I would plan to replace the full inner and outer cable and add gear oil to the hub following Brucey's advice. When you are adjusting the yellow marks you should check that they return exactly to the same position when switching to 4 from both the gears above and from below. If the cable is dragging you may even be able to observe the problem by watching how the yellow mark moves, in addition to any tactile or audible feedback from the shifter and hub
I wonder if adjusting this setting will allow you to use the full range of gears. The hubs are very sensitive to any gear cable problems. I would plan to replace the full inner and outer cable and add gear oil to the hub following Brucey's advice. When you are adjusting the yellow marks you should check that they return exactly to the same position when switching to 4 from both the gears above and from below. If the cable is dragging you may even be able to observe the problem by watching how the yellow mark moves, in addition to any tactile or audible feedback from the shifter and hub
Re: Shimano Alfine 8 home maitenence - where to start?
Hi All,
Further to the kind advice sent by everyone above about carrying out maintenance on my Alfine IGH hub can I just ask one question.
Also sorry if it doesn't make much sense with the big gap between the previous post and now but unfortunately I recently had an accident coming off my bike on loose gravel which resulted in a very sore hip and a fractured bone in my pelvis. Therefore any form of cycling or bike maintenance has been out of the question for a while and it's only in the last week or so that I can think about getting back to some jobs. I dipped my toe in the water last weekend doing some maintenance on my daughters bike and now I'm ready to start getting back to mine.
Anyway back to the point of my post and in the message from Brucey recommending that I try refreshing the grease with oil. In the message he says:-
"d) add about 25-40cc of gear oil"
With respect to the type of oil that I should use is this referring to car gearbox oil as opposed to any bicycle specific oil/grease etc.?
For example something such as this:-
https://www.halfords.com/motoring/engine-oils-fluids/gearbox-oil/halfords-gear-oil-ep-80w-90-gl-4-1l
Thanks again for the continued help!
John
Further to the kind advice sent by everyone above about carrying out maintenance on my Alfine IGH hub can I just ask one question.
Also sorry if it doesn't make much sense with the big gap between the previous post and now but unfortunately I recently had an accident coming off my bike on loose gravel which resulted in a very sore hip and a fractured bone in my pelvis. Therefore any form of cycling or bike maintenance has been out of the question for a while and it's only in the last week or so that I can think about getting back to some jobs. I dipped my toe in the water last weekend doing some maintenance on my daughters bike and now I'm ready to start getting back to mine.
Anyway back to the point of my post and in the message from Brucey recommending that I try refreshing the grease with oil. In the message he says:-
"d) add about 25-40cc of gear oil"
With respect to the type of oil that I should use is this referring to car gearbox oil as opposed to any bicycle specific oil/grease etc.?
For example something such as this:-
https://www.halfords.com/motoring/engine-oils-fluids/gearbox-oil/halfords-gear-oil-ep-80w-90-gl-4-1l
Thanks again for the continued help!
John
Re: Shimano Alfine 8 home maitenence - where to start?
yup, that'll do.
Get well soon!
cheers
Get well soon!
cheers
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~Brucey~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~Brucey~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Re: Shimano Alfine 8 home maitenence - where to start?
Many thanks Brucey.
Your help is much appreciated!
John
Your help is much appreciated!
John
-
alexnharvey
- Posts: 1924
- Joined: 10 Jan 2014, 8:39am
Re: Shimano Alfine 8 home maitenence - where to start?
Am I right in thinking that there's also nothing in particular to recommend it over other 80 or 90w gear oils? I think I paid a bit less for mine from Wilkinson's, depends where is handy for you to get to.
Re: Shimano Alfine 8 home maitenence - where to start?
alexnharvey wrote:Am I right in thinking that there's also nothing in particular to recommend it over other 80 or 90w gear oils? I think I paid a bit less for mine from Wilkinson's, depends where is handy for you to get to.
yeah, probably. If you want branded oil of known provenance then Comma is a good one to go for; no price premium for the brand, but a top quality oil from a known maker that meets or exceeds the relevant specs. I think it is Comma that is sold in wilkinsons in fact (and it may be comma who make halfords branded oils). It is not bad chain lube too.
If you are feeling spendy, a fully synthetic gear oil is likely to be better lubricant, but it isn't strictly necessary in most cases.
If you want extra protecton in a hub gear, then a thicker oil is a simple solution. Unfortunately getting thicker gear oils in small packages is not thet easy but a 140W gear oil is available on ebay in 1l packs.
cheers
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~Brucey~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~Brucey~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Re: Shimano Alfine 8 home maitenence - where to start?
Hi All,
Further to the above unfortunately getting this bike back on the road has been slow going because further to the above it took me a while to get to servicing the hub.
The reason being is that I don't have a bench vice at home and so I had to wait for the chance to go to my brother-in-laws house to use one.
Anyway I worked on the hub last weekend and in curiosity I actually ended up removing the hub from the hub shell just to check its condition. I just wanted to make sure that it didn't appear as if there had been a lot of moisture ingress or any corrosion. Fortunately it didn't look too bad inside and the hub is now back in the hub shell in the wheel and hopefully ready to go for winter.
Therefore I now have to work on completing the other tasks to rebuild the bike and one of these jobs is replacing the previous gear shift cable.
I worked on this yesterday and the cable that I removed did have some corrosion that you could see on the inner wire at the top of a section where it met a barrel adjuster at the front of the bike.
I've replaced the inner and outer cable with a new Jagwire gear shift cable. This was a bit tricky (for me anyway) because this was the first time I've replaced a gear cable and so there's every chance that I was using the wrong technique and approaching this in the wrong way. However I found that threading the cable through the bar end shifter pretty tough and when it went through it had frayed the end of the cable. I then had to cut off the frayed end to get it into the outer but I again had problems getting the cable through the last end cap (close to the sprocket / gear selector) end when it had got frayed again as I tried to get it through the end cap. Anyway finally I got it through and fingers crossed I have enough undamaged/un-frayed cable left at the end because the cable was pretty long.
Anyway this brings me to a question as follows.
The point I got to yesterday, before having to stop for a family members birthday celebrations, was putting the nut/bolt onto the cable which is the nut which slots into the gear selector part of the Alfine hub.
Now I already have some advice above, including for example the link in the post from Alexnharvey, which gives me details on how to fine tune the gear shift. However at this stage I'm wondering how to figure out my basic starting point of where on the gear shift cable I should try to secure the nut so that it's in the right place to then be slotted on the gear selector bit of the hub?
Thanks again for all of your help & advice which is much appreciated!
John
Further to the above unfortunately getting this bike back on the road has been slow going because further to the above it took me a while to get to servicing the hub.
The reason being is that I don't have a bench vice at home and so I had to wait for the chance to go to my brother-in-laws house to use one.
Anyway I worked on the hub last weekend and in curiosity I actually ended up removing the hub from the hub shell just to check its condition. I just wanted to make sure that it didn't appear as if there had been a lot of moisture ingress or any corrosion. Fortunately it didn't look too bad inside and the hub is now back in the hub shell in the wheel and hopefully ready to go for winter.
Therefore I now have to work on completing the other tasks to rebuild the bike and one of these jobs is replacing the previous gear shift cable.
I worked on this yesterday and the cable that I removed did have some corrosion that you could see on the inner wire at the top of a section where it met a barrel adjuster at the front of the bike.
I've replaced the inner and outer cable with a new Jagwire gear shift cable. This was a bit tricky (for me anyway) because this was the first time I've replaced a gear cable and so there's every chance that I was using the wrong technique and approaching this in the wrong way. However I found that threading the cable through the bar end shifter pretty tough and when it went through it had frayed the end of the cable. I then had to cut off the frayed end to get it into the outer but I again had problems getting the cable through the last end cap (close to the sprocket / gear selector) end when it had got frayed again as I tried to get it through the end cap. Anyway finally I got it through and fingers crossed I have enough undamaged/un-frayed cable left at the end because the cable was pretty long.
Anyway this brings me to a question as follows.
The point I got to yesterday, before having to stop for a family members birthday celebrations, was putting the nut/bolt onto the cable which is the nut which slots into the gear selector part of the Alfine hub.
Now I already have some advice above, including for example the link in the post from Alexnharvey, which gives me details on how to fine tune the gear shift. However at this stage I'm wondering how to figure out my basic starting point of where on the gear shift cable I should try to secure the nut so that it's in the right place to then be slotted on the gear selector bit of the hub?
Thanks again for all of your help & advice which is much appreciated!
John
Re: Shimano Alfine 8 home maitenence - where to start?
Start with any barrel adjuster set about one full turn out (from fully wound in) and set the cable length to the pinch bolt to 101mm if you have cassette joint CJ-8s20
and set it to 127mm if you have cassette joint CJ-8S40 (sealed) version. This should bring the adjustment within the range of the barrel adjuster, so no repeated adjustments of the pinch bolt are required. Shimano sell a tool (TL-CJ40) which gives both these settings. When using the tool a third hand can be used to take slack out of the cable, so you know that the setting is correct.
Threading cables is made somewhat easier if you buy cables with a welded end to them; this feeds without coming apart. All cable length trimming should be done after the cable is fed through all the housings and pinch bolts etc. If you need to feed a cut cable that wants to fray, it is often possible to use a drop of superglue on the (clean) cut end.
NB It is vitally important that you use the correct ferrule at the cassette joint end of the cable. With CJ-8S20 it needs to be metal, thick walled, and a snug fit in the cassette joint. This basically means it needs to be the correct ferrule as supplied with a shimano nexus cable, not some random piece of rubbish that will come with a generic cable kit. A plastic ferrule will definitely not do (examine how the ferrule is supported and you will see why). Note also that the correct ferrule is crimped onto the cable housing so that the cable housing cannot easily jump out of the ferrule, as well as the ferrule being a snug fit in the CJ. This is important because occasionally the shift wheel is baulked and the cable can be slack at the CJ; unsecured cable housings/ferrules can pop out of their seatings, and the gear adjustment will be thrown out completely.
In CJ 8S40 it is still preferable to use a (strong) metal ferrule inside but this CJ is more tolerant of the exact ferrule type than CJ-8S20.
hth
cheers
and set it to 127mm if you have cassette joint CJ-8S40 (sealed) version. This should bring the adjustment within the range of the barrel adjuster, so no repeated adjustments of the pinch bolt are required. Shimano sell a tool (TL-CJ40) which gives both these settings. When using the tool a third hand can be used to take slack out of the cable, so you know that the setting is correct.
Threading cables is made somewhat easier if you buy cables with a welded end to them; this feeds without coming apart. All cable length trimming should be done after the cable is fed through all the housings and pinch bolts etc. If you need to feed a cut cable that wants to fray, it is often possible to use a drop of superglue on the (clean) cut end.
NB It is vitally important that you use the correct ferrule at the cassette joint end of the cable. With CJ-8S20 it needs to be metal, thick walled, and a snug fit in the cassette joint. This basically means it needs to be the correct ferrule as supplied with a shimano nexus cable, not some random piece of rubbish that will come with a generic cable kit. A plastic ferrule will definitely not do (examine how the ferrule is supported and you will see why). Note also that the correct ferrule is crimped onto the cable housing so that the cable housing cannot easily jump out of the ferrule, as well as the ferrule being a snug fit in the CJ. This is important because occasionally the shift wheel is baulked and the cable can be slack at the CJ; unsecured cable housings/ferrules can pop out of their seatings, and the gear adjustment will be thrown out completely.
In CJ 8S40 it is still preferable to use a (strong) metal ferrule inside but this CJ is more tolerant of the exact ferrule type than CJ-8S20.
hth
cheers
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~Brucey~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~Brucey~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Re: Shimano Alfine 8 home maitenence - where to start?
Hi Brucey,
Many thanks for your message which is really helpful and much appreciated!
I've got the CJ-8S20 cassette joint and I'll get to work as soon as I can.
I don't have the Shimano Tool to check the length of the cable and to be able to set distance between the end cap and the bolt at 101mm and so for now I'll have to see how I get on using either a tape measure or a ruler but if it proves too difficult to get it right maybe I'll have to buy the Shimano Tool TL-CJ40 to help me. I did search to try and find it for sale in the UK and thought that maybe somewhere like SJS would sell it but so far I've drawn a blank but you can buy to from German sites such as this one:-
https://www.bike-discount.de/en/buy/shimano-tl-cj40-inner-cable-fixing-bolt-setting-tool-for-gear-hub-581129
Also I don't own a third hand tool and so I'm wondering if I'm going to find this a tricky job to do and maybe I need to invest in a third hand tool.
Regarding the cable I like the idea of getting one with a welded end because I'm sure that would have made the job of threading it through easier and hopefully would have stopped the cable fraying as I tried to thread and push it through. I did think that all the cable trimming should be done after the cable is threaded through all of the housings and bolts etc but a strand had unwound itself so much it was impossible to get the cable to go through any of the outer cable or end caps without cutting it. I was a bit frustrated at the time because I was aware that I shouldn't be putting it but at the time I couldn't quickly think of another way to get the cable threaded through the housing but I'll keep the superglue trick in mind for next time and so thanks for the tip.
Just out of interest the cable that I bought had end bits at both ends of the cable and one was marked "JC" and the other just "C". I wasn't sure which one to cut of and which one to leave and so I looked the the end bit that came out of the bar end shifter on the old cable being replaced and the seemed closer in space to the end marked "JC" and so I kept that end on and cut the other end of but I've no idea whether I made the right choice or not.
Ferrule / End caps-
Following your message that it's vitally important that I use the correct ferrule at the cassette joint end this bit has me a bit worried. Before reading your message I'd used one of the end caps that came with the Jagwire Universal Sport Shift Kit. Basically the kit came with several of what they've listed as "Sealed End Caps" and then just one "Hooded End Cap". I decided to use the "Hooded End Cap" because the instructions that came with the kit say that the hooded end cap offers the best protection against the elements & corrosion and so I thought that sounded like a good idea for the cable end cap next to the drivetrain and cassette joint where it's going to get exposed to the elements.
However reading your message I'm now wondering if I should take this Jagwire hooded end cap off the cable and instead use the original end cap that came with my bike. But I've looked at the end cap that is currently on my bike (a 2014 Genesis Day One) and the old end cap that I've just removed is plastic. Now I've absolutely no idea if this is the original end cap or not because the bike has at various times been to about three different LBS when I've had shifting problems and so now I have absolutely no idea whether this was the original end cap that fitted into the end of the cassette joint or a replacement fitted by a LBS.
It has me thinking though that given the choice of the two end caps that I have with one being a plastic one that I've just taken off the bike and the other being the new hooded end cap which is metal & came with the cable kit which one should I use. Feeling the two in comparison to one another to me the new Jagwire metal end cap feels sturdier and seems to be a reasonable fit in the cassette joint and so maybe I should go for that.
I've attached a photo below which shows the old plastic end cap next to a new Jagwire one but I took a photo of the Jagwire standard end cap instead of the hooded version because I couldn't get a good photo of the hooded version whist it's currently on the cable on the bike. However I've also included a photo of the Jagwire box which also show the hooded version of the end cap if the photo comes out large enough.
Also my apologies if this is a very basic/stupid question but when you say having the barrel adjuster fully wound in do you mean so that it is at it's shortest? I just wound it up and down and unless I've just forgotten which way I was winding it (but it is late after a day at work) when I was winding it anti-clockwise it was being would in and the barrel was getting shorter and if I wound it clockwise the barrel would get longer and it was being wound out?
Thanks again for all of the help & advice which is greatly appreciated!
John
Many thanks for your message which is really helpful and much appreciated!
I've got the CJ-8S20 cassette joint and I'll get to work as soon as I can.
I don't have the Shimano Tool to check the length of the cable and to be able to set distance between the end cap and the bolt at 101mm and so for now I'll have to see how I get on using either a tape measure or a ruler but if it proves too difficult to get it right maybe I'll have to buy the Shimano Tool TL-CJ40 to help me. I did search to try and find it for sale in the UK and thought that maybe somewhere like SJS would sell it but so far I've drawn a blank but you can buy to from German sites such as this one:-
https://www.bike-discount.de/en/buy/shimano-tl-cj40-inner-cable-fixing-bolt-setting-tool-for-gear-hub-581129
Also I don't own a third hand tool and so I'm wondering if I'm going to find this a tricky job to do and maybe I need to invest in a third hand tool.
Regarding the cable I like the idea of getting one with a welded end because I'm sure that would have made the job of threading it through easier and hopefully would have stopped the cable fraying as I tried to thread and push it through. I did think that all the cable trimming should be done after the cable is threaded through all of the housings and bolts etc but a strand had unwound itself so much it was impossible to get the cable to go through any of the outer cable or end caps without cutting it. I was a bit frustrated at the time because I was aware that I shouldn't be putting it but at the time I couldn't quickly think of another way to get the cable threaded through the housing but I'll keep the superglue trick in mind for next time and so thanks for the tip.
Just out of interest the cable that I bought had end bits at both ends of the cable and one was marked "JC" and the other just "C". I wasn't sure which one to cut of and which one to leave and so I looked the the end bit that came out of the bar end shifter on the old cable being replaced and the seemed closer in space to the end marked "JC" and so I kept that end on and cut the other end of but I've no idea whether I made the right choice or not.
Ferrule / End caps-
Following your message that it's vitally important that I use the correct ferrule at the cassette joint end this bit has me a bit worried. Before reading your message I'd used one of the end caps that came with the Jagwire Universal Sport Shift Kit. Basically the kit came with several of what they've listed as "Sealed End Caps" and then just one "Hooded End Cap". I decided to use the "Hooded End Cap" because the instructions that came with the kit say that the hooded end cap offers the best protection against the elements & corrosion and so I thought that sounded like a good idea for the cable end cap next to the drivetrain and cassette joint where it's going to get exposed to the elements.
However reading your message I'm now wondering if I should take this Jagwire hooded end cap off the cable and instead use the original end cap that came with my bike. But I've looked at the end cap that is currently on my bike (a 2014 Genesis Day One) and the old end cap that I've just removed is plastic. Now I've absolutely no idea if this is the original end cap or not because the bike has at various times been to about three different LBS when I've had shifting problems and so now I have absolutely no idea whether this was the original end cap that fitted into the end of the cassette joint or a replacement fitted by a LBS.
It has me thinking though that given the choice of the two end caps that I have with one being a plastic one that I've just taken off the bike and the other being the new hooded end cap which is metal & came with the cable kit which one should I use. Feeling the two in comparison to one another to me the new Jagwire metal end cap feels sturdier and seems to be a reasonable fit in the cassette joint and so maybe I should go for that.
I've attached a photo below which shows the old plastic end cap next to a new Jagwire one but I took a photo of the Jagwire standard end cap instead of the hooded version because I couldn't get a good photo of the hooded version whist it's currently on the cable on the bike. However I've also included a photo of the Jagwire box which also show the hooded version of the end cap if the photo comes out large enough.
Also my apologies if this is a very basic/stupid question but when you say having the barrel adjuster fully wound in do you mean so that it is at it's shortest? I just wound it up and down and unless I've just forgotten which way I was winding it (but it is late after a day at work) when I was winding it anti-clockwise it was being would in and the barrel was getting shorter and if I wound it clockwise the barrel would get longer and it was being wound out?
Thanks again for all of the help & advice which is greatly appreciated!
John
- Attachments
-
-