No, they go off immediately.
No delay.
The "delay" is that the standlights stay on for five minutes, not the main lighting.
They have a capacitor in there so that charges up when the lights are on and discharges when the lights go off to keep a dim lighting on.
This happens any time you stop with the lights on, or even any time you turn them off.
The Senso function is completely different and immediate. No delay both on and off. On as you go under tree cover, and off as you come out.
Senso dynamo lights
Re: Senso dynamo lights
Mick F. Cornwall
Re: Senso dynamo lights
Anyway, I don't think there's any sophisticated electronics in there. I suspect either random error or some nuances in the different lighting that unexpectedly sees the sensor receive more light on a cloudy day (when there's less total light, but what light there is is more scattered). Have you performed this test multiple times? Have you gone out with a light meter (having established where the sensor in the lamp is pointing) to check the actual light levels in these conditions?
Re: Senso dynamo lights
No of course not ....... but don't tempt me! 
I too don't think it's very sophisticated in there, and that's what my question is alluding to.
If they are sensitive to come on and off under trees on a sunny day, how do they react at dusk and dawn?
Not tried it in the winter yet.
I too don't think it's very sophisticated in there, and that's what my question is alluding to.
If they are sensitive to come on and off under trees on a sunny day, how do they react at dusk and dawn?
Not tried it in the winter yet.
Mick F. Cornwall
Re: Senso dynamo lights
Well, I stopped using the Senso function in mine as it was uncomfortably dark before it switched on! I now have a different light but haven't tested its Senso function - I just leave the lights on all the time.
I opened the original one up a few weeks ago to look at the first part of the circuit and its overvoltage protection. I didn't look much further but, like Bez, I don't think there is anything especially sophisticated (eg a microcontroller able to number crunch rates of change etc.) in there.
As well as the "memory effect" described by Airporter, CdS cells also have a spectral response that might affect performance under different lighting conditions. Probably not significant in this application, but response times vary depending upon lighting levels:
https://www.sunrom.com/get/443700
I opened the original one up a few weeks ago to look at the first part of the circuit and its overvoltage protection. I didn't look much further but, like Bez, I don't think there is anything especially sophisticated (eg a microcontroller able to number crunch rates of change etc.) in there.
As well as the "memory effect" described by Airporter, CdS cells also have a spectral response that might affect performance under different lighting conditions. Probably not significant in this application, but response times vary depending upon lighting levels:
https://www.sunrom.com/get/443700
Re: Senso dynamo lights
I doubt it will be a CdS sensor - they are likely to be banned, or at least restricted, as containing cadmium.
"The use of CdS and CdSe[3] photoresistors is severely restricted in Europe due to the RoHS ban on cadmium"
They are also relatively large, and the light sensor on an Edelux is a pretty small window in the base of the switch ring groove (where it gets covered over when the switch is set to "on").
I'd guess it will be a phototransistor or a photodiode, and that the driving electronics are set to turn on with either a sudden drop in light levels (as when entering a tunnel), or with a low lux value.
Mine's pretty conservative; the lights are on all day in winter if it's cloudy.
"The use of CdS and CdSe[3] photoresistors is severely restricted in Europe due to the RoHS ban on cadmium"
They are also relatively large, and the light sensor on an Edelux is a pretty small window in the base of the switch ring groove (where it gets covered over when the switch is set to "on").
I'd guess it will be a phototransistor or a photodiode, and that the driving electronics are set to turn on with either a sudden drop in light levels (as when entering a tunnel), or with a low lux value.
Mine's pretty conservative; the lights are on all day in winter if it's cloudy.
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Airsporter1st
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Re: Senso dynamo lights
Mick F wrote:No, they go off immediately.
No delay.
The "delay" is that the standlights stay on for five minutes, not the main lighting.
They have a capacitor in there so that charges up when the lights are on and discharges when the lights go off to keep a dim lighting on.
This happens any time you stop with the lights on, or even any time you turn them off.
The Senso function is completely different and immediate. No delay both on and off. On as you go under tree cover, and off as you come out.
Understood, but when you said:
"Seems daft to come out of tree cover in the full summer sunshine and still have the lights on for five minutes whilst riding along."
- I took it to mean that the lights were full on.
Re: Senso dynamo lights
Sorry, I should have been clearer about that. 
I'm going to have to have a ride at dusk or dawn to see what happens. It'll have to wait until the autumn.
I'm going to have to have a ride at dusk or dawn to see what happens. It'll have to wait until the autumn.
Mick F. Cornwall
Re: Senso dynamo lights
It will be the simplest possible setup.
LDR, opamp, capacitor (to ‘debounce’)
Measuring absolute light levels isn’t something the eye is very good at. I’d expect the space under trees to be brighter on a cloudy day than a sunny one (since the light from the sky is more diffuse), not just ‘less dark compared with outside’ - at least for short distances of tree cover...
LDR, opamp, capacitor (to ‘debounce’)
Measuring absolute light levels isn’t something the eye is very good at. I’d expect the space under trees to be brighter on a cloudy day than a sunny one (since the light from the sky is more diffuse), not just ‘less dark compared with outside’ - at least for short distances of tree cover...
A shortcut has to be a challenge, otherwise it would just be the way. No situation is so dire that panic cannot make it worse.
There are two kinds of people in this world: those can extrapolate from incomplete data.
There are two kinds of people in this world: those can extrapolate from incomplete data.
Re: Senso dynamo lights
I doubt it will be a CdS sensor - they are likely to be banned, or at least restricted, as containing cadmium.
"The use of CdS and CdSe[3] photoresistors is severely restricted in Europe due to the RoHS ban on cadmium"
They are also relatively large, and the light sensor on an Edelux is a pretty small window in the base of the switch ring groove
That's interesting - and something I hadn't really thought about. I've just checked on Farnell and Rapidonline, and several of the LDRs they list are conventional CdS cells, so they are still widely available despite the restrictions.
I'm not familiar with the Edulux, but I have taken apart a B&M Cyo and as far as I can remember the sensor looked like an LDR, albeit a small one. You can get them down to about 4mm diameter - is the Edelux one smaller than this?
https://www.rapidonline.com/pdf/58-0128.pdf
http://www.farnell.com/datasheets/77395.pdf?_ga=2.225771282.983909926.1530787696-992477630.1511526596
Re: Senso dynamo lights
I rode out at 06:00 the other morning, and the lights were on.
Broad daylight, but long shadows with bright early-morning sunshine.
Out on the open road, the lights were initially still on, but eventually went off by 07:30 unless I went through shadows where they came on again.
I noticed that none of the commuter traffic had their lights on, and if I'd have been driving, my lights wouldn't have been on either. Had I not had dynamo lights on the bike, I wouldn't have fitted my battery lights as there was no need for them ..................... but the senso function on my Edelux thought there was a need.
I reckon that the senso function is too sensitive, but it doesn't really matter I suppose, because I'd much rather have the error on the sensitive side than the insensitive.
Yet to try riding towards dusk.
Broad daylight, but long shadows with bright early-morning sunshine.
Out on the open road, the lights were initially still on, but eventually went off by 07:30 unless I went through shadows where they came on again.
I noticed that none of the commuter traffic had their lights on, and if I'd have been driving, my lights wouldn't have been on either. Had I not had dynamo lights on the bike, I wouldn't have fitted my battery lights as there was no need for them ..................... but the senso function on my Edelux thought there was a need.
I reckon that the senso function is too sensitive, but it doesn't really matter I suppose, because I'd much rather have the error on the sensitive side than the insensitive.
Yet to try riding towards dusk.
Mick F. Cornwall
Re: Senso dynamo lights
I reckon that the senso function is too sensitive, but it doesn't really matter I suppose, because I'd much rather have the error on the sensitive side than the insensitive.
Me too.
As mentioned above, mine (a B&M Cyo) came on far too late - well after I would have switched them on manually. That is partly what led me to leave it switched on all of the time.
Re: Senso dynamo lights
Dusk rides will have to wait a few months yet.
I don't fancy going out riding after 9pm - I'm often going to bed about then. I'm a very early riser. 05:00 usually.
I don't fancy going out riding after 9pm - I'm often going to bed about then. I'm a very early riser. 05:00 usually.
Mick F. Cornwall
Re: Senso dynamo lights
robc02 wrote:I reckon that the senso function is too sensitive, but it doesn't really matter I suppose, because I'd much rather have the error on the sensitive side than the insensitive.
Me too.
As mentioned above, mine (a B&M Cyo) came on far too late - well after I would have switched them on manually. That is partly what led me to leave it switched on all of the time.
Yes I agree, the senso function on my Edelux 2 is on most of the time. I just turn on or off as required. Shame you can’t adjust the sensitivity,
Re: Senso dynamo lights
Having been riding with the light on Senso for quite some time now, I'm beginning to like it.
I reckon it's perfect.
Our Yaris has an auto light function but it's not as sensitive as it should be IMHO.
I reckon it's perfect.
Our Yaris has an auto light function but it's not as sensitive as it should be IMHO.
Mick F. Cornwall
Re: Senso dynamo lights
In good bright daylight I have mine switched off. I don't want the daylight running lights on for no good reason, providing a tiny but pointless bit of drag. Senso on mine means "be seen by" lights for daylight, or "see by" lights to light up dark roads. The only way to get the light to go off completely is to switch the thing off completely. Which I do.
To be honest I could live without Senso and not miss it.
To be honest I could live without Senso and not miss it.