Genesis Vagabond

For discussions about bikes and equipment.
kwackers
Posts: 13702
Joined: 4 Jun 2008, 9:29pm
Location: Warrington

Re: Genesis Vagabond

Postby kwackers » 27 Sep 2018, 6:07pm

Bez wrote:I forgot to mention, my BB7s are the MTN version.

And if a 36 hole Deore 6-bolt front hub, without skewer, is any use to you I can chuck one in the box for free; I bought a couple because they were cheaper than the skewers :)

Cheers Bez that would be great!

hoppy58
Posts: 214
Joined: 9 Mar 2011, 3:07pm

Re: Genesis Vagabond

Postby hoppy58 » 27 Sep 2018, 9:31pm

I've had a Vagabond for about 18 months. I bought a stock 2017 model and originally bought it because I wanted a 'one-bike-does-all'. I bought a second pair of wheels (spa hand-built - the front with a dyno hub), and fitted a pair of Vittoria Hyper 35s.

The original wheels were fitted with 2.1 kenda small blocks which are good for mixed off-road/rough country lanes, but are a bit draggy for smooth tarmac - whilst the hypers are great for tarmac/ gentle off road, but obviously not ideal for gnarly stuff.

In the end I couldn't do with the faff of swapping wheelsets (and adjusting the brake calipers each time!), so I bought a longitude frameset which I built up for off road only and I now use the Vagabond for road and mild off-road/rough lanes....which it excels at.

I find that the Vagabond climbs really, really well and descends with real confidence. Its not particularly fast, but is fine once up to speed and it ploughs through rough surfaces. I find that there is a bit of toe-overlap, but it's not bad and after a while you just adjust your riding to avoid it. The other thing I've noticed is that when the bars are set at the lowest setting then they can strike the top tube, albeit this doesn't happen during normal steering.

If I was building from scratch now, I think I'd consider using Schwalbe G-one tyres as they are reputedly fast, light and reasonably good for moderate off road. If you want to go bigger than 2.1s, there's loads of room at the front, but it's a bit tight at the rear, due to the front mech. If you run a 1x set up, you could go a bit bigger if you want.

I think the avid BB7s are a better choice than the stock TRP spyres, (although mine are better since fitting swissstop organic front pads and Nukeproof semi metallic rears.)

I fitted some SKS commuter guards and these fit nicely with a bit of fiddling and creativity.

[ImageIMG_5800 by hop58, on Flickr*]

[ImageIMG_5798 by hop58, on Flickr*]
Cheers.
Last edited by hoppy58 on 28 Sep 2018, 9:38am, edited 1 time in total.

LuckyLuke
Posts: 224
Joined: 10 Jun 2010, 11:54am

Re: Genesis Vagabond

Postby LuckyLuke » 28 Sep 2018, 12:34am

fossala wrote:
reohn2 wrote:
fossala wrote:I've used compass tyres in the past. I think they are worth the extra.


As with anything in cycling, put your money where you feel there is a noticeable advantage. For me that is tyres, handlebars and saddle.


+1

Hi folks, I use / have used Compass tyres on road in the following flavours:
700 X 28 (on a 531 1960s frame).
700 X 38 (on a Surly LHT & Cross-check).
700 X 44 (on an LHT).
I really like them. Fast, grippy, comfortable, good feedback. Probably one of the best upgrades out there?
I'm happy to stay with 8 & 9 spd & average spec elsewhere and prioritize spending on tyres.
Sorry R2, I've no experience off road. I've toured with the fatter versions though, & commuted on them on the LHT without too much bother (IIRC one rear puncture over 2-3 months).
For reference, I usually commute & have toured on Paselas, which are great, but the Compass tyres feel noticeably nicer.
I also use / have used Grand Bois tyres, which have very similar properties & qualities.
Downsides of the Compass tyres are the cost, & the 700 X 28s were absolute b*ggers to fit on Chrina rims.

Best wishes,

Luke

PeterBL
Posts: 166
Joined: 26 Oct 2010, 1:04pm

Re: Genesis Vagabond

Postby PeterBL » 28 Sep 2018, 9:26am

Regarding disc size, I recently changed to 180mm from 160mm on a set of Road BB7's. Braking has improved. Not night and day, but definitely better. The fork needs to have clearance for it.

reohn2
Posts: 36291
Joined: 26 Jun 2009, 8:21pm

Re: Genesis Vagabond

Postby reohn2 » 29 Sep 2018, 10:34am

Double post .
Last edited by reohn2 on 29 Sep 2018, 10:37am, edited 1 time in total.
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I cycle therefore I am.

reohn2
Posts: 36291
Joined: 26 Jun 2009, 8:21pm

Re: Genesis Vagabond

Postby reohn2 » 29 Sep 2018, 10:36am

Hoppy58
Thanks for the write up,nice bike BTW :) ,
Vagabond is pretty much what I expected really other than the toe overlap,I've ordered the large frame size which has a 593mm ETT length so if my calcs are right even with 2inch tyres it shouldn't be a problem.I've a pair of nearly new folding bead 2inch Marathon Supremes coming from Bez of this parish,which according to Schwalbe's usual sizing :?,measure up on the small side,probably around 47 x 47mm.

I already have a Longitude,which I really enjoy riding the real MTB singletrack and rough trails,and a Salsa Vaya for road and milder rough stuff,if I'm honest the Vagabond is a bit of a indulgence,an itch I can't help but scratch :) with bigger rubber than the Vaya(which runs exclusively on 40mm Hypers),I'll see how it performs on the Supremes first but I haven't ruled out shaving the knobbles off a pair of 2.1inch folding Conti X Kings :D .I looks like an interesting project whatever I end up with :D

Lucky Luke
We've discussed Grand Bois/Compass tyres before elsewhere and whilst I'm intrigued by their Antilope Pass they're about £20 a tyre too much of an indulgence for the kind of punishment I might give them,but thanks for the input :) .
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I cycle therefore I am.

reohn2
Posts: 36291
Joined: 26 Jun 2009, 8:21pm

Re: Genesis Vagabond

Postby reohn2 » 29 Sep 2018, 10:41am

PeterBL wrote:Regarding disc size, I recently changed to 180mm from 160mm on a set of Road BB7's. Braking has improved. Not night and day, but definitely better. The fork needs to have clearance for it.

I've never felt a 160mm BB7 front brake lacking in performance and can lock it up if I try hard enough,IMO a 180mm rotor is overkill for a solo,tandems are a different story where 203mm rotors are needed for stop on a sixpence braking
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I cycle therefore I am.

Bonefishblues
Posts: 6851
Joined: 7 Jul 2014, 9:45pm
Location: Near Bicester Oxon

Re: Genesis Vagabond

Postby Bonefishblues » 29 Sep 2018, 10:44am

Is there a downside to overkill, as it were, providing modulation is unaffected?

reohn2
Posts: 36291
Joined: 26 Jun 2009, 8:21pm

Re: Genesis Vagabond

Postby reohn2 » 29 Sep 2018, 11:18am

Bonefishblues wrote:Is there a downside to overkill, as it were, providing modulation is unaffected?

If I can lock up a BB7 with a 160mm rotor,a 180 rotor will more likely lock up with less effort at the lever.
As I posted we had 203mm rotors and BB7's on the Cannondale tandem which were very effective with an all up weight of 170kg+.
I've also posted elsewhere on a couple of other threads that BB7's and V's are about the same in the dry(with BB7's having more modulation at slow speeds),in wet conditions it's a different story where BB7's give the same performance as in the dry,IMO a more effective brake ie,BB7/180mm would be overkill especially in an ES situation.I'm going to refrain from claiming that combination to be a dangerous one as anyone familiar with that combination would be used to it's extra power but I maintain a 160mm rotor up front is big enough for even a loaded solo.
If I were to change anything on my BB7 equipped bikes it would be to trial a 140mm rotor on the rear(though I have to confess I've never tried it the thought has crossed my mind more than once),as the 160 is easily locked up on a greasy or wet road or on loose gravelly surfaces.
That's OK as I'm aware of it,as I posted above about a 180 up front a rider gets used to what they ride,but a leettle less power on the rear can be a good thing IMO.

PS,I can see the potential of where this post might lead due to posts on other threads by others.
My answer would be that I'm ready to answer any questions :wink:
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I cycle therefore I am.

Grarea
Posts: 340
Joined: 18 Jan 2017, 9:03am
Location: Truro (ish)

Re: Genesis Vagabond

Postby Grarea » 29 Sep 2018, 7:03pm

These look great.

Has anyone tried using it just as a road bike?
What is it like?

Or did I skip a post somewhere?

reohn2
Posts: 36291
Joined: 26 Jun 2009, 8:21pm

Re: Genesis Vagabond

Postby reohn2 » 30 Sep 2018, 8:31pm

Grarea wrote:These look great.

Has anyone tried using it just as a road bike?
What is it like?

Or did I skip a post somewhere?

On paper it seems like it would make a good all road tourer,it weighs 12.5kg according to Genesis website so it's no lightweight.
But I should think set up like Hoppy's with 40mm Hypers or Grand Bois tyres it could be a good day ride,with much wider capabilities than an out and out road bike.
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I cycle therefore I am.

hoppy58
Posts: 214
Joined: 9 Mar 2011, 3:07pm

Re: Genesis Vagabond

Postby hoppy58 » 1 Oct 2018, 12:02pm

It is great for day rides but its no 'racer'. It depends what you want. I sold my lighweight road bike, because I didn't really do it justice - I'm no racing whippet, I'm a plodder and I like to keep my ar*e dry on a wet day, hence mudguards. I also like to keep off busy roads, so usually end up on minor roads and lanes, which by their nature, are usually badly surfaced and not much fun on skinny tyres!

reohn2
Posts: 36291
Joined: 26 Jun 2009, 8:21pm

Re: Genesis Vagabond

Postby reohn2 » 5 Oct 2018, 11:00am

I built up the Vagabond on the whole with parts I had in stock,didn't realise I had so much stuff 'til I started digging :shock: :oops:
The main thing was to get some really low gearing with no need for anything high as the old fart pedalling it doesn't go fast these days :?
I made up a custom 14,16,17,19,21,23,26,30,34 9sp cassette,a S/light Impact 175mm chainset with 24/39t chainring combination fitted in the two inner ring positions and a chainguard made by grinding the teeth of an old 46t c/ring in the outer position, all adds up to an ultra low 19inch to 73inch range with nice progression in the cruising range.
I hit a problem with the standard 115mm s/t BB i usually use for this chainset due to the chainstays being so wide near the BB to accommodate the wide 2.1inch tyres the bike is capable of taking so had to fit a 121.5mm UN55 BB which helped with the chainline in the most used gears,and the Q factor hasn't suffered too much from the extra 6.5mm(3.25mm either side) BB axle length.
Front mech is a little used 7sp RSX one I had in the 'box',chosen for it's low band fitting that'll give a leettle more room behind the seatube with the biggest knobblie tyres if and when I fit them.Rear mech is a 9sp Deore M591.These are operated with barend levers in Kelly Take offs.Chain is Sram 971.
Wheels are XT M756 hubs laced into 36 hole DRC ST19 rims,sapim DB spokes with Sapim Strong on the driveside,these were originally spare wheels I built for my Salsa Vaya but spent more time hung up than ridden,Halo hexbolt skewers hold them in the frame
Tyres presently are 700x50 Marathon Supremes bought lightly used from Bez of this parish.
Brakes are the venerable BB7 MTN operated by Tekto RL520's
Rest of the cycle parts are:- Turbomatic2 saddle,Easton EA50 seatpost,Ritchie compact drop handlebars,black bar tape with FiziK gel pads underneath.
That completes the build presently.
The frameset is the usual high quality Taiwanese built affair that comes with a very high quality high gloss finish adorned with IMO some really nice subtle graphics,headset,a few Ahead spacers and seatpost collar included and a little bottle of touch up paint.
This is a heavy duty allroad tourer with large diameter CroMo steel tubeset relaxed geometry,long chainstays and a lowish BB with a rather agricultural looking front fork.
I've only done a 20mile shake down ride so far but it's already given a solid stable feel about it riding no hands on a gravel track isnt a proble with the relaxed steering :) .It's billed as a "monstercross" bike in the Genesis blurb,which is a fair description IMO,I can think of a couple of Surly bikes it'll give a run for there money the Disc Trucker for one and Ogre for another.
The bike isn't light and my build weighs 14kg :shock: ,but feels lighter riding it.
I'd say it's a keeper with a lot going for it :)

That's it for now,I'll update when I've put some more miles on it particularly off road,and I'll try and get some photos up too,watch this space

Edited for Typos
Last edited by reohn2 on 5 Oct 2018, 11:21am, edited 4 times in total.
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I cycle therefore I am.

Bonefishblues
Posts: 6851
Joined: 7 Jul 2014, 9:45pm
Location: Near Bicester Oxon

Re: Genesis Vagabond

Postby Bonefishblues » 5 Oct 2018, 11:04am

Top gearing, Grommit! (seriously, I like that range)

reohn2
Posts: 36291
Joined: 26 Jun 2009, 8:21pm

Re: Genesis Vagabond

Postby reohn2 » 5 Oct 2018, 11:24am

Bonefishblues wrote:Top gearing, Grommit! (seriously, I like that range)

Glad you like,this being no flying machine and I'd spin out top gear at around 20mph,which is about where I let gravity take over these days :D
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I cycle therefore I am.