Ergo /Shimano

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bigjim
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Ergo /Shimano

Postby bigjim » 14 Nov 2018, 2:31pm

Will Campag Veloce 10 speed shifters work with a Shimano Cassette and rear mech? Also are they triple compatabel?
Anybody?
Thanks.
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garygkn
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Re: Ergo /Shimano

Postby garygkn » 14 Nov 2018, 3:21pm

I think 10 speed Campagnolo shifters work with 8 speed Shimano casettes. From memory I believe the pull required is equal on both systems. However SJSC may sell a JTek mod to enable 10 speed Campag to pull 10 speed Shimano. A real expert with experience in these matters is just around the corner.

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garygkn
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Re: Ergo /Shimano

Postby garygkn » 14 Nov 2018, 3:23pm

Yes the shifters a compatible with triples as far as I am aware.

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bigjim
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Re: Ergo /Shimano

Postby bigjim » 14 Nov 2018, 3:33pm

I've somehow ended up with my son's Ribble Sportive. But it has gears for the racing snake son. Not the old heavy bull father. My box of bits has yielded a 10 speed 36 cassette. Looking good, until I see that it has a Campag rear wheel and cassette. I've got a set of R500 wheels so intend to fit them and a long cage shimano rear mech. But before I do the work I'm wondering about compatibility.
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mmcnay
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Re: Ergo /Shimano

Postby mmcnay » 14 Nov 2018, 4:43pm

I have a Hewitt Cheviot with 3/9 Shimano chainset and sprocket and 10 speed Veloce levers. The front mech is xt and works very well. The Veloce front levers are trimmable. The rear needs the cable inserted into the mech in a special way. See this site for an image.
https://www.cxmagazine.com/shimano-camp ... patibility
Shimano 9 speed and 10 speed has the same spacing AFAIK, so it should also work fine for a ten speed.
(Hewitt sent me the link above when I couldn't index my rear mech. It now works nicely.)

Brucey
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Re: Ergo /Shimano

Postby Brucey » 14 Nov 2018, 4:46pm

campag shifters + shimano rear mech + 8s cassette is a workable system

campag shifters + shimano rear mech + 10s cassette is not a workable system.

shimano 9s and 10s do not have the same spacing

cheers
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Nigel
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Re: Ergo /Shimano

Postby Nigel » 14 Nov 2018, 4:52pm

10 speed Campag works with 8 speed Shimano rear derailleur and cassette - 13to26 in my case, long cage LX derailleur from the "9 or 10 speed" era of Shimano stuff. Everything connected "normally" and the cable pulls all work out.
Campag front is a mixed thing - older Ergo's (approximately pre 2007) have about 9 clicks over their travel and will move most front mechanisms of any maker over a triple. I have an ancient (1990 or earlier) Suntour X1 front mech, shifting a 24-36-48 triple. I understand that newer Ergos are a bit mixed in what works and what doesn't.

Or, as others have said, there are various devices to alter cable pull to allow different combinations.


I need to study the 9 speed idea from mmcnay - might offer an improved gear range over my existing 8 speed option.

PH
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Re: Ergo /Shimano

Postby PH » 14 Nov 2018, 5:02pm

Nigel wrote: I understand that newer Ergos are a bit mixed in what works and what doesn't.

yes - and they're not all triple
Or, as others have said, there are various devices to alter cable pull to allow different combinations.

I'm using one of the Shiftmates though for something different Campag 9 ergo/Shimano 9 mech & cass, it works better than when it was all campag.
I need to study the 9 speed idea from mmcnay - might offer an improved gear range over my existing 8 speed option

I used this on my Hewitt for a decade without issue, it was a favorite with CJ, highlighted in cycle magazine and on the CTC website.

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cycleruk
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Re: Ergo /Shimano

Postby cycleruk » 14 Nov 2018, 8:29pm

Recently looked at this web' page:-
https://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Bicycles/ ... Dimensions

From the tables it appears that the latest Tiagra (4700) 10 speed rear mech' has the same cable pull as 10 speed Campag'.
Campag' cable pull = 2.8mmm and 4700 also = 2.8mm.

So 2 points -
4700 STI should operate Shimano 8 speed (also 2.8mm) and obviously minus a couple of clicks.
Campag' 10 speed Ergo's should match a 4700 rear mech' on a Shimano 10 cassette..

Certainly 10 speed Ergos operate Shimano 8 speed as I have had that previously.
Personally I do prefer Campag' Ergo's, and if I can get a cheap 4700 mech', I will give it a try.

With this Shimergo set up you should be able to get upto a 34T with reasonable price cassette using the 4700 RD. :)

(P.S. Anyone got a cheap 4700 RD? ) :wink:
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Brucey
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Re: Ergo /Shimano

Postby Brucey » 14 Nov 2018, 8:54pm

RD4700 has the same pull ratio as current 11s shimano 'road' RDs. The nominal pull ratios are very close indeed but different RDs have a (differently) non-linear movement vs cable pull and that is designed into the shifter to match the RD.

On bench tests it was very close, but tests I carried out recently showed that the combination of campag shifters, shimano 11s (or 4700) RD, and shimano 10s cassette isn't quite going to work. Best suggestion is to use CS-HG500-10 (with all ten sprockets splined and no carrier) and make up special cassette spacers for this combination, so that the (several) mismatches are not going to cause problems.

cheers
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bigjim
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Re: Ergo /Shimano

Postby bigjim » 14 Nov 2018, 10:24pm

Thanks for all the advice. looks like I will be putting this bike up for sale as the gearing is far too high and to make it suitable for me means virtually stripping the bike and rebuilding it as a Shimano compatible steed. The wheels are Campag so I would already be changing them for the Shimano cassette. It has taught me to stay away from campag in the future. :(
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Brucey
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Re: Ergo /Shimano

Postby Brucey » 14 Nov 2018, 11:16pm

cheap way out is maybe to get a campag triple chainset and to fit that....?

cheers
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mattsccm
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Re: Ergo /Shimano

Postby mattsccm » 15 Nov 2018, 7:28am

If you a looking for really low gears then the Campag cassette is the issue. They don't go as low as Shimano.
The Ergos might be triple compatble. I have one set that are and one that are not. Check.

steady eddy
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Re: Ergo /Shimano

Postby steady eddy » 15 Nov 2018, 11:43am

!0 speed Campag shifters work very well with 9 speed Shimano Deore mech if you do the cable re route you will find on the Sheldon Brown web site. You just put the cable in the clamp a bit differently - nothing complicated and I can photograph mine if it will help.
I found them a bit reluctant to operate a tiagra triple front mech so use a campg mech to work at the front - the length of the lever arm on the Shimano front mech is less than the campag one. Others have managed to get some Shimano front mechs to work ok.

De Sisti
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Re: Ergo /Shimano

Postby De Sisti » 17 Nov 2018, 11:45am

Brucey wrote:campag shifters + shimano rear mech + 8s cassette is a workable system
campag shifters + shimano rear mech + 10s cassette is not a workable system.
shimano 9s and 10s do not have the same spacing
cheers

Campag 10 ergo levers + Campag 9/10 rear mech + Shimano 9s hub/cassette = works very well :idea:

I use this combination on my three bikes to good effect.