fixed frame with big clearances

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mig
Posts: 2062
Joined: 19 Oct 2011, 9:39pm

fixed frame with big clearances

Postby mig » 30 Jan 2019, 10:51am

i can only just run 'guards and 35c or '37c' continental contacts on a pompino frame under mudguards i use so am thinking possibly to get a different frame (if not silly money.)

required are - track ends, mudguard eyes,rear brake mounting, good clearance for guards and ,say, 40c tyres. that's about it i think.

does this beast exist?

tatanab
Posts: 3777
Joined: 8 Feb 2007, 12:37pm

Re: fixed frame with big clearances

Postby tatanab » 30 Jan 2019, 11:35am

Brand new - I don't know. Second hand it is easy. You get an old road/track frame made up until something like 1980. These frames had track ends and clearance for 27" wheels and mudguards so should cope easily with 700c and large tyres - in the fork crown and brake bridge at least, although it might be tight between the chainstays at the bottom bracket. A frame such as the Claud Butler Olympic Sprint or Freddie Grubb equivalent, both made by the Holdsworthy company is what I had in those days (a genuine Claud from the 1950s would be too expensive and a real collector's item), a frame as in this complete bike on ebay https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Claud-Butler ... ctupt=true

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Vetus Ossa
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Re: fixed frame with big clearances

Postby Vetus Ossa » 30 Jan 2019, 11:56am

tatanab wrote:Brand new - I don't know. Second hand it is easy. You get an old road/track frame made up until something like 1980. These frames had track ends and clearance for 27" wheels and mudguards so should cope easily with 700c and large tyres - in the fork crown and brake bridge at least, although it might be tight between the chainstays at the bottom bracket. A frame such as the Claud Butler Olympic Sprint or Freddie Grubb equivalent, both made by the Holdsworthy company is what I had in those days (a genuine Claud from the 1950s would be too expensive and a real collector's item), a frame as in this complete bike on ebay https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Claud-Butler ... ctupt=true


Now that is a vey nice looking bike, I only wish I could justify buying it.

Brucey
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Re: fixed frame with big clearances

Postby Brucey » 30 Jan 2019, 12:38pm

I would suggest that you maybe get yourself a steel-framed hybrid (eg a ridgeback) and have someone weld/braze different dropouts into the back of it. You might want to reduce the spacing of the frame down from 135mm at the same time.

I agree with the comment above about older touring/lightweight frames; most of them were designed for 27 x 1-1/4" tyres and (literally) won't accept even a 35mm tyre between the chainstays without there being an unacceptably small clearance. Old CBs are nearly always like this.

The extra chainstay clearance for tyres in a hybrid frame does not always come without cost though; not all such frames will let you fit a decent sized chainring at the correct (track) chainline; you may have to run non-standard chainline which means non-standard hubs/wheel dishing etc too. One way you can try to overcome this is to run a double chainset (with a slightly longer axle than normal) and have the chainring in the inner position. This avoids the spider arms of a track chainset clouting the chainstays, but does nothing if the ring itself is interfering, obviously.

BTW if you are planning to run a rear brake then it makes sense to have sloping slotted dropouts (i.e. with the slots perpendicular to the seat stays) rather than track ends. [edit; I wrote chainstays before...duh... :roll: ]

A modern alternative which will work with frames that have VDOs is to use a White industries 'eno' hub. However I worry that if you are a really strong rider, it simply won't stay put reliably. If you are prepared to faff about with chainrings that differ by 1T, half-links etc you can make a VDO-equipped frame work with fixed, provided you can file the dropouts etc to give 1/8" of axle movement.

I suspect that here must be an OTP frame roughly of the sort you are after because I have seen 'factory' fixed gear wheels with wide (~24mm internal) rims on them; even so 40mm tyres and mudguard clearances is a big ask...

cheers
Last edited by Brucey on 30 Jan 2019, 4:27pm, edited 1 time in total.
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seph
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Joined: 3 Sep 2010, 8:22pm

Re: fixed frame with big clearances

Postby seph » 30 Jan 2019, 12:39pm

I think you may struggle with clearances for 700x40 in an old 27’’ frame, especially with guards too...

Surly cross check? https://www.tritoncycles.co.uk/frames-f ... gIQg_D_BwE
Not track ends, but horizontal dropouts, and and an explicit claim to run 40x700 tyres with guards.
Heavily built though I think.

Not sure how much clearance on a genesis day one https://www.cyclist.co.uk/reviews/4183/ ... ike-review, worth a look.

On a different tack.. https://www.charliethebikemonger.com/wh ... 1366-p.asp (I know it is sold out here) one of these built up and fitted to any frame with enough clearance. Verticladropouts make wheel removal with guards simpler too.

But more fun (and cost!) than any of these, go and chat with https://leecoopercycles.webs.com/, http://www.daveyatescycles.co.uk/ , Mercian etal...

slowster
Posts: 984
Joined: 7 Jul 2017, 10:37am

Re: fixed frame with big clearances

Postby slowster » 30 Jan 2019, 1:47pm

The Pompino is a fairly heavy frame and fork with relatively wide diameter tubing, a wishbone seatstay configuration, and I suspect relatively thick wall tubes. So while it is quite robust, I don't think it is a particularly nice frame to ride or very comfortable. If the reason you want to be able to use larger tyres is for comfort on the road, as opposed to improving the off-road performance of the bike, then I suspect that you do not need larger tyres, rather you need a better (lighter, more comfortable) frame with tyres no wider than you are already using.

If you want something relatively inexpensive and off the shelf, as opposed to custom or waiting for something to turn up on Ebay, I suspect that you would find the Kona Paddy Wagon to be a much better frame. It would limit you to ~28mm tyres, but personally I would rather ride a Paddy Wagon with 28mm tyres than a Pompino with any width tyres.

fastpedaller
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Re: fixed frame with big clearances

Postby fastpedaller » 30 Jan 2019, 2:13pm

Hmm - some interesting comments. I have a 'Version 4' Pompino (non-wishbone stays) and I have to say it doesn't feel particularly unwieldy, and in fact I prefer it to my Spa Tourer. I've had much lighter bikes in the past as well, but the Pompino is a pleasure to ride. I've just measured it out of curiosity and it measures 49mm between the chainstays at the tyre. I'm running Vittorias which are marked as 32mm, but actually measure 30mm. With a 40mm tyre (actual) there should still be (just) over 4 mm clearance both sides of the tyre - I certainly wouldn't want to go closer than that myself. The chainstays have some flattening on both sides (and a bit extra on the outside of RH for chainwheel clearance). The chainline I have is about 3mm off ideal for a villiers fixed sprocket, but is nicely in line with my current Sturmy Archer (they are in fact ok) single freewheel, so I think as has been said above, getting the chainline with a single speed and clearing a very wide tyre is nigh-on impossible.

alexnharvey
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Joined: 10 Jan 2014, 8:39am

Re: fixed frame with big clearances

Postby alexnharvey » 30 Jan 2019, 2:15pm

My day one (2014 I think) came with 700cx35 marathons as standard and mudguards fit fairly well around them although the clearance is not huge, maybe 10mm.
Might be tight and just barely fit with 40mm tyres at a guess.

rotavator
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Location: North Wales

Re: fixed frame with big clearances

Postby rotavator » 30 Jan 2019, 5:20pm


zenitb
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Surly Cross Check ?

Postby zenitb » 30 Jan 2019, 5:34pm

Surly Cross Check is maybe another option (with rim brakes) ?

https://surlybikes.com/bikes/cross_check

"...Tyre Clearance: Fatties Fit Fine (FFF) stays and our beautiful slope-crowned custom fork provide room for tyres up to 700c x 42mm, or about 700c x 40mm with mudguards. Largest possible tyre size depends on tyre, rims, axle location in the dropouts, and other factors.."

https://www.tritoncycles.co.uk/frames-f ... 017-p18362

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fossala
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Re: fixed frame with big clearances

Postby fossala » 30 Jan 2019, 9:10pm

I have a fixed Specialized tricross. Has 40mm with guards, guessing it could fit 42mm without too much hassle.

ElCani
Posts: 158
Joined: 5 Mar 2015, 11:24am

Re: fixed frame with big clearances

Postby ElCani » 30 Jan 2019, 9:51pm

I have both a Cross Check and a Day One (2014). The CC will do what you want, no problem (although you you might struggle if you want to use mini-V brakes). The DO won’t - on mine 35c Vittoria Hypers and SKS longboards are marginal.

mig
Posts: 2062
Joined: 19 Oct 2011, 9:39pm

Re: fixed frame with big clearances

Postby mig » 30 Jan 2019, 9:56pm

hmmmm...yeah. cotic would do but £499 for the frame for a commuter? i remember the specialised singlecross but i'd think they're rare to find now.

i'll have a think. ta muchly all round. i thought it would be tricky.

Brucey
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Joined: 4 Jan 2012, 6:25pm

Re: fixed frame with big clearances

Postby Brucey » 31 Jan 2019, 2:25am

mad thought; if you fit a set of 650B wheels to an existing 700C frameset you may get a bike that rides the way you want. A hub brake at the front will be uber-reliable and will fit pretty much any frameset. A pair of wheels, if bought well, ought to be cheaper than a new frameset....?

FWIW 650B wheels with the correct size tyres (unsurprisingly given that the perfidious French pinched the 26x1-1/2" size when they dreamt up their 650B standard) are 26" diameter. 700x25 wheels are about 26.5" diameter, so changing wheels would drop the BB about 1/4" or so.

The fat part of a 26 x 1-1/2" tyre sits at about the same position as a 622 rim does, and there is a little more room between the chainstays at this point.

cheers
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mig
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Joined: 19 Oct 2011, 9:39pm

Re: fixed frame with big clearances

Postby mig » 31 Jan 2019, 11:06am

ok so number 1 is....what are you doing up at that time? :shock:

i was hoping to run a small stash existing 700c winter tyres with good clearances so, whilst i see what you say is an option, i want to use these up.

i don't find the pompino a bad ride by any means. big, heavy tyres don't make anything sprightly as observed. i just plod away on it and await the spring when the lighter kit can come out. it always feels so different on that day !

maybe i'll just stick with it and see what happens long term.