Thread size on Sturmey Archer Toggle?

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Mick F
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Thread size on Sturmey Archer Toggle?

Postby Mick F » 19 Feb 2019, 4:48pm

What is the thread size on a SA toggle adjustment screw?

When I remove the wheel, I have to undo the sleeve-screw to remove it from the toggle chain. There's a knurled locknut of course that locks it in position after adjustment.

My thoughts are that if all you want to do is remove and replace the wheel, you shouldn't have to go through an adjustment procedure. Why not just unscrew the sleeve and leave a double locknut at the exact position required.

I need a nut screwed on the toggle to lock the lock-nut in position, so the sleeve screws tight against them.

What thread is it?
I can't seem to find a nut in my bits and bobs tin that fits.
Mick F. Cornwall

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Re: Thread size on Sturmey Archer Toggle?

Postby rjb » 19 Feb 2019, 5:01pm

Can you be certain that the wheel goes back in in an identical position such that the toggle chain won't require adjustment. ?
You could use thread lock on the locking knurled nut if you are.
Thread is possibly ba but someone will know. Salvage a spare one from your RSW. :wink:
At the last count:- Focus Variado, Peugeot 531 pro, Dawes Discovery Tandem, 2 Dawes Kingpins, Raleigh 20, Falcon K2 MTB dropped bar tourer, On One Pompino, Longstaff trike conversion on a Falcon corsa. :D

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Mick F
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Re: Thread size on Sturmey Archer Toggle?

Postby Mick F » 19 Feb 2019, 5:13pm

Yes, I can be positive it goes back in in the same position. The wheel goes right back into the dropouts as far as it will go.
Thread-lock is an idea I suppose.
Much prefer a lock-nut for the lock-nut. I can't be the only one who wants one.



I considered "borrowing" from the RSW, but I have this idea of giving it away to the cycling museum in Wales. It would be better if it remained completely complete.
I don't need the bike, so they can have it and Mrs Mick F and me can have a weekend away.
http://www.cyclemuseum.org.uk
Mick F. Cornwall

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Re: Thread size on Sturmey Archer Toggle?

Postby Brucey » 19 Feb 2019, 5:40pm

IIRC it is a 'fairly special' thread, not easily found. If you buy a spare control rod (which you will probably need anyway at some point) you will get a another one.

BTW your mudguard fitment is made considerably worse whenever you decide to slide the wheel into the back of the dropouts.

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Re: Thread size on Sturmey Archer Toggle?

Postby robc02 » 19 Feb 2019, 6:59pm

SA used to make a quick release cable connection. The first photo below shows the bit attached to the indicator. The other part has the usual threaded adjuster but is joined to the indicator with a spring clip. The complete assembly is shown in the second photo.
They work very well but are quite difficult to find. It probably wouldn't be that difficult to make something similar.

Image

Image

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Mick F
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Re: Thread size on Sturmey Archer Toggle?

Postby Mick F » 19 Feb 2019, 7:13pm

That's a clever idea.
Just a hook system. Not beyond the wit of man (or me) to sort that idea.

Lock-nut would be better though. If the thread is a strange one .......... there might be something I could screw on.
Mick F. Cornwall

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Re: Thread size on Sturmey Archer Toggle?

Postby Brucey » 21 Feb 2019, 7:20am

FWIW the thread appears to be 1/8" x 40tpi. This is a standard dimension in the whitworth thread form.

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Re: Thread size on Sturmey Archer Toggle?

Postby Mick F » 24 Feb 2019, 7:07am

How's this then! :D
SA Toggle.jpg

Patrickpioneer came up trumps and sent me THREE nuts.

Absolutely excellent.
Thank you Patrick.
A member on here gave me an old dawes horizon frame to make into my going to the supermarket bike, so in a very very small way this is pay back time, ie no postage wanted
the nuts are not the exact thread size but they do work OK, they are from my radio spares box some sort of BA size.
have fun with your nuts
Patrick
Mick F. Cornwall

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Re: Thread size on Sturmey Archer Toggle?

Postby Patrickpioneer » 25 Feb 2019, 5:46am

there's posh for you then :D

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Mick F
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Re: Thread size on Sturmey Archer Toggle?

Postby Mick F » 25 Feb 2019, 2:58pm

Patrickpioneer wrote:there's posh for you then :D
How's this for posh? :D
(Moulton outside upside down of course)
IMG_0105.jpg


4BA spanner fits the nut perfectly. I used a small pair of pliers to hold the knurled nut and locked the hex nut onto it.
Highly recommended system, and I don't know why SA don't do this as standard.
Mick F. Cornwall

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Re: Thread size on Sturmey Archer Toggle?

Postby Patrickpioneer » 25 Feb 2019, 3:21pm

see, all those years of taking apart old radio junk has finally paid off! I now have an excuse to collect more junk!
never throw anything away before keeping the nuts, bolts and screws. I remember as a young dude all older men had sheds full of tins of screws and nails but not anymore they do, or am I now the 'old man' with the tins of junk?
oh dear :o

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Mick F
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Re: Thread size on Sturmey Archer Toggle?

Postby Mick F » 6 Mar 2019, 4:02pm

Mick F wrote:Highly recommended system, and I don't know why SA don't do this as standard.
Over the past few days, I've had the back wheel in and out maybe a dozen times due to fettling the rear alu mudguard and getting it spot on.
Honestly, maybe a dozen times in and out. Surprised I haven't worn out the track nuts! :lol:

Having the lock nut on the thread has locked the knurled lock nut solidly in place and the in and out regime is easy peasy and quick and simple. No adjustments necessary at all, once it is set correctly.

HIGHLY RECOMMENDED to have a lock nut on there. :D

Why don't they come as a standard item?
Mick F. Cornwall

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Re: Thread size on Sturmey Archer Toggle?

Postby Brucey » 6 Mar 2019, 8:01pm

If it works for you it works for you, but in fairness a locknut eats into the available range of adjustment, plus on most SA installations the cable runs along the chainstay and the chain is tensioned via rear wheel position; the wheel never quite goes back in the same place twice and neither does the gear adjustment.

The old QD toggle arrangement was viable when the gear control was commonly routed down the seat stay and the dropouts had angled slots in them which were practically orthogonal to the gear cable; the wheel could go back in a different place and it wouldn't affect gear adjustment.

If you do want to put the wheel back in the same place with the same adjustment, it isn't difficult; you just leave the locknut in the same place each time; a mark on the locknut gives you a reference point. Note also that this connection occasionally loosens in service; however tightening the locknut against a static barrel gives a more secure connection than tightening the barrel against a static locknut.

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Mick F
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Re: Thread size on Sturmey Archer Toggle?

Postby Mick F » 7 Mar 2019, 7:38am

You may be correct looking at if from your experience, but I can assure you that in my experience, it's faultless and perfect.
The wheel WILL ALWAYS go back in the same position.
No adjustment is ever necessary. Once set in the correct position - that's it.
Mick F. Cornwall

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Re: Thread size on Sturmey Archer Toggle?

Postby Patrickpioneer » 7 Mar 2019, 1:57pm

Mick I hope your nuts always stay the same and never move, if they do its a very bad complaint
Pat