Opinions - 531c frame okay for loaded touring?

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pwa
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Re: Opinions - 531c frame okay for loaded touring?

Postby pwa » 4 Jul 2019, 10:19am

To be honest it sounds like a lot of trouble to go to to get an old frame to accept a wheel size it was never intended to take.

reohn2
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Re: Opinions - 531c frame okay for loaded touring?

Postby reohn2 » 4 Jul 2019, 10:22am

pwa wrote:To be honest it sounds like a lot of trouble to go to to get an old frame to accept a wheel size it was never intended to take.

+1
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pwa
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Re: Opinions - 531c frame okay for loaded touring?

Postby pwa » 4 Jul 2019, 10:34am

Even if canti bosses could be safely brazed on, 531c seat stays would surely spread when you applied the brakes, making the brakes mushy.

Brucey
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Re: Opinions - 531c frame okay for loaded touring?

Postby Brucey » 4 Jul 2019, 10:37am

one of the reasons for suggesting hub brakes is that the resultant wheels can be made to fit almost any frame, whereas buying brakes for and/or having conversion work done on the frame is shelling out on a frame that might yet turn out to be fundamentally unsatisfactory in some way.

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bigjim
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Re: Opinions - 531c frame okay for loaded touring?

Postby bigjim » 4 Jul 2019, 11:01am

I wouldn't tour on that frame. I wouldn't want to damage it. Touring takes it's toll. Scratches, dents etc. Especially if you are flying with the bike. Bike prices are on the floor at the moment so it should be easy to pick up a decent frame for peanuts. Galaxies are not fetching much. Then there is aluminium frames if one worries about flex though at 12 stones I can't see it being an issue. I've toured on aluminium and steel and not noticed any problems with either and I'm close to 15 stone and 6'2". Raleigh Clubmans are cheap enough and the fork and rear stays are Chromo not 531 which I think makes for a stronger frame. I've toured on mine but will be selling that one shortly, but it's a big frame.
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slowster
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Re: Opinions - 531c frame okay for loaded touring?

Postby slowster » 4 Jul 2019, 11:05am

I understand the desire to restore an old frame and give it a new lease of life. To extend the useful life of what is a good quality frame is commendable.

I can also understand the desire to use an old bike or frame in the way it might have been used 30 or more years ago, making it serve for touring, rough stuff riding, racing, commuting and everything in between.

What I don't understand and cannot sympathise with is taking a nice frame like a 531 Record Ace and rather than restore it, b*$$£%ing about with it by trying to fit modern parts which it was never intended to take, and more importantly was not designed for.

I expect the bike would give a very nice comfortable ride with the wheels for which the frame was designed, i.e. relatively narrow high pressures, and would make a very nice lightweight tourer with a saddlebag or a modern seatpack and half frame bag. At a push I'm sure it could also take a rack and panniers, but it would probably be best to take advantage of modern lightweight kit to keep the luggage weight down, and the compact nature of that kit makes it much more viable nowadays to just use a saddlebag.

However, when you start to plan to fit 650B wheels, braze on cantilevers or ridiculously long drop/flexy BMX brakes, in order to ride it heavily loaded off road, then I think you have lost your sense of perspective. I'm sure that what you are thinking of is achievable, but by the time you have finished you will have lost the opportunity to enjoy the experience of riding a nice 531 road frame, and you will probably have spent a lot of money, time and effort to get something which will still be less suitable for the task than a bike which you could buy off the shelf for the same amount or less (or second hand for even less money).

mig
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Re: Opinions - 531c frame okay for loaded touring?

Postby mig » 4 Jul 2019, 11:24am

i like 531 frames. i think they do the job in most cases.

however do frames of a certain vintage inevitably decline over time even if well cared for? do the tube joints become sloppy? or is this a case of build quality?

Salade_Lyonnaise
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Re: Opinions - 531c frame okay for loaded touring?

Postby Salade_Lyonnaise » 4 Jul 2019, 11:36am

slowster wrote: ...However, when you start to plan to fit 650B wheels, braze on cantilevers or ridiculously long drop/flexy BMX brakes, in order to ride it heavily loaded off road, then I think you have lost your sense of perspective...


Haha - yes I think you're right, a cool dose of perspective. However, all this work and a new coat still comes under the price of an off the shelf frameset.

AM7
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Re: Opinions - 531c frame okay for loaded touring?

Postby AM7 » 4 Jul 2019, 8:13pm

Salade_Lyonnaise wrote:Re: Brakes - The only options are calipers made for BMX or cruisers, or to braze on canti bosses...so, yes,


What about drum brakes. I’ve fitted Sturmey drum brakes to my 1984 531c Raleigh Classic 15 (which I believe has a pretty much identical frame to the 80s Record Ace) and they work just fine.

Salade_Lyonnaise
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Re: Opinions - 531c frame okay for loaded touring?

Postby Salade_Lyonnaise » 4 Jul 2019, 9:44pm

AM7 wrote:
Salade_Lyonnaise wrote:Re: Brakes - The only options are calipers made for BMX or cruisers, or to braze on canti bosses...so, yes,


What about drum brakes. I’ve fitted Sturmey drum brakes to my 1984 531c Raleigh Classic 15 (which I believe has a pretty much identical frame to the 80s Record Ace) and they work just fine.


worth considering - is it both hubs?

pwa
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Re: Opinions - 531c frame okay for loaded touring?

Postby pwa » 5 Jul 2019, 9:17am

My only reservation about the Sturmley hub brake solution, which does seem to tick some boxes for this frame, is that I wonder if you could get nice low gears. Maybe that doesn't matter to you, but any bike I take on any tour will have gears well below 30".

Brucey
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Re: Opinions - 531c frame okay for loaded touring?

Postby Brucey » 5 Jul 2019, 11:36am

pwa wrote:My only reservation about the Sturmley hub brake solution, which does seem to tick some boxes for this frame, is that I wonder if you could get nice low gears. Maybe that doesn't matter to you, but any bike I take on any tour will have gears well below 30".


eh?

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same choice as any other cassette hub more or less.

cheers
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pwa
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Re: Opinions - 531c frame okay for loaded touring?

Postby pwa » 5 Jul 2019, 11:45am

Brucey wrote:
pwa wrote:My only reservation about the Sturmley hub brake solution, which does seem to tick some boxes for this frame, is that I wonder if you could get nice low gears. Maybe that doesn't matter to you, but any bike I take on any tour will have gears well below 30".


eh?

Image

same choice as any other cassette hub more or less.

cheers

Ah, I see. I was thinking the Sturmley would be hub gears only. All now becomes clear.

Salade_Lyonnaise
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Re: Opinions - 531c frame okay for loaded touring?

Postby Salade_Lyonnaise » 5 Jul 2019, 3:08pm

Brucey wrote:
pwa wrote:My only reservation about the Sturmley hub brake solution, which does seem to tick some boxes for this frame, is that I wonder if you could get nice low gears. Maybe that doesn't matter to you, but any bike I take on any tour will have gears well below 30".


eh?

Image

same choice as any other cassette hub more or less.

cheers


Intriguing Brucey. Do you know what kind of levers these use, are they higher ratio than canti/caliper?

Brucey
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Re: Opinions - 531c frame okay for loaded touring?

Postby Brucey » 5 Jul 2019, 4:20pm

IME these brakes work best with high MA levers (about 4:1) that are meant for single pivot side pulls and cantis. They also work well with levers meant for first generation DP calipers. NSSLR levers (eg most new shimano STI models 2008 onwards) will work but the brakes are liable to be a little 'wooden' in feel. I have seen these brakes fitted with Vee-brake levers but IMHO this is a pretty bad arrangement.

Word of warning; these brakes last a long time but the flip side is that they take a long time to bed in; up to a year and half (even in daily use), in flat terrain.

cheers
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