How tight should a qr skewer be?

[gregoryoftours]

A hub bearing should be set with a little play in the bearing such that it gets taken out when the qr skewer is properly tightened. Can a skewer (internal cam so greater force) be easily over tightened on a hub that is set up maybe just a little too loose, and if so could it lead to the axle slightly bowing under the force of compression, and therefore cause premature wear to the hub internals? I say this because sometimes I have not quite taken all of the play out of a bearing and compensated by tightening the skewer a bit more than usual, which does remove the remaining play. Or I've done it in situations where I don't have access to the tools to properly adjust the hub.

[gregoryoftours]

On a related note most manufacturers advise to adjust the skewer so that it starts to provide resistance when the lever is stuck straight out in line with the axle. This makes for an incredibly high clamping force on an internal cam skewer and on an external cam will totally mangle the plastic bushing in very short order. It's always struck me as being bad advice. For firm palm pressure required to fully close the skewer normally something like 70° to 75° lever angle biting point from the fully closed position would seem to me to be more correct.

[hamster]

I tihnk that drastic advice is for front wheels to avoid the 'cam-out' problem with disc brakes and poor dropout design on front forks.

[NATURAL ANKLING]

Hi,
The OP has got everything about right for sure.
It has to be remembered that Any force trying to remove the wheel when braking With a disk on the front wheel, is countered by the downward force from the rider and bike When braking.

Due to the difference in cross-sectional area of the skewer which is just five millimetres, less at core of thread, Compared with the cross-sectional area of the axle spindle and the fact that the force is relatively uniform, i.e. The pull is through the centre of the axle.
It's also a tube too, So very rigid.
Unlike the forces in braking and rider plus bike which act at a tangent to the bearings which are trying to bend the axel.

[Brucey]

one person's 'palm pressure' will be more or less than another's. For front QR's , anything that is enough to stop the wheel from moving around is arguably 'enough' ; on non-disc brake bikes this is a much lower tension than on machines with disc brakes.

At the rear the same applies really, except that if you have horizontal dropouts the QR needs to be pretty flippin' tight if the wheel is not to pull over. BITD with some (not very grippy) hubs in some (not very grippy) frames, a cheap QR would be at risk of spontaneous failure when the tension was enough to stop the wheel from pulling over.

In the latter case you were in absolutely no doubt about what tension was 'correct'....

cheers

[Marcus Aurelius]

Tighten until there’s no lateral play in the wheel, and there’s no rattling noises when you drop the bike from a slight lift.

[NATURAL ANKLING]

Hi,

Tighten until there’s no lateral play in the wheel, and there’s no rattling noises when you drop the bike from a slight lift.

So lets say you start with very little play in bearings if none?
And apply your method........the rattle...if there is any will disappear when the QR grips the frame just tight enough.....

We all tighten the QR some, to adjust the bearings but if you start with zero play then the QR still needs reasonable force not to move in just normal riding without even talking about stopping.
Though these are commonly talked about in same sentence, but the play and the qr force are to be treated independently for correct play in bearings and safe clamping of axel.

[gregoryoftours]

My question more clearly is this - A larger amount of play than ideal can be taken out by tightening the qr skewer significantly more than would normally be necessary, still to the point where the play just disappears, but are there implications for the hub internals? (it's not great for the skewer itself which is a potential safety issue but not one I'm investigating here).

[Brucey]

A. 'not really'.

The QR will break if you tighten it too much. If you could apply more force the axle could eventually suffer a bucking induced failure mode, but I think you will always be far away from that.

cheers

[pwa]

One factor that stops me overdoing the QR is simply wanting it to be not too stiff if and when I get a puncture at a time when I have cold hands. Maybe i don't do them as tight as some people but I don't find that doing up the QR takes out play. Fine tuning the bearing adjustment does that. It normally takes me three or four goes to get it to a point where there is just a hint of play and I settle for that. I can't say I've noticed my doing up the QR taking out that hint of play.

[gregoryoftours]

A. 'not really'.

The QR will break if you tighten it too much. If you could apply more force the axle could eventually suffer a bucking induced failure mode, but I think you will always be far away from that.

cheers

Ah that is good to know, although of course a properly adjusted hub is always a better idea!

[gregoryoftours]

I can't say I've noticed my doing up the QR has taken out that hint of play.

Do you use internal cam skewers? It's a significantly higher clamping force for the same effort at the lever.

The easiest way of feeling the effect that qr compression has on the bearing preload is to clamp a bare hub with no play but smooth running into a frame or fork, or to take a wheel off the bike, pack the end of the axle with washers and clamp the skewer on them.
It is surprising how little force is needed to make it bind quite significantly

[ElCani]

One factor that stops me overdoing the QR is simply wanting it to be not too stiff if and when I get a puncture at a time when I have cold hands. Maybe i don't do them as tight as some people but I don't find that doing up the QR takes out play. Fine tuning the bearing adjustment does that. It normally takes me three or four goes to get it to a point where there is just a hint of play and I settle for that. I can't say I've noticed my doing up the QR taking out that hint of play.

It definitely does on all my cup and cone-hubbed bikes. Which is all my bikes.

[531colin]

One factor that stops me overdoing the QR is simply wanting it to be not too stiff if and when I get a puncture at a time when I have cold hands. Maybe i don't do them as tight as some people but I don't find that doing up the QR takes out play. Fine tuning the bearing adjustment does that. It normally takes me three or four goes to get it to a point where there is just a hint of play and I settle for that. I can't say I've noticed my doing up the QR taking out that hint of play.

It definitely does on all my cup and cone-hubbed bikes. Which is all my bikes.

All mine too. Also my (only) bike with "sealed bearings".
I don't routinely do my Q/Rs very tight; and I routinely use Q/R pressure variation to fine-tune bearing adjustment (eg between annual greasing)
The exception is the only disc braked bike; the front Q/R is tight on that one.
(all my current bikes have vertical rear dropout and I don't tighten any Q/R enough to risk failure)

[pwa]

One factor that stops me overdoing the QR is simply wanting it to be not too stiff if and when I get a puncture at a time when I have cold hands. Maybe i don't do them as tight as some people but I don't find that doing up the QR takes out play. Fine tuning the bearing adjustment does that. It normally takes me three or four goes to get it to a point where there is just a hint of play and I settle for that. I can't say I've noticed my doing up the QR taking out that hint of play.

It definitely does on all my cup and cone-hubbed bikes. Which is all my bikes.

All mine too. Also my (only) bike with "sealed bearings".
I don't routinely do my Q/Rs very tight; and I routinely use Q/R pressure variation to fine-tune bearing adjustment (eg between annual greasing)
The exception is the only disc braked bike; the front Q/R is tight on that one.
(all my current bikes have vertical rear dropout and I don't tighten any Q/R enough to risk failure)

Interesting. I will have a little play around with QR tightness (within reason) to see if I can induce a difference in play. Just out of interest.