Dawes to stop making the Galaxy due to lack of demand...

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bgnukem
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Re: Dawes to stop making the Galaxy due to lack of demand...

Postby bgnukem » 16 Oct 2020, 11:49am

The utility cyclist wrote:for decades it's been a fat bloater* and not value for money, the name was the only thing keeping it going with people buying it having had one BITD or knowing someone who had one and lusted over it
It wasn't a bad bike as such, just that the competition for people's money had moved on ... a lot and prices for bikes had gone downward for what you could buy whilst Dawes kept knocking out Galaxy's at more than the competition.

Latest 'Ultra' Galaxy is a bog standard Reynolds 520 with Sora 3x9 for £1200, that's right TWELVE HUNDRED :shock: oh and it's even heavier than before at 15kg.

2002 Ridgeback Comet is 12.6kg for a ladies and under13kg for a 56 male variant, that's incl guard/rack and pedals. A standard Galaxy in the 00s was 14.5kg


They seemed to get heavier and more basic after they outsourced frame manufacture. The pricing became uncompetitive and I remember talking to a sales rep. at a bike show years ago and he basically admitted that the far eastern framebuilder had them over a barrel.

Mine's a '94 model (25" / 64cm frame size) and weighs around 27lb/12.3kg, with mudguards but no racks. The later models I test rode felt considerably heavier, albeit with racks and heavier wheels/tyres for touring.

To be fair though people rave about the Surly LHT but that really does feel like an overbuilt bloater. I'd rather have a Genesis Croix de Fer. Hard to find a decent off the peg steel frameset that isn't made of gas pipe (or with horribly stiff forks for disc brakes) these days!

Tangled Metal
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Re: Dawes to stop making the Galaxy due to lack of demand...

Postby Tangled Metal » 16 Oct 2020, 1:19pm

The tour de fer looks good to me, better than a LHT or disc trucker. Surly I once liked but I think they're no longer the same company if that makes sense. I think they've bought into their marketing BS too much as well.

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Sweep
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Re: Dawes to stop making the Galaxy due to lack of demand...

Postby Sweep » 16 Oct 2020, 1:29pm

rogerzilla wrote:Not much choice for Surly in sticking with 9 speed. Shimano's relentless marketing machine means Surly can't buy nice 9 speed kit new. Even basic Deore has gone to 11 and 12 speed. There's also a break in compatibility between 10 and 11 speed, so buying into 10 speed or less puts you on a road to obsolescence and a massive "upgrade" later.

I accept that it is tricky for a manufacturer to stick with the older stuff for the reasons you mention. Though my Ridgeback Expedition is 9 speed - I bought that at the same time as Surly had gone to 10 speed - in fact that was one reason I abandoned the idea of a Surly.
Surely also it isn't written in stone that you need stuff branded Deore for the pretty humble demands of a tourer? In short what's to stop you using bits from "lower down" the Shimano heirarchy?
The whole issue is I suppose yet another reason why it's better for those of us who are able to cobble together our own tourers.
As for being on the road to obsolescence with 9 speed and facing some massive upgrade later, surely it's going to be possible to keep 9 speed running with little trouble for many years yet?
Spa Cycles is still sending 9 speed tourers out the door.
I am quietly confident that I will never have to "upgrade" - or - in my book - downgrade.
Sweep

rmurphy195
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Re: Dawes to stop making the Galaxy due to lack of demand...

Postby rmurphy195 » 16 Oct 2020, 1:39pm

needed to replace mine a few years back. But wanted to see the current version to ensure I liked it. Couldn't find one anywhere in stock around Brum or tr Warwickshire/Worcs/Staffs. One shop offered to order one in, but in answer to the question "But what if I don't like it" the response was "If we order it in special, its yours". Glad I clarified what he was offering. Settled for a Condor instead.
Brompton, Condor Heritage, creaky joints and thinning white (formerly grey) hair
""You know you're getting old when it's easier to ride a bike than to get on and off it" - quote from observant jogger !

simonhill
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Re: Dawes to stop making the Galaxy due to lack of demand...

Postby simonhill » 16 Oct 2020, 1:42pm

I'm a bit amused by the comparisons between the Galaxy and the LHT. I would have thought they were quite different beasts, apart from that the are 'tourers'.

Admittedly the stock LHT was drop bars, when I got mine back in 2012, it was almost the antithesis of the Galaxy. It was a 26" flat bar heavy duty tourer for (surprise, surprise) long haul touring. At that time many on this forum considered the Galaxy or something similar to be the only style of tourer (700 wheels, drops, etc). Bikes like mine were tantamount to heresy.

Much as I loved my Morris 1000s and my Type 2 VW, things have moved on. Not sure I would be buying an LHT now as I do less rough long haul touring, also 26 is less available, but I certainly wouldn't be buying a Galaxy.

The Galaxy is dead, but cycle touring isn't.

rogerzilla
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Re: Dawes to stop making the Galaxy due to lack of demand...

Postby rogerzilla » 16 Oct 2020, 4:21pm

The LHT only used 26" for the smaller sizes, which allows a better frame design. The fall in 26" popularity might give them a bit of a problem. You can make small frames with 700c wheels but they're not right; toe overlap has to be avoided for off-the-peg bikes under BS6102 and this results in crazy angles and high BBs. It's all in Tony Oliver's book.

bgnukem
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Re: Dawes to stop making the Galaxy due to lack of demand...

Postby bgnukem » 16 Oct 2020, 4:23pm

simonhill wrote:I'm a bit amused by the comparisons between the Galaxy and the LHT. I would have thought they were quite different beasts, apart from that the are 'tourers'.

Admittedly the stock LHT was drop bars, when I got mine back in 2012, it was almost the antithesis of the Galaxy. It was a 26" flat bar heavy duty tourer for (surprise, surprise) long haul touring. At that time many on this forum considered the Galaxy or something similar to be the only style of tourer (700 wheels, drops, etc). Bikes like mine were tantamount to heresy.

Much as I loved my Morris 1000s and my Type 2 VW, things have moved on. Not sure I would be buying an LHT now as I do less rough long haul touring, also 26 is less available, but I certainly wouldn't be buying a Galaxy.

The Galaxy is dead, but cycle touring isn't.


Dawes were making 26" wheeled tourers in the form of the Sardar and One Down back in the '90s, alongside the 'conventional' 700c-wheeled Horizon/Galaxy/ Super Galaxy. Obviously St John Street have also been making 26" wheeled utility and touring bikes for 20+ years now.

I've certainly thought the 700C-wheeled Long Haul Trucker was very similar to the original steel Galaxy, drop bars and rim brakes and all. I find their frames overly stiff though, maybe OK if fully loaded but I don't fancy the ride quality riding unladen or with a small bag on the back.

I've got a pair of Disc Trucker forks on my commuter bike (ironically a Dawes One Down frame, Reynolds 631) and find it gives a horribly harsh ride, even with a 26x1.3" tyre inflated to 60psi.

mikeymo
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Re: Dawes to stop making the Galaxy due to lack of demand...

Postby mikeymo » 16 Oct 2020, 5:30pm

rogerzilla wrote:The LHT only used 26" for the smaller sizes, which allows a better frame design.


Current LHT 26" wheels available in 42cm-62cm. I suppose it depends on your definition of "small".

700c version sadly not available in 54cm.

https://surlybikes.com/bikes/long_haul_trucker

whoof
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Re: Dawes to stop making the Galaxy due to lack of demand...

Postby whoof » 16 Oct 2020, 8:52pm

simonhill wrote:I'm a bit amused by the comparisons between the Galaxy and the LHT. I would have thought they were quite different beasts, apart from that the are 'tourers'.
.

I was looking for a tourer in 2003 and considered a Galaxy. The reason I didn't get one as I wanted a bike for carrying lots of stuff, camping and cooking and the Galaxy didn't fit the bill. I made up a 90s mtb into a tourer. In 2018 I bought a second hand Surly LHT and have used it to carry lots of stuff for up to 165 miles. How it rides unloaded is immaterial to me. Similarly I have a folder, all of my non folding bikes ride better, but it folds up and I can take it on a train. If I want to ride without luggage or even lightly loaded I ride a different bike and that certainly isn't going to be a 12.5 plus kg Galaxy.

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horizon
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Re: Dawes to stop making the Galaxy due to lack of demand...

Postby horizon » 16 Oct 2020, 11:15pm

simonhill wrote:I'm a bit amused by the comparisons between the Galaxy and the LHT. I would have thought they were quite different beasts, apart from that the are 'tourers'.



Apparently Surly was established only in 1998 by which time the Galaxy was probably already on the way out. AIUI, Surly soaked up the US market and certainly had a cache here but long after the Galaxy had made a name for itself. The LHT was the first intimation IIRC that the Galaxy no longer had the market (such as it was) to itself.

The other competitor (mentioned above) was the Tricross which allowed people to feel that they could have the whizz of a road bike with the practicality of the tourer. I got the impression at the time (early 2000s?) that the Tricross was being mis-sold to people who really wanted a touring bike but couldn't see one in the shop.

I still don't see the issue with the Galaxy: it was a "fast" but comfortable bike with luggage capacity ideally suited to reasonably long distance overnight touring. That's a niche market (then and now) and easily replaced in part by commuter bikes, road bikes, utility bikes and then MTBs. I bought an 8 speed Super Galaxy in 1998 with racks both ends, MTB gearing, a Brooks saddle and 32 mm tyres: I didn't know how lucky I was as it soaked up the miles on the old A38 loaded with camping equipment. I don't remember being able to compare it with anything else (apart from a Galaxy of course).

Everything the Galaxy could do can now be done better by a slightly more specialised bike: gentle off-road, expedition, fast commuting, load-lugging, audax etc etc. But the sweet spot, the bike that could do almost everything almost effortlessly off-the-peg for a thousand quid still exists. It's just called a Spa tourer (other brands may be available).
When the pestilence strikes from the East, go far and breathe the cold air deeply. Ignore the sage, stay not indoors. Ho Ri Zon 12th Century Chinese philosopher

rogerzilla
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Re: Dawes to stop making the Galaxy due to lack of demand...

Postby rogerzilla » 17 Oct 2020, 8:32am

I don't know about Galaxy weights but my LHT frameset is a couple of ounces lighter than my old 631 Hewitt Cheviot frameset.

Brucey
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Re: Dawes to stop making the Galaxy due to lack of demand...

Postby Brucey » 17 Oct 2020, 10:24am

depends how old it is possibly; IIRC I looked at the LHT fork specification and at some point (about four or five years ago I think) they changed the spec so that if you bought the rim brake fork, you appeared to get a (heavier, stiffer) disc brake fork but with different mounts on it. D'oh!

cheers
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~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~Brucey~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

rogerzilla
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Re: Dawes to stop making the Galaxy due to lack of demand...

Postby rogerzilla » 17 Oct 2020, 11:18am

It's a 2018 model. I suspect the Hewitt was no lightweight.

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al_yrpal
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Re: Dawes to stop making the Galaxy due to lack of demand...

Postby al_yrpal » 17 Oct 2020, 3:06pm

Whats a Galaxy.... basically just a frame with a collection of various Japanese bits bolted on to it. Plenty of alternatives. Guess the angst is all about the name? Hardly anyone will miss it..... especially amongst the young.

Al
Touring on a bicycle is a great way to explore and appreciate the countryside and towns you pass through. Make a difference...

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horizon
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Re: Dawes to stop making the Galaxy due to lack of demand...

Postby horizon » 17 Oct 2020, 5:20pm

al_yrpal wrote: Plenty of alternatives.

Al


Now there are.
When the pestilence strikes from the East, go far and breathe the cold air deeply. Ignore the sage, stay not indoors. Ho Ri Zon 12th Century Chinese philosopher